Re: Ball in hand basics : Thu Apr 28, 2016 9:22 pm  

Trainman wrote:

We could win 100 nil and you would still find something to moan about. Warrington have done to us what we did to Leeds earlier in the season. We got through so much work in the first 20 - 30 mins there wasn't a lot left in the tank. We are still missing Tomkins x2, Manfredi, MM, Flower, Farrell & SOL. It's also Williams' first game for a couple of months so he's a long way of fully fit. Powell looks shot and in desperate need of a rest and we have an academy second rower starting at #6.

We are playing away against top of the league who played very well and got the bounce of the ball too. Just look at the facts and the reality. When we've had somewhere near a few weeks and they are nearing match fitness then I'll judge the side. If we are still playing like this then I'll worry about it.

Winning and losing holds no interest to me. Performance is everything.

If we perform we should rarely lose. If I see a team consistently play below their potential with shocking structures then I will criticise. I have rarely seen Wigan play to their potential in the last 3 years.

Re: Ball in hand basics : Thu Apr 28, 2016 10:54 pm  

I very rarely post on here and I also very rarely criticise Wane but I was completely baffled tonight. We had two stand offs (yes I know it's an old term) in the 17 in Powell and Williams. We interchanged them at hooker during the game but used a under 19'second row as our stand off for all of the game. Surely when Williams came on he should have gone to stand off where he could influence the game more than he was going to do at acting half where he just moved the ball along the line. I am not criticising Gregson but surely an experienced stand off / half back should have played in position even if it meant Gregson filling the hooker position.

[DaveO]

Re: Ball in hand basics : Thu Apr 28, 2016 11:01 pm  

leg_end wrote:

I very rarely post on here and I also very rarely criticise Wane but I was completely baffled tonight. We had two stand offs (yes I know it's an old term) in the 17 in Powell and Williams. We interchanged them at hooker during the game but used a under 19'second row as our stand off for all of the game. Surely when Williams came on he should have gone to stand off where he could influence the game more than he was going to do at acting half where he just moved the ball along the line. I am not criticising Gregson but surely an experienced stand off / half back should have played in position even if it meant Gregson filling the hooker position.

I have been baffled with Williams out why Powell was not moved to six and one of the forwards been used at hooker. Burke would have been my choice. He can pass and has played 13 before so might have made a go of it. Then I am not really surprised. Wane has of making baffling positional choices with players out of position like this.

Re: Ball in hand basics : Thu Apr 28, 2016 11:35 pm  

PurpleCheeseWarrior wrote:

Are you watching the game on sky? If so, did you notice the shot of O'Loughlin, Farrell and the Tomkins brothers sat in the stands? When players like that are all on the field instead of being crocked, that will be the time to judge.

We're taking a battering off wire tonight but in the grand scheme of things it's just 2 points lost.

So to be clear if when we get some players back any improvement will be down exclusively to the players and not to the coach?
To a degree I buy that but it could also infer that the current coach can't improve basic skills of very average players too.
I'm not anti SW but our skill levels for the past season and a half are rank bad.
Anyone even raising modest criticism of the club you ridicule and hold any views contrary to your own with contempt.
Our basic skills are terrible but if you are "tough" nothing else seems to matter. A strange world that disappoints when it should really upset me.

Re: Ball in hand basics : Fri Apr 29, 2016 2:28 am  

I agree with jonh to some extent. We really seem to lack basic skills and game awareness. It was the same last year but I think we are a lot better having played last year, no where. Near as stupid. We lack players with th with skill to open defences. Our centres are athletes who make meters but are unreliable in terms of in game decisions. Our halves don't have passing games, Smith is good
At kicking when given space and Williams can run but we're missing green. Mcilorum is great but doesnt open defenses so when our halves can't pick a pass it tells more that our hooker is all about d. Having. Said all this I'm confident we will be th with best team in the league if we get Sam and lockers fit. There's no way I'm giving up on wane. We'll be top 2 again this year having won 1,lost one in extraordinary circumstances and lost a close one. If we can't score when sams back I'll start to worry

Re: Ball in hand basics : Fri Apr 29, 2016 2:57 am  

There's no doubt having quality players missing makes a big difference, but across SL the number of "first grade" players who don't (or can't) do the basics right is appalling. How does a halfback get into first grade without being able to pass accurately or kick the ball? How does a centre get that far seemingly without knowing how (or wanting) to pass?

TBH it suggests there is some dreadful coaching going on in junior RL.

Re: Ball in hand basics : Fri Apr 29, 2016 7:48 am  

BrisbaneRhino wrote:

There's no doubt having quality players missing makes a big difference, but across SL the number of "first grade" players who don't (or can't) do the basics right is appalling. How does a halfback get into first grade without being able to pass accurately or kick the ball? How does a centre get that far seemingly without knowing how (or wanting) to pass?

TBH it suggests there is some dreadful coaching going on in junior RL.

I think you partially explain it - a large effect for me is the lack of a decent (ie actual) reserve grade whereby players can get game time. Surely it cannot be good situation that when say, Wigan get the majority of their injured players back the ones who have filled in will play exactly where?

I do worry about the future of the game when there is no planned and decent pathway for junior players to develop before being thrown in at SL level. Unless this is sorted out then the basic skill sets (which are poor and last night were certainly missing) will never develop properly.

Re: Ball in hand basics : Fri Apr 29, 2016 10:16 am  

PurpleCheeseWarrior wrote:

Are you watching the game on sky? If so, did you notice the shot of O'Loughlin, Farrell and the Tomkins brothers sat in the stands? When players like that are all on the field instead of being crocked, that will be the time to judge.

We're taking a battering off wire tonight but in the grand scheme of things it's just 2 points lost.

I agree..... Partly. The fact is that professional rugby league players in SL should be able to pass a ball accurately and hit an accurate pass whilst running forward. That includes our squad players and not just our international players.

The O/P is right. Our skill level this season in general is poor. Passes go behind the runner meaning he has to 'check' his run to take the pass far too often. Passes have gone to ground or been thrown straight into touch for too often too.

We will be better when the injured players return but that doesn't mean our back up players should be free from fair criticism.

Re: Ball in hand basics : Fri Apr 29, 2016 9:06 pm  

We'll win the Grand Final.

Stop panicking

Re: Ball in hand basics : Fri Apr 29, 2016 9:23 pm  

21-12 wrote:

We'll win the Grand Final.

Stop panicking

Good lad! We need more positivity rather than the constant moaning.

We'll definitely be there or there abouts when we get some bodies back, but looks like we took a few more bangs last night.