Shaw & Cockayne & More : Mon Jun 12, 2017 10:13 am  

Shaw - Why does he keep getting picked. The worst defensive winger I have seen in a long time, positionally awful. Any clued up coach would just attack his side every time. Too weak in out sets too.

Cockayne - Just Why???????? He's like a loaf of bread you've noticed you have had in the cupboard for 2 months. A good servant in its time Way Way past it best.

3 players that I have seen play full back that our in our squad are;
1, Moss -Bulls
2, Wardill - Braves
3, Oakes - Eastmoor (He ripped my sons West Hull team to bits every time he played us at FB)

albeit 2 of them were for amateur teams but bloody hell they bossed it, 1 professionally and was far better than Benny. I'd try any one of them over benny, although I think Wardill has found his niche at SR. Oakes needs more game time and can play Centre, FB or Wing. Give Mossy a shot at FB if needed, he cant be any worse than Benny is ATM.

Keep giving Wardill game time at SR because that boys enthusiasm more than carries him through. Not sure about ZDC yet, needs more time on the pitch.

Ellis seems to be putting way too much weight on and isn't dominating as he should be......

Forwards don't seem to be dominating enough.

Why are we playing granddad Hodgson?

Time for us to start turning the style on me thinks, M8's fast approaching

Re: Shaw & Cockayne & More : Mon Jun 12, 2017 12:42 pm  

Not convinced with Sheens at all. My reasons for this are,

not one player has vastly improved under his stewardship ( with Blair, Greenwood and a few more actually playing poorer).

His constant need to play Shaw when Will Oakes is far better.

Playing David Hodgeson

Picking Dockar Clay, then have him spend 70 mins on an exercise bike.

Playing a 6 at centre, a second row at 6.

Not encouraging offloads in the tackle and playing mostly down the middle with no effect

I honestly think he has not made a shred of difference, with all due respect to the Championship teams, my Grandad could coach a squad like ours to wins, possibly far more convincingly.

Re: Shaw & Cockayne & More : Mon Jun 12, 2017 2:18 pm  

robinrovers10 wrote:

Not convinced with Sheens at all. My reasons for this are,

not one player has vastly improved under his stewardship ( with Blair, Greenwood and a few more actually playing poorer).

I'd say he's brought through the likes of Cator & Wardill, Blair is playing a different role this year and IMO doing it well, Greenwood hasn't been fit most of the year. I think Mulhern has improved massively. Minns looks a better player (when fit) as did Lawler.

His constant need to play Shaw when Will Oakes is far better.

Shaw hasn't been overly bad in a constantly changing back line, Oakes may have been worse but he needs time to develop and TS will see him as will the coaches and feel he's not ready yet

Playing David Hodgeson

We are lacking any form of on the field experience, Lunt and Scruton aside our only other seasoned professional is also a bit of a prat


Picking Dockar Clay, then have him spend 70 mins on an exercise bike.

He changes a game when he comes on, in the games he's started he's looked ineffective, maybe he's better agianst tired defences


Playing a 6 at centre, a second row at 6.
We need to explore options, Ellis and Abdull don't look right, personally I'd look for an option at 7 but maybe that isn't available. Addy has played HB before (I agree I don;t think its a good option though


Not encouraging offloads in the tackle and playing mostly down the middle with no effect
That tactic will more likely bare fruit against better sides, scoring easy tries purely because the oppo is rubbish will give us nothing, we'll need structure to get in front and then trun the screw

I honestly think he has not made a shred of difference, with all due respect to the Championship teams, my Grandad could coach a squad like ours to wins, possibly far more convincingly.
Easy said, he's had to rebuild this squad and his signings look ok, proof will be in the eating but we look a more together unit than we did last year lets see in a few weeks time

I'm not 100% convinced myself but that is a bit harsh. see above why i think so

Re: Shaw & Cockayne & More : Mon Jun 12, 2017 3:08 pm  

Rather than take the player assassination route, I'd prefer to focus on the structure and character of the team, and point immediately to how Rovers of last season would have capitulated going 18-0 down (and 16-0), and the reason why they didn't is because the team has developed a 'core'. This is down to Tim Sheens coaching and mentoring; concentrating on the spine of the team and instilling a togetherness. Time and again this season we have seen the opposition flying out of the blocks and each time the team has overcome. It might be ugly at times but the goal of the league campaign is to win and finish in the top 2. This task is almost complete.

I've mentioned on here how Rovers half backs rarely dominate their opposite numbers and yet, once the team settled, Addy/Ellis did exactly that yesterday. It was a lack of forward domination that kept Oldham in the game, and I will argue it kept Rovers honest, something that can be carried forward into the Mid8s. Another thing about the Addy/Ellis combo was their kicking game which showed experience and direction, something I haven't seen in the Abdull/Ellis partnership. This experience was also reflected in game management. NB this is not an attack on Abdull, but he isn't the loudest of players and Ellis needs such a player barking at him (ie a Brough).

I would argue, in general, the spine of the team has performed with pedigree and cohesion although not firing on all cylinders. The midfield triangle does enough albeit in low gears at times, with the role of full back downgraded due to Quiny's injury. I'm not a Charlie fan in this role but he has covered it as well as could be expected. If Quiny fails to recover for the Mid8s I expect Sheens will bring in a specialist full back.

Areas of real concern are execution and indiscipline. The former can be addressed on the training ground but the latter is problematic, in that many of the penalties are a product of substandard refereeing, and a slide towards wanting to retaliate against the oppositions spoiling/roughhouse tactics. It was pleasing to see Rovers hotheads not headhunting yesterday.

Looking ahead to the Mid8s, the 17 will be vastly different to yesterdays squad. Structurally, Sheens has schooled the squad into his style and the players have bought into it - this is very important. I'm not despondent. Yes, there's room for improvement but we know the improvement is there.

Re: Shaw & Cockayne & More : Mon Jun 12, 2017 4:52 pm  

You and Barham Red have put across a fair opinion, but I am just not convinced in Sheens. I suppose we could have 80 pages of pro's and con's, disagree and agree, but the proof will be come the first game of the middle 8s. I haven't really taken into account the players we still have missing, plus Carney and hopefully 2+ signings and the starting 17 against Oldham could be very different. We are really missing Quinlan and Minns I think. Baring Donaldoson and Marsh, we should have a near fully fit squad to pick from, we need lady luck on our side regarding injuries from now until the 8s, my team would be-

Quinlan
Moss
Minns
Heffernan
Carney
Ellis/Abdull
New Signing
Clark
Lunt
Scruton
Greenwood
Blair/New Signing
Addy/Abdull

ZDC
Mulhern/Johnson
Kavagnah/Jewitt
Lawler

Not as strong as the Leigh team last season in my opinion.

Re: Shaw & Cockayne & More : Mon Jun 12, 2017 7:04 pm  

robinrovers10 wrote:

You and Barham Red have put across a fair opinion, but I am just not convinced in Sheens. I suppose we could have 80 pages of pro's and con's, disagree and agree, but the proof will be come the first game of the middle 8s. I haven't really taken into account the players we still have missing, plus Carney and hopefully 2+ signings and the starting 17 against Oldham could be very different. We are really missing Quinlan and Minns I think. Baring Donaldoson and Marsh, we should have a near fully fit squad to pick from, we need lady luck on our side regarding injuries from now until the 8s, my team would be-

Quinlan
Moss
Minns
Heffernan
Carney
Ellis/Abdull
New Signing
Clark
Lunt
Scruton
Greenwood
Blair/New Signing
Addy/Abdull

ZDC
Mulhern/Johnson
Kavagnah/Jewitt
Lawler

Not as strong as the Leigh team last season in my opinion.

We've already beaten the Leigh team of this year we've performed well against the 2 SL sides the slow starts are maybe down to a bit of complacency knowing your going to eventually wear the opposition down it's given Sheens the luxury of trying different things out like what has already been said last seasons team wouldn't have come back from 18-0 down as was proved in the cup game against Oldham so I think Sheens is doing a good job

Re: Shaw & Cockayne & More : Mon Jun 12, 2017 9:30 pm  

fun time frankie wrote:

We've already beaten the Leigh team of this year we've performed well against the 2 SL sides the slow starts are maybe down to a bit of complacency knowing your going to eventually wear the opposition down it's given Sheens the luxury of trying different things out like what has already been said last seasons team wouldn't have come back from 18-0 down as was proved in the cup game against Oldham so I think Sheens is doing a good job

The team of this season wouldn't come back from those deficits against SL opposition. It's OK doing it against part timers who will inevitably fade but another to do it against teams who train at least as hard as you and who are used to high intensity games week in, week out. I do think how the fixtures in the middle 8's pan out will be critical. You may struggle if you have to play a couple of SL teams back to back with only a 5 day turnaround inbetween

Re: Shaw & Cockayne & More : Mon Jun 12, 2017 9:58 pm  

Jake the Peg wrote:

The team of this season wouldn't come back from those deficits against SL opposition. It's OK doing it against part timers who will inevitably fade but another to do it against teams who train at least as hard as you and who are used to high intensity games week in, week out. I do think how the fixtures in the middle 8's pan out will be critical. You may struggle if you have to play a couple of SL teams back to back with only a 5 day turnaround inbetween

I know what your saying and I would have thought the same if we hadn't played against SL opposition this season it's hard to get yourselves up for some of these games winning without even getting out of second gear and I'd rather cats weren't in the bottom four don't need a trip to France really

Re: Shaw & Cockayne & More : Mon Jun 12, 2017 11:20 pm  

We are far better defensively under Sheens. We have far better tactics. The players respond to his half time talks and have an effective strategy.
Abdul, Lunt, Shaw, Minns have all improved.
He's been badly effected by injury. Quinlan was central to getting the ball to the outside backs. His replacement can't and never could do that.
We have the same record as Leigh in an improved division this year.

Sheens has a fantastic record. We'll be right in the fight come the 8s

Re: Shaw & Cockayne & More : Mon Jun 12, 2017 11:25 pm  

Looks a real contest the 8s.
Two French teams, us, Featherstone, London, Widnes. Away games that will not be easy for anyone.
Don't want Warrington in the 8s. They will finish top beating everyone.