Re: 2019 | Squad : Wed Sep 05, 2018 12:19 pm  

Sal Paradise wrote:

Wane is fortunate in that Wigan have by far the finest pipeline of talent in SL. He has had to use the youngsters but it really helps if you have the cream of the crop to start with. Leeds used to be in that position until Barrie McDermott and Brian McDermott were involved. Powell is in a similar position in the Cas. is a hotbed for junior rugby - Lock Lane, Panthers, Kippax etc.

Im not Wanes biggest fan but he's chosen to back his youngsters more often than having to. He runs a strict policy if you're underperforming you dont get picked & the next u19 in line gets a shirt.

Re: 2019 | Squad : Wed Sep 05, 2018 12:28 pm  

Bullseye wrote:

Have Leeds seen an increase in number and quality of players coming through since they adopted dual reg?

abolsutely not. Infact we have taken the route people are calling for to be honest, in actually backing far too long players who will never make it, rather than writing them off early. In the case of what we have done, the chances of finding a "late bloomer" were very slim. Had we took the route of actually sending younger with much more potential on the dual reg, then this might have been a different outcome.

Re: 2019 | Squad : Wed Sep 05, 2018 12:30 pm  

thepimp007 wrote:

Thats a very one eyed view. Kids are getting thrown on the proverbial scrap heap at 19 due to nowhere else to go. Without being rude clubs like yours signing all dry and sundry on too doesn't help when you have surplus players to just release. That isn't a slur on the process just a reality. Kids develop at all ages, one massive example of this was one of your greatest players jamie Peacock. James Roby another, never stood out on academy rugby, never a junior international, develops into one of the best hookers SL has ever seen as he had time. Peacock was a Late bloomer and there is a big chance he wouldn't have made it in this day and age.

It shows a lack of respect to championship clubs in my eyes that you can just 'fill the championship', look at where Fev have been last week or so without some of your players they have relied on all season. Like I say not here to argue just an observation of the game not just Leeds. We need a reserve grade in my opinion. Also sorry if it comes across argumentative/trolling certainly isn't meant that way, just healthy debate

Roby made his debut for Saints as a 19 year old not sure that qualifies as a late developer - he played for GB at 21/22.

Featherstone couldn't even field 17 players on Sunday so let's not get on your high horse. I would have thought Leeds letting players go at 19 would be a good for Championship clubs that don't have the ability to fund an academy. Leeds take on 8-10 youngsters a year only 2 max. will make it - that a lot of quality young players - if going through the Leeds academy system hasn't put them off

Re: 2019 | Squad : Wed Sep 05, 2018 12:33 pm  

Sal Paradise wrote:

Wane is fortunate in that Wigan have by far the finest pipeline of talent in SL. He has had to use the youngsters but it really helps if you have the cream of the crop to start with. Leeds used to be in that position until Barrie McDermott and Brian McDermott were involved. Powell is in a similar position in the Cas. is a hotbed for junior rugby - Lock Lane, Panthers, Kippax etc.

I think you might have stated that incorrectly Sal, rather than what you meant. What you have put is wrong, but like I said I don't think intentionally. Leeds did have cream of the crop, and still manage to, but never developed it sufficiently at all. The change of Barrie McDermott first was a step forward in the younger pod, but then Brian from the senior pod just stumped anything anyway.

I am more than confident that had we had someone like Wane or Smith in charge over the McDermott era we would have seen a constant continuance of the conveyor belt of talent. Their is an argument to say would we have still won the trophy's? that is unknown and down to opinion, but the development would certainly have been better.

Re: 2019 | Squad : Wed Sep 05, 2018 12:42 pm  

Gotcha wrote:

I think you might have stated that incorrectly Sal, rather than what you meant. What you have put is wrong, but like I said I don't think intentionally. Leeds did have cream of the crop, and still manage to, but never developed it sufficiently at all. The change of Barrie McDermott first was a step forward in the younger pod, but then Brian from the senior pod just stumped anything anyway.

I am more than confident that had we had someone like Wane or Smith in charge over the McDermott era we would have seen a constant continuance of the conveyor belt of talent. Their is an argument to say would we have still won the trophy's? that is unknown and down to opinion, but the development would certainly have been better.

We must agree to differ - Leeds don't get the quality of youngsters they used or they don't develop - where are the Sinfield's, McGuire's, Chev's, Watkins, Hall of this last 5 years of youth development its Sutcliffe, Keinhorst, Handley, Luke Briscoe etc. The quality of the intake is not at the original level.

Barrie McDermott took the academy backwards this was then compounded by Brian McDermott - either development is poor or intake is poor and you can't polish a turd.

Re: 2019 | Squad : Wed Sep 05, 2018 1:11 pm  

Sal Paradise wrote:

We must agree to differ - Leeds don't get the quality of youngsters they used or they don't develop - where are the Sinfield's, McGuire's, Chev's, Watkins, Hall of this last 5 years of youth development its Sutcliffe, Keinhorst, Handley, Luke Briscoe etc. The quality of the intake is not at the original level.

Barrie McDermott took the academy backwards this was then compounded by Brian McDermott - either development is poor or intake is poor and you can't polish a turd.

We don't agree to differ, you are wrong on the intake of players. I have seen these first hand over the previous six years, and their have been plenty of quality at that level. Better than what Wigan were picking up. It is the development that was the problem, and where in Lancashire they did it so much better.

You seem to be looking at it from the under 19's point of view, i.e. development. On that we are in agreement. Just not on the scholarship side of things, where you are incorrect.

Re: 2019 | Squad : Wed Sep 05, 2018 1:52 pm  

Gotcha wrote:

We don't agree to differ, you are wrong on the intake of players. I have seen these first hand over the previous six years, and their have been plenty of quality at that level. Better than what Wigan were picking up. It is the development that was the problem, and where in Lancashire they did it so much better.

You seem to be looking at it from the under 19's point of view, i.e. development. On that we are in agreement. Just not on the scholarship side of things, where you are incorrect.

Fair enough - Cameron Smith is a prime example I suppose.

I can't believe we haven't had a quality half back in the academy for 15 years but that is the case - that says to me the intake is great because even Leeds couldn't screw that up.

[Bullseye]

Re: 2019 | Squad : Wed Sep 05, 2018 2:06 pm  

Gotcha wrote:

abolsutely not. Infact we have taken the route people are calling for to be honest, in actually backing far too long players who will never make it, rather than writing them off early. In the case of what we have done, the chances of finding a "late bloomer" were very slim. Had we took the route of actually sending younger with much more potential on the dual reg, then this might have been a different outcome.

So you’re saying that some U19 and over age players should’ve been binned off earlier and younger players sent on dual reg?

Re: 2019 | Squad : Wed Sep 05, 2018 2:11 pm  

Sal Paradise wrote:

Roby made his debut for Saints as a 19 year old not sure that qualifies as a late developer - he played for GB at 21/22.

Featherstone couldn't even field 17 players on Sunday so let's not get on your high horse. I would have thought Leeds letting players go at 19 would be a good for Championship clubs that don't have the ability to fund an academy. Leeds take on 8-10 youngsters a year only 2 max. will make it - that a lot of quality young players - if going through the Leeds academy system hasn't put them off

As I repeatedly put wasn't looking for an argument or was being on a high horse. Was just pointing out the facts. How many ex Leeds juniors are filling out the championship now having not made it? We were lucky at Dudley Hill when one of our lads was as Leeds there were top end 40 something in his squad massive rotation until they dropped who they didn't want. A whole lot turn their backs on the game and don't even return to their original amateur clubs.

Yes Fev couldn't field 19, not one of their players were dual reg that have been available all year. Also Leeds took their most prolific player this year so are not all innocent in the situation. I was hoping for a debate on reserves/academies but you obviously took it the wrong way which I repeatedly tried making the comment that it wasn;t the case. It;s good to get other clubs fans opinions on it. Theres no right or wrong with opinion

Re: 2019 | Squad : Wed Sep 05, 2018 2:29 pm  

Bullseye wrote:

So you’re saying that some U19 and over age players should’ve been binned off earlier and younger players sent on dual reg?

Absolutely on the over age. Walters a typical example, never make a star player in his life, but still we continued to persist.

Newman went out this year and starred in the Championship. Should have been left there most of the year. Then you would have had an example of a success of dual reg.