: Thu Apr 09, 2009 9:32 pm  

Pepe wrote:

Football has a lot more glory hunting types, with little love or understanding of the game, who go to football matches to froth at the mouth and fight with opposing fans in the street. They could never hold an RL Magic type weekend, with thousands fans mingling together. They struggle to keep order with just two teams playing.

Prem Football fans and RL fans are worlds apart.

Used to be the great working class escape, footie. But like anything any good the money men got their hands on it and now season tickets, tv packages are aimed at middle class bandwagoners, who wont be around forever.

I still say it's a more honest sport than the one we're in. It's money obsessed, there are no clubs, they're all businesses, but there is no pretence about that. There is nothing stopping anyone from becoming one of the elite if they've got the right plan and team. But what do we get? Stuck here no matter what we do and greedy nice bloke idiot nice people talking about making some of the biggest most ilustrious names in the game feeder clubs.

: Fri Apr 10, 2009 10:56 am  

Doc Holliday wrote:

Yes, and in Halton they're generally sad sods pretending to have some connection with teams who play in cities at either end of the East Lancs Road.

"My grandad's cousin is from Middleton and our family has watched Man U since 1753, so I'm a Manc our kid. Buzzin'! Sorted!!"

or

"My uncle once had a pint in The Big House la! Yer doin' me 'ead in lad!"

Not too different to the rest of the country then. That’s part of their problem. Whilst the majority of football fans are generally knowledgeable and passionate, many are now attracted to it in order to fit in; a bit like chavs with their Burberry. It’s a high fashion, petty crime sport. The constant hype about the game these days has reduced that sport into something more like Channel 4’s big brother house; a giant goldfish bowl were issues are polarised, for the hard of thinking, Mix that with the passion generated by watching team sports and you’re asking for trouble. It’s not just in this country either. It’s a problem throughout the football world.

I think football’s problem started as far back as the 60’s. Violence and anger is always lurking under the surface of top football games for 5 or 6 decades now, and the authorities have to turn match days, in some areas where prem football is played, into something that resembles an Orwellian police state, with CCTV in and outside the ground, large amounts of stewarding and a huge police presence, with riot control vehicles and horses. Fans have to be separated in order to stop the inevitable violence between fellow human beings who don’t just dislike each other but actually hate one another. They need the smallest issue, which will be played up and polarised by the media, in order to froth at the mouth with hatred of fellow supporters of the game they profess to love.

Yes, they are still a minority, but they are a large minority. They form their own gangs and organise violence between each other. They think this is a perfectly reasonable activity, just like some Widnes RL fans think singling out players and coaches for abuse and humiliation is acceptable. This attitude is creeping into RL now, brought in by fans brought up with the football traditions, who think it is the way to behave at all sporting events. They lack pride in themselves and thus pride in anything else, including the club which represents their area.

: Fri Apr 10, 2009 11:01 am  

Chris Dalton wrote:

Used to be the great working class escape, footie. But like anything any good the money men got their hands on it and now season tickets, tv packages are aimed at middle class bandwagoners, who wont be around forever.

I still say it's a more honest sport than the one we're in. It's money obsessed, there are no clubs, they're all businesses, but there is no pretence about that. There is nothing stopping anyone from becoming one of the elite if they've got the right plan and team. But what do we get? Stuck here no matter what we do and greedy nice bloke idiot nice people talking about making some of the biggest most ilustrious names in the game feeder clubs.

Correct, Chris. The decent Working class fans are sandwiched between the passionless prawn butty munchers and the thick knuckle scrapping chavs.

Football is run more honestly, only because it is a sport very much in the spotlight and followed by millions. RL....... well......isn't, so the RFL can pretty much do what they want, providing they can carry a top few clubs with their own vested interest at heart.

: Fri Apr 10, 2009 11:10 am  

Think there's a bit of an antiquated view of football fans on here. The vast majority of the games pass off peacefully and, although there is granted a large police presence for a lot of games, there is very little policing for twice as many games. Going to a game at Fulham, in RL terms, would be like going to a Batley game - welcoming club, knowledgable home supporters and virtually free reign to roam about the ground. Going to Chelsea on the final day of last season when they were going for the title had the potential for a bit of mither but the fans mixed freely near Fulham Broadway and drank in the same pubs with hardly any police knocking about.

Of course, I'm speaking only from my experience of watching Bolton, and maybe it's different for those who watch Utd, Liverpool etc, but I think the problem that RL clubs face from football fans are the ones who sit in the pub watching Sky, rather than the ones who actually make the effort to support their football team.

: Fri Apr 10, 2009 11:31 am  

Pepe wrote:

Not too different to the rest of the country then. That’s part of their problem. Whilst the majority of football fans are generally knowledgeable and passionate, many are now attracted to it in order to fit in; a bit like chavs with their Burberry. It’s a high fashion, petty crime sport. The constant hype about the game these days has reduced that sport into something more like Channel 4’s big brother house; a giant goldfish bowl were issues are polarised, for the hard of thinking, Mix that with the passion generated by watching team sports and you’re asking for trouble. It’s not just in this country either. It’s a problem throughout the football world.

I think football’s problem started as far back as the 60’s. Violence and anger is always lurking under the surface of top football games for 5 or 6 decades now, and the authorities have to turn match days, in some areas where prem football is played, into something that resembles an Orwellian police state, with CCTV in and outside the ground, large amounts of stewarding and a huge police presence, with riot control vehicles and horses. Fans have to be separated in order to stop the inevitable violence between fellow human beings who don’t just dislike each other but actually hate one another. They need the smallest issue, which will be played up and polarised by the media, in order to froth at the mouth with hatred of fellow supporters of the game they profess to love.

Yes, they are still a minority, but they are a large minority. They form their own gangs and organise violence between each other. They think this is a perfectly reasonable activity, just like some Widnes RL fans think singling out players and coaches for abuse and humiliation is acceptable. This attitude is creeping into RL now, brought in by fans brought up with the football traditions, who think it is the way to behave at all sporting events. They lack pride in themselves and thus pride in anything else, including the club which represents their area.

Aye I suppose you missed two riot vans at the stobart last season for our CC game with Hull FC? And a handful of Hull fans being searched before entering the ground.

: Fri Apr 10, 2009 11:53 am  

moz88 wrote:

Aye I suppose you missed two riot vans at the stobart last season for our CC game with Hull FC? And a handful of Hull fans being searched before entering the ground.

There will have to be a certain level of policing at all large sporting events. I can't understand why they would need to search Hull FC fans though, unless they'd been tipped off about something. To stop them killing each other, football fans require complete segregation at many games. I saw Hull FC and Widnes fans happily mingling before and after that game. Perhaps you missed that?

Most of the problems at Widnes have been caused by a handful of goons at the back, often wearing football shirts. I even heard them singing Everton songs at one Widnes game.

Perhaps that's why the police feel the need to search RL fans these days?

: Fri Apr 10, 2009 11:56 am  

Leyther_Matt wrote:

Think there's a bit of an antiquated view of football fans on here. The vast majority of the games pass off peacefully and, although there is granted a large police presence for a lot of games, there is very little policing for twice as many games. Going to a game at Fulham, in RL terms, would be like going to a Batley game - welcoming club, knowledgeable home supporters and virtually free reign to roam about the ground. Going to Chelsea on the final day of last season when they were going for the title had the potential for a bit of mither but the fans mixed freely near Fulham Broadway and drank in the same pubs with hardly any police knocking about.

Of course, I'm speaking only from my experience of watching Bolton, and maybe it's different for those who watch Utd, Liverpool etc, but I think the problem that RL clubs face from football fans are the ones who sit in the pub watching Sky, rather than the ones who actually make the effort to support their football team.

The point is many top Premiership games have to be controlled with heavy police presence, CCTV etc. This is what keeps the peace. Certain games may require much lower levels of surveillance, as you suggest.

It wasn't so long ago that two Leeds fans were murdered, Arsenal fans stabbed, Man U and Liverpool fans attacked in Italy. There had to be riot police deployed outside Old Trafford a couple of years ago, because of retaliatory threats against Milan supporters. It didn't stop violence breaking out.

The fans that watch Prem football in their locals are generally the ones who, when they do come to an RL game, behave like idiots. This is why we're better off not trying to appeal to them and find new support from elsewhere.

: Sat Apr 11, 2009 10:13 am  

Pepe wrote:

There will have to be a certain level of policing at all large sporting events. I can't understand why they would need to search Hull FC fans though, unless they'd been tipped off about something. To stop them killing each other, football fans require complete segregation at many games. I saw Hull FC and Widnes fans happily mingling before and after that game. Perhaps you missed that?

Most of the problems at Widnes have been caused by a handful of goons at the back, often wearing football shirts. I even heard them singing Everton songs at one Widnes game.

Perhaps that's why the police feel the need to search RL fans these days?

MOZ doesn't miss anything

: Sat Apr 11, 2009 1:05 pm  

Gregory Peck wrote:

MOZ doesn't miss anything

You know him then?


That would explain things.

: Sat Apr 11, 2009 8:19 pm  

Pepe wrote:

You know him then?


That would explain things.

no, no just ardent fan of this individuals comments, seems to be clued up, how do you know it isn't a female?