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Re: Academy Prospects Fri Jun 18, 2021 7:52 am  

Dave K. wrote:
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I've seen a few posts from Rovers fans still claiming we only got choosen because of bias, some idiots even claiming that because of two results (Cas under 18's and Rovers under 16's) we shouldn't have been picked. So far this season we have played the following games

Academy 4 games
one under 16's and under 17's game
One college game.

Rovers have played one game against us at under 16's.

Do Rovers even run a under 17's or run a college team?

Maybe just maybe our academy is better run, both presently and historically and were rightly awarded an elite licences if one has to be chosen from the city (Which I think is wrong).

Be intrested to read the thoughts of RBA or other Rovers fans on this.
Re: Academy Prospects Fri Jun 18, 2021 8:14 am  

ccs wrote:
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R.B.A wrote:
Participation in our City is up by over 40% on the back of work done by Hull, Rovers and Hull and District.

A cynic might argue, that it's due, in part, to only one academy in the city creaming off the talent until recently.?
Re: Academy Prospects Fri Jun 18, 2021 9:50 am  
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As I’ve said before, more FC academy graduates have appeared in Rovers first team than there own, over the last few years.

The academy decision was taken after gathering a lot of evidence. We just need to keep doing what we’re doing . There’s a reason we were picked over other clubs.
Re: Academy Prospects Fri Jun 18, 2021 8:14 pm  

User avatarMrs Barista wrote:
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Dave K. wrote:
I've seen a few posts from Rovers fans still claiming we only got choosen because of bias, some idiots even claiming that because of two results (Cas under 18's and Rovers under 16's) we shouldn't have been picked. So far this season we have played the following games

Academy 4 games
one under 16's and under 17's game
One college game.

Rovers have played one game against us at under 16's.

Do Rovers even run a under 17's or run a college team?

Maybe just maybe our academy is better run, both presently and historically and were rightly awarded an elite licences if one has to be chosen from the city (Which I think is wrong).

Be intrested to read the thoughts of RBA or other Rovers fans on this.


Yes I would be too. Our U19s are playing tonight. Would be interesting to see which clubs field sides in which age groups.
Re: Academy Prospects Fri Jun 18, 2021 8:55 pm  

ccs wrote:
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Mrs Barista wrote:
Yes I would be too. Our U19s are playing tonight. Would be interesting to see which clubs field sides in which age groups.

Won 24-16 after being 24-0 up early in the second half.
Re: Academy Prospects Sat Jun 19, 2021 11:58 am  

Dave K. wrote:
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Rovers academy playing, cant even bothered to post teams or regularly updates on social media.
Re: Academy Prospects Sat Jun 19, 2021 2:04 pm  

User avatarMild Rover wrote:
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Dave K. wrote:

Be intrested to read the thoughts of RBA or other Rovers fans on this.


Hello.

I think there are two sides of the process that can be looked at.

Firstly the analysis and the performance/selection criteria. Were these established in advance of the analysis and at least checked by a qualified statistician? The panel consisted of an Air Commodore, Sport England’s strategic lead for talent and performance and four RFL representatives. I’ve just stalked the second of those, Duncan Truswell, on LinkedIn and he has a BS in Economics and Politics, so it isn’t implausible that it was done properly and both he Dean Andrew said they believed the process was robust and rigorous. From the bits and pieces I’ve seen, I’d have some questions I’d like to ask - but maybe it is kinder and a better use of everybody’s time if we move on. My point really is if it was done well, then the second ‘political’ element is easier to support. And it was always going to be a political decision to some degree, inevitably. If they didn’t precisely predefine their criteria or consider weighting across the follow-up period etc., then having a Hull fan chair a panel that denies Rovers a licence (especially when two remained open) looks bad. Which doesn’t necessarily mean it is bad - I’m not questioning anybody’s integrity. I think the panel as a whole was… naive, perhaps? Maybe in not publishing their methods, results and full interpretation, if it was robust, or at least in the somewhat crass messaging and communication.

Weirdly, Rovers academy might ultimately have been saved by shortcomings in the process. It’s not like better analysis would have made our numbers look much better and we may not have met properly defined criteria. Despite the outrage, if the RFL had a proper defence they should have mounted it before resorting to Rimmer’s Random Word Salad in that Sky interview.

Irregular Hoops wrote:
We just need to keep doing what we’re doing.


I initially wrote a sarcastic ‘I hope you do’ type of response to this.

What I really hope is that all clubs reflect a bit more about what is and is not working for them and young local players, then maybe conduct some robust and rigorous analyses of their own with a view to considering some different approaches and testing new ideas. It’s an expensive do running an academy and neither Rovers nor Hull have had fantastic vfm in recent years. Both clubs need to do better - they shouldn’t just be a feel-good thing. I get the symbolism of Rovers’ academy beating Hull’s in these circumstances - but that isn’t the point of it. The success of those groups, as groups, should be judged in 5 to 10 years from now.
'Thus I am tormented by my curiosity and humbled by my ignorance.' from History of an Old Bramin, The New York Mirror (A Weekly Journal Devoted to Literature and the Fine Arts), February 16th 1833.
Re: Academy Prospects Sat Jun 19, 2021 4:56 pm  

User avatarThetalentboy wrote:
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We'll always get the best youngsters been the biggest club

But our academy has been average last few years

Fash, bowden, Lane are average really

Lineham and crooks are the best we've brought through in last 10 years and even they're nowhere near the Horne yeaman Cooke etc level

Shaul is better than Lineham and crooks but is he classed as academy? Given he was signed about 19 from skirlaugh
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Re: Academy Prospects Sun Jun 20, 2021 6:28 am  

Dave K. wrote:
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Thetalentboy wrote:
We'll always get the best youngsters been the biggest club

But our academy has been average last few years

Fash, bowden, Lane are average really

Lineham and crooks are the best we've brought through in last 10 years and even they're nowhere near the Horne yeaman Cooke etc level

Shaul is better than Lineham and crooks but is he classed as academy? Given he was signed about 19 from skirlaugh


I would say Lane is average, also Lineham was signed from York.

We made a big mistake having the joint academy (Rovers could maybe argue the same) which will have put our academy behind others.

It certainly needs to improve, hopefully we are saying it now with Brown, Wynne and McNamara.
Re: Academy Prospects Sun Jun 20, 2021 10:36 am  

User avatarMild Rover wrote:
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Dave K. wrote:
I would say Lane is average, also Lineham was signed from York.

We made a big mistake having the joint academy (Rovers could maybe argue the same) which will have put our academy behind others.

It certainly needs to improve, hopefully we are saying it now with Brown, Wynne and McNamara.


Brown and Wynne are 20 and McNamara is 19. I don't know much about their routes to your first team squad - but a chunk of their formative development years will of been when when the CoH academy was running, 2016–2019. Same with Mikey Lewis and Will Tate at Rovers.

It is difficult to judge the current performance of an academy because you don't really begin to see the results for 3–5 years. Also, given the small numbers involved and year-to-year variations in talent it is difficult to judge how much is down to systems and how much to random fluctuation.

Looking at the famous teams based around batches of homegrown players, across different sports, their success isn't typically sustained by relying heavily just on that model beyond one generation. A lot of the time it is just a temporary confluence of circumstance and talent.
'Thus I am tormented by my curiosity and humbled by my ignorance.' from History of an Old Bramin, The New York Mirror (A Weekly Journal Devoted to Literature and the Fine Arts), February 16th 1833.
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