: Fri Feb 20, 2009 1:20 pm  

Marsdengiant wrote:

Loving the thread

Just thought I would show how muddled this post is and leave you to it.

1.It is very faulty thinking to say that if you do not challenge every example of a failure then a single challenge is invalidated. Normally this thinking is only found in u12s.

2. there is no doubt that FW has talent. The question is whether established SL teams should be signing reserve graders. On that i appear to differ with many wakefield fans.

3. For info the following Giants players are 22 or under and in the Giants 1st team squad: Cudjoe, Lawrence, Moore, McGilvray, Walsh, Lunt, Lawson, Hemingway, Lopag, Griffin, Carlile, McNally and Patrick. I suspect that we can get so many young Brits in because we have a small number of overseas players. Also thought Atkins was 23 and Ferguson was missed - pesky facts!

I think Kear knows talent when he sees it. If you see a player with promise your bound to try and sign him and Frank is certainly that, he has bags of talent and I see no reason why he can not make quite a name for him self. It's better than signing Aussies who are past it IMO

: Fri Feb 20, 2009 1:24 pm  

Haywire wrote:

I admire your optimism...... Lets hope you are right. Can't help but think that, reading through most of the thread on the VT, that they are actually making a fair and valid point - although the anti-Wakefield message of a couple of posters kind of makes it loose some credability.
In general, they are probably correct in my opinion - we do have too many middle of the road imports - hard to argue against this. I do understand the signing and the reasons behind it, and hopefully he will turn out to be another Willie Manu type player - but I think we probably could do more to help ourselfes when the current round of contracts runs out. In 2 or so years time:

Henderson Certain
Martin Certain
Drew Certain
Demetriou Probable
Obst Possible ?
Latu Possible ?

That would leave the likes of Winterstein (if he comes good) Peterson, Blanch, Stosic and leave us room for another International import. That would be a fair mix maybe? I dont think its too much to ask of the club to try and replace these outgoing imports with lads from our own academy, the lower leagues or even RU.

Unfortunately this seems to be more of the issue. I assume from what others have intimated the initiator of the thread is a reincarnation of a previous poster who has an agenda. Whilst as you say, the substance of their argument is not incorrect, the slant they bring to it renders it less useful.

Quite clearly, coming from the lofty perch of a cash rich club that can afford a business model based around cut price offers & free tickets over the last few years whilst at the same time running to be able to compete for higher calibre English & overseas signings through [I can only assume] offering higher wages and benefits, they've been able to make progress that I have no problem admitting is commendable. however, it is somewhat rich of a poster to berate us for not having done this when we've not had the benefit of a sugar daddy and a ready made stadium.

Our club has been in a different scenario, our board haven't been able to [or at least haven't felt able] always do the same and so have resorted to buying run of the mill overseas bargains. Whilst the merits of this at times is questionable, it worked at our most cash strapped. Had we the advantages mentioned above, we might have been able to hang on to the likes of Jackson, MacDonald, Mason, Griffin, Snitch, Hudson & others, not to mention been more competitive in signing English talent like Robinson, Wild, Hodgson, Aspinwall, Brown, etc. Thankfully we've begun to look longer-term over the last few years and have made great strides in our English player base & youth player development, which is what I'd rather focus on.

As such, I think Wakey fans would be best ignoring threads like this on the VT rather than fanning the flames.

: Fri Feb 20, 2009 1:48 pm  

bloomers wrote:

Unfortunately this seems to be more of the issue. I assume from what others have intimated the initiator of the thread is a reincarnation of a previous poster who has an agenda. Whilst as you say, the substance of their argument is not incorrect, the slant they bring to it renders it less useful.

Quite clearly, coming from the lofty perch of a cash rich club that can afford a business model based around cut price offers & free tickets over the last few years whilst at the same time running to be able to compete for higher calibre English & overseas signings through [I can only assume] offering higher wages and benefits, they've been able to make progress that I have no problem admitting is commendable. however, it is somewhat rich of a poster to berate us for not having done this when we've not had the benefit of a sugar daddy and a ready made stadium.

Our club has been in a different scenario, our board haven't been able to [or at least haven't felt able] always do the same and so have resorted to buying run of the mill overseas bargains. Whilst the merits of this at times is questionable, it worked at our most cash strapped. Had we the advantages mentioned above, we might have been able to hang on to the likes of Jackson, MacDonald, Mason, Griffin, Snitch, Hudson & others, not to mention been more competitive in signing English talent like Robinson, Wild, Hodgson, Aspinwall, Brown, etc. Thankfully we've begun to look longer-term over the last few years and have made great strides in our English player base & youth player development, which is what I'd rather focus on.

As such, I think Wakey fans would be best ignoring threads like this on the VT rather than fanning the flames.

Not a bad shout that squire.

: Fri Feb 20, 2009 3:26 pm  

Here we go again banging on about developing British talent and stopping signing oversees talent. Well what about this one. We couldnt keep hold of Ellis, Ferris,Fox or Golden but to name a few. They all left under the claim of wanting to win something, when really they left for more money. So can anybody tell me how we are going to keep the British talent when they all want to leave when the cash is flashed in front of them. FFS we couldnt even compete with Salford for Paul Whites services. I would refer players who want to represent Wakefield irrespective of where they are from. Its loyalty we should be after.

: Fri Feb 20, 2009 3:28 pm  

brettoncat wrote:

Here we go again banging on about developing British talent and stopping signing oversees talent. Well what about this one. We couldnt keep hold of Ellis, Ferris,Fox or Golden but to name a few. They all left under the claim of wanting to win something, when really they left for more money. So can anybody tell me how we are going to keep the British talent when they all want to leave when the cash is flashed in front of them. FFS we couldnt even compete with Salford for Paul Whites services. I would refer players who want to represent Wakefield irrespective of where they are from. Its loyalty we should be after.

That one isn't true (although I would like to have been). We made Ellis a tremendous offer, but he genuinely thought he would be better elsewhere.

Good luck to the lad!

: Fri Feb 20, 2009 3:52 pm  

Ok but you take my point. Its ok bringing through young British talent but if we cant keep hold of them then we need to have players who are committed to the trinity cause, no matter what country they are from. If we end up with another Ellis then what are we gpoing to do to keep them that is the major concern because they are gonna carry on going to the other so called bigger clubs. So once again what we should be discussing is not so much about not signing oversees players but about how to keep the British young talent we already have.

: Fri Feb 20, 2009 3:57 pm  

brettoncat wrote:

Ok but you take my point. Its ok bringing through young British talent but if we cant keep hold of them then we need to have players who are committed to the trinity cause, no matter what country they are from. If we end up with another Ellis then what are we gpoing to do to keep them that is the major concern because they are gonna carry on going to the other so called bigger clubs. So once again what we should be discussing is not so much about not signing oversees players but about how to keep the British young talent we already have.

I think the answer you are searching for lies in one word - Stadium!

With it, we can compete. Without it, well we all know what that means!

: Fri Feb 20, 2009 6:39 pm  

Can't believe so many naive Wakey fans have taken the bait on the VT thread.
I wouldn't waste my index finger responding to a fan whose club has such a despicable and embarassing recent history.

: Fri Feb 20, 2009 7:03 pm  

Wollo-Wollo-Wollo-Wayoo wrote:

Can't believe so many naive Wakey fans have taken the bait on the VT thread.
I wouldn't waste my index finger responding to a fan whose club has such a despicable and embarassing recent history.

Come on, how would you like to be stood on your own at away games, he needs to talk to someone.

: Fri Feb 20, 2009 7:38 pm  

BIGAL1 wrote:

:D Come on, how would you like to be stood on your own at away games, he needs to talk to someone.

nice on, but doesn't that apply to home games aswell as he is probably the only one who's paid.