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Re: Biased news reporting : Sat Dec 29, 2012 3:49 pm  
Don't forget as well that Michael Foot who was leader of the Labour party at the time, and the most left wing Labour leader since the war other than Attlee, supported sending the task force to recapture the islands from Galtieri. So if it was just about winning an election for Thatcher, wtf was Foot in on it, trying to win her an election?

It's ironic that a lot of people that now claim we should have left the islands to Galtieri after he used force to invade, criticise Blair for an 'illegal invasion' of Afghanistan and Iraq. Surely if what Blair did was illegal, then Galtieri was illegal too....? What about when Saddam invaded Kuwait in 1990. Was this ok?
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Re: Biased news reporting : Sat Dec 29, 2012 3:56 pm  
sally cinnamon wrote:
So if it was just about winning an election for Thatcher, wtf was Foot in on it, trying to win her an election?


It would have been political suicide not to be seen to "back our boys".
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Re: Biased news reporting : Sat Dec 29, 2012 4:14 pm  
Big Graeme wrote:
It would have been political suicide not to be seen to "back our boys".


I think it went deeper than that with Foot, he was incredibly well respected within his party for being a man of principle even when those within the party didn't agree with his left wing agenda, they at least respected his obstinate stance on his politics - for such a man who throughout his career had been a CND member and outspoken critic of war in all its forms to meekly kow-tow to the Commons overwhelming support for a Task Force to sail to the Falklands is surprising, possibly he had one eye on the opinion polls and held for several weeks the hope that the Americans would broker a deal, but even so...

...such are politics.
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Re: Biased news reporting : Sat Dec 29, 2012 6:42 pm  
What should be remembered is that Argentina invaded a British territory and occupied it by force against the wishes of the islanders. This makes it quite different to Hong Kong etc

Mrs Thatcher did not send the task force because of a forthcoming election. She took a huge risk on her decision to honour a treaty to protect the islanders who considered themselves British. She faced opposition from the USA because they were relying on Argentina to prevent the spread of communism in South America.

That she acted so decisively is great credit to her and sent an important message that Britain would go to war on a principle to defend British people. It was why other people of principal like Michael Foot supported her.
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Re: Biased news reporting : Sat Dec 29, 2012 7:17 pm  
Lord Elpers wrote:
What should be remembered is that Argentina invaded a British territory and occupied it by force against the wishes of the islanders. This makes it quite different to Hong Kong etc

Mrs Thatcher did not send the task force because of a forthcoming election. She took a huge risk on her decision to honour a treaty to protect the islanders who considered themselves British. She faced opposition from the USA because they were relying on Argentina to prevent the spread of communism in South America.

That she acted so decisively is great credit to her and sent an important message that Britain would go to war on a principle to defend British people. It was why other people of principal like Michael Foot supported her.


Conservative party central office couldn't have put it any better...
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Re: Biased news reporting : Sun Dec 30, 2012 3:05 am  
Lord Elpers wrote:
What should be remembered is that Argentina invaded a British territory and occupied it by force against the wishes of the islanders. This makes it quite different to Hong Kong etc

Mrs Thatcher did not send the task force because of a forthcoming election. She took a huge risk on her decision to honour a treaty to protect the islanders who considered themselves British. She faced opposition from the USA because they were relying on Argentina to prevent the spread of communism in South America.

That she acted so decisively is great credit to her and sent an important message that Britain would go to war on a principle to defend British people. It was why other people of principal like Michael Foot supported her.


sounds about right to me
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Re: Biased news reporting : Sun Dec 30, 2012 3:29 am  
Big Graeme wrote:
Conservative party central office couldn't have put it any better...

That chip must ache at times.
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Re: Biased news reporting : Sun Dec 30, 2012 3:52 am  
Lord Elpers wrote:
What should be remembered is that Argentina invaded a British territory and occupied it by force against the wishes of the islanders. This makes it quite different to Hong Kong etc

Mrs Thatcher did not send the task force because of a forthcoming election. She took a huge risk on her decision to honour a treaty to protect the islanders who considered themselves British. She faced opposition from the USA because they were relying on Argentina to prevent the spread of communism in South America.

That she acted so decisively is great credit to her and sent an important message that Britain would go to war on a principle to defend British people. It was why other people of principal like Michael Foot supported her.

Spot on. Hong Kong was a different circumstance entirely.

As for the Falklands, the US government was torn between pro-UK, anti-communism and other factions. But let's not forget, they supported us behind the scenes pretty much from the off and when mediation failed, in public. Reagan always supported the UK but had to pussy around with the various factions within his government until he could declare his unilateral support.

Thatcher actually took a massive risk. There were serious doubts whether we could even win a Falklands war, and whether we should even bother. But let's put it this way. If, as Adrian Mole's father believed, the Falklands were located off the coast of Scotland, fighting back would never be in doubt. However, because those British citizens were located further afield, certain people feel we should abandon them to a country that has no real historical claim to the islands yet is willing to invade and kill over them.

In hindsight, yes it probably won her an election. But at the time? Only an true idiot would honestly believe she said "listen up, if we win this thing, will we win the next election?" especially when the recently released papers say otherwise.

I'm no Thatcher lover, but for me she made the right moves over the Falklands.
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Re: Biased news reporting : Sun Dec 30, 2012 11:03 am  
Cronus wrote:
Spot on. Hong Kong was a different circumstance entirely.

As for the Falklands, the US government was torn between pro-UK, anti-communism and other factions. But let's not forget, they supported us behind the scenes pretty much from the off and when mediation failed, in public. Reagan always supported the UK but had to pussy around with the various factions within his government until he could declare his unilateral support.

Thatcher actually took a massive risk. There were serious doubts whether we could even win a Falklands war, and whether we should even bother. But let's put it this way. If, as Adrian Mole's father believed, the Falklands were located off the coast of Scotland, fighting back would never be in doubt. However, because those British citizens were located further afield, certain people feel we should abandon them to a country that has no real historical claim to the islands yet is willing to invade and kill over them.

In hindsight, yes it probably won her an election. But at the time? Only an true idiot would honestly believe she said "listen up, if we win this thing, will we win the next election?" especially when the recently released papers say otherwise.

I'm no Thatcher lover, but for me she made the right moves over the Falklands.


Apart from allowing them to be invaded in the first place. Then again the argies wouldn't have invaded and Thatcher would have lost the next election, so maybe she did make the right moves.
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Re: Biased news reporting : Sun Dec 30, 2012 11:59 am  
Ovavoo wrote:
Apart from allowing them to be invaded in the first place. Then again the argies wouldn't have invaded and Thatcher would have lost the next election, so maybe she did make the right moves.


Interesting that planned defence cuts in the couple of years prior to the invasion hinted to Argentina that the GB government wouldn't be all that interested in defending the islands, on the other hand you might argue that the main cause of the Argentine invasion was of pure opportunity and of their own country's making, their "diversion from a dire economy" argument is probably very valid.

Which brings us to date - the circumstances and relations between the two country's are totally different these days, but how much do we now spend on defending the Falklands (one of my bro-in-laws has spent some time being stationed on defence duties there, the worst of his military career is how he described it), and going through some severe defence cuts now, just how many Falklands situations exist around the world now and what would be our response today ?
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