Our Glaring Deficiency V2 : Wed Oct 16, 2019 9:47 pm  

its our inability to bring in good SL players from the youth setup.

you cant say we haven't tried.... when you go through the last 10 years, we have brought alot of players through.

It just never seems to work out for that long.

Cooper, Patton, Philbin, King, Currie..... thats it really isn't it in the current side ... 3 of those are under pressure as well.... wouldn't even like to list the others.

Do we have any lined up that might make a statement this coming season? I thought Thewlis looked very promising for someone so young in the few glimpses we had of him.

Re: Our Glaring Deficiency V2 : Wed Oct 16, 2019 10:19 pm  

Sometimes I think the club shows a lack of faith in younger players, certainly in terms of team selection.

Towards the end of last season I was sick to death of seeing the same squads, same starting 17 making the same mistakes. It was stale, unimaginative and blinkered.

Livett posesses potential but gets farmed out to HKR for months on end. Morgan Smith was told he was a hooker and then sold when it didn't work out. Luis Johnson had a stellar debut then disappears. Moran gets overlooked for Tasi. Mamo replaces Jack Johnson.

When we get an injury in the centres we stick Hughes there. Short in the pack? Stick Atkins there and now people are suggesting Burrell rather than blooding a youngster.

Maybe the lack of opportunity means when our youngsters do get first team action they are undercooked or are treated, and feel, like stopgaps.

Re: Our Glaring Deficiency V2 : Wed Oct 16, 2019 10:41 pm  

I don’t think we have got the appetite or patience to park the monkey for 5 years, to build a G F Winning team on that basis,

We have become so frantic and frenetic and paranoid about the GF that next year has to be our year, “I want it now”

Re: Our Glaring Deficiency V2 : Wed Oct 16, 2019 11:39 pm  

I went to the launch of the Talent Pathway at Warrington the other week. A very basic presentation and explanation of the setup, then asked all the parents to pay £40 for a Warrington shirt with a number on so they could better identify them. I was speaking to one of the coaches there and he explained they are trying to get Warrington up to the standard of the other top category sides and it's a work in progress. They said they had sessions planned for next year in the school holidays and they have a training session every now and again for players they've already identified. All very vague and distant, even for those in already identified as talented.

Meanwhile a week later, Saints had the best kids from the Warrington, Wigan and St Helens areas, plus lads from Cumbria and Leeds down at Cowley, organised into abillity levels, with the top set told they're being looked at for scholarships and to sign for them as they have the best pathway and a proven track record and would take them to Australia on tour.

Warrington seem to be doing the right things, they just need to put a rocket up it and be more aggressive about it. They've got some of the right players earmarked, but from talking to a few parents, they're likely to miss out on most of them.

Re: Our Glaring Deficiency V2 : Thu Oct 17, 2019 12:11 am  

morrisseyisawire wrote:

Sometimes I think the club shows a lack of faith in younger players, certainly in terms of team selection.

Towards the end of last season I was sick to death of seeing the same squads, same starting 17 making the same mistakes. It was stale, unimaginative and blinkered.

Livett posesses potential but gets farmed out to HKR for months on end. Morgan Smith was told he was a hooker and then sold when it didn't work out. Luis Johnson had a stellar debut then disappears. Moran gets overlooked for Tasi. Mamo replaces Jack Johnson.

When we get an injury in the centres we stick Hughes there. Short in the pack? Stick Atkins there and now people are suggesting Burrell rather than blooding a youngster.

Maybe the lack of opportunity means when our youngsters do get first team action they are undercooked or are treated, and feel, like stopgaps.

To the first sentence...don't you think it's because we are so SL starved that we don't have a honeymoon period to dare blood them?
If we were perennial champions like Wigan, we'd have the nerve to lose the odd title and still have faith in the coaching staff.

Re: Our Glaring Deficiency V2 : Thu Oct 17, 2019 7:53 am  

No, RD I don't buy that. Bringing Livett back into the fold last season wpukdn't have been considered a risk and his form @ HKR was good. Instead we persisted with your friend Akuola and J Clark.

Sheer bloody mindedness.

The top teams are always under preasure to win but they manage that and still promote youth. Are you suggesting that we can't have an effective youth policy until the GF monkey is off our back and the preasure off? Hasn't it occurred to you that this is the exact approach iof the last 10 years that has failed and is why we are having the debate?

Re: Our Glaring Deficiency V2 : Thu Oct 17, 2019 8:14 am  

If its a case of lack of opportunity, how many more opportunities would Patton, Toby King, Livett, Morgan Smith, Jack Johnson have got at Wigan or Saints and which players would Wigan/Saints have moved out of the line up to make space for them?

Also while we are on this topic - would we have been better off trading for an experienced halfback when Kevin Brown went down, rather than running with Patton for the whole season?

Re: Our Glaring Deficiency V2 : Thu Oct 17, 2019 8:19 am  

Indeed and if we're going to have an Aussie coach then we need one who is not afraid to drop a fellow countryman. If J Clark performs this season as he did last and doesn't find himself in the reserves then we're in for another poor season in the league.

Re: Our Glaring Deficiency V2 : Thu Oct 17, 2019 8:58 am  

One thing is certain, youth development is the future & not just for Warrington, but for the continuing survival of the game. It may dilute the quality on the pitch at times, but perhaps there should be an agreement between clubs to give more game time at SL level to juniors.
Little Johnny will not be pleased if he does everything he can to get a team place only to find his shirt has been given to an antipodean with a name he can't pronounce ,just to get a quick fix.
Ensuring the future of the game should be more important than bringing in expensive & ,usually, end of career imports.

Re: Our Glaring Deficiency V2 : Thu Oct 17, 2019 9:27 am  

morleys_deckchair wrote:

its our inability to bring in good SL players from the youth setup.

you cant say we haven't tried.... when you go through the last 10 years, we have brought alot of players through.

It just never seems to work out for that long.

Cooper, Patton, Philbin, King, Currie..... thats it really isn't it in the current side ... 3 of those are under pressure as well.... wouldn't even like to list the others.

Do we have any lined up that might make a statement this coming season? I thought Thewlis looked very promising for someone so young in the few glimpses we had of him.

Doesn't seem likely. Dean looked decent on debut and Thewlis held his own. But I'd be amazed if either played next season other than during an emergency injury situation. Mamo and the new kid from Swinton will be ahead of Thewlis and Patton (or a replacement) even Jack Hughes, will get the gig ahead of him.

There seems no other obvious contenders to me (although I dont spend much time studying the U19's to be fair)

The Warrington youth system is a puzzler, I'm sure we invest money in to it. We brought Bastian over from Leeds without much success (He went on to do a brilliant job for Bradford by all accounts on a shoestring) and we recently brought over the guy from Cas who has had success there. We have the England Knights coach in charge of our U19's so we seem to be putting decent people in place. we just get zero results.

Is it the club getting in their way, trying to put structures in place that dont work? Is it just a case that Wigan & Saints have the best reputation so they automatically get the best kids going to them? We seem to have enough kids playing the game in Warrington these days at a junior level to see a better return - but we dont.