Re: Powell OUT : Sun Jul 24, 2022 6:39 pm  

BarbedWire is bang on the money re: Smith. You want to talk about bad apples? The Cullen squad was an insult to professionalism, an open shop of p*** takers.

He inherited far worse problems than Powell did but he unified the dressing room with an arm around the shoulder rather than a slap in the face and the players responded.

Re: Powell OUT : Sun Jul 24, 2022 6:40 pm  

CW8 wrote:

Regarding the 2009 squad that smith inherited, that's far, far better than we have now. They were massively underperforming but very, very talented players. There are some parallels to now for sure in terms of squad and performance.

Looking at it now, I think you're right in terms of squad quality - better in 2009.

What I will say is though, most of that talented 2009 squad weren't stalwarts, it was a relatively fresh squad. Up until now, most of our 'bad apples' have been around for longer than those players, so the entrenched culture within the squad is harder to remove imo.

Another arm round the players type coach has been been mentioned. Price and Smith fall into this category, so maybe the board thought we needed a different type of coach because it hasn't worked too well.

Re: Powell OUT : Sun Jul 24, 2022 6:55 pm  

The elephant in the room is the lack of quality players knocking about. . Apart from Saints & Wigan ,who manage to attract the best available or get the best out of what is available , the rest of the teams are scratching around among mainly average players made up of not much better than reserve grade material or alternatively old stagers who've seen their best days but still have something to offer. The pool of competitive players is too small these days to find hidden gems for everybody & generally what comes from Oz is only here for the money or to get themselves noticed for a better gig back home.

Re: Powell OUT : Sun Jul 24, 2022 6:57 pm  

So who do you say are/were the bad apples Gazwire? Who in the squad was holding us back with their attitude the past 6/7 years?

Re: Powell OUT : Sun Jul 24, 2022 6:58 pm  

Gazwire wrote:

What I will say is though, most of that talented 2009 squad weren't stalwarts, it was a relatively fresh squad. Up until now, most of our 'bad apples' have been around for longer than those players, so the entrenched culture within the squad is harder to remove imo.

The other relevant factor is TS didn't replace Cullen, he replaced Lowes. There may have been some players who had a residual loyalty to Cullen but I doubt many or any had any attachment to Lowes. So when TS came in the reaction was probably positive throughout the squad.

Re: Powell OUT : Sun Jul 24, 2022 7:07 pm  

It’s not really about who had what when, it’s about now. Can a coach get the best out of the group > Yes/No. If no, why? Fix that issue. Can the coach now get the best out of the group > Yes/No.

The issue has been fixed, the apples are good. Can the coach NOW get the best out of the group.

Re: Powell OUT : Sun Jul 24, 2022 7:09 pm  

Barbed Wire wrote:

It’s not really about who had what when, it’s about now. Can a coach get the best out of the group > Yes/No. If no, why? Fix that issue. Can the coach now get the best out of the group > Yes/No.

The issue has been fixed, the apples are good. Can the coach NOW get the best out of the group.

No. The pack is peas poor.

Re: Powell OUT : Sun Jul 24, 2022 7:10 pm  

ninearches wrote:

The elephant in the room is the lack of quality players knocking about. . Apart from Saints & Wigan ,who manage to attract the best available or get the best out of what is available , the rest of the teams are scratching around among mainly average players made up of not much better than reserve grade material or alternatively old stagers who've seen their best days but still have something to offer. The pool of competitive players is too small these days to find hidden gems for everybody & generally what comes from Oz is only here for the money or to get themselves noticed for a better gig back home.

Spot on about the lack of quality players. That's the reason it is IMPERATIVE to employ a damn good coach.

Re: Powell OUT : Sun Jul 24, 2022 7:13 pm  

I think the pack (bar the second row which is the real issue) did a decent job getting us downfield on Friday. That game could’ve been put to bed in the first 15/20 minutes. I found the utter cluelessness in attack mostly through Ratchford’s ponderous hands to be the main problem. Matautia and Holmes were also culpable at stopping dead any semblance of a promising move.

Re: Powell OUT : Sun Jul 24, 2022 7:15 pm  

ratticusfinch wrote:

So who do you say are/were the bad apples Gazwire? Who in the squad was holding us back with their attitude the past 6/7 years?

I don't know for sure tbh. But to have a squad full of either internationals or players who were top/topish at their clubs before signing; for them to be failing in 2 finals against lesser squads on paper; and to be knocked out in 3 1st round encounters to even lesser teams on paper: there is something consistently amiss.

I think the 2009 squad had players enjoying a few too many pints and having a good time. The problem seems to be different with this squad - it's as if they're happy to earn a good wage and reach retirement. I think it's easier to change the first (drinking) culture with some encouragement but harder to ask, in effect, semi-retired players to return to full commitment. I also think that our players, being so long in the tooth, are more stubborn and resistant to change and its been extremely fractious.

It's a really tricky one and well brought up by Barbed Wire.