Re: Taxi for Proctor too? : Sun May 28, 2023 3:34 pm  

PopTart wrote:

They are not, but they do include missed tackles, so Atoni has a lot of penalties or other things to give away to catch up.
But if you can be more specific and can get you the stats.

As they say, there’s lies, damn lies & statistics. You don’t always get stats for things like poor defensive reads or a bit of laziness in the defensive line.

[PopTart]

Re: Taxi for Proctor too? : Sun May 28, 2023 4:50 pm  

Sacred Cow wrote:

As they say, there’s lies, damn lies & statistics. You don’t always get stats for things like poor defensive reads or a bit of laziness in the defensive line.

You don't. But the stats are still facts. It's only the spin that count as the "damn lies"
I've been as big a critic as anyone of Atoni's attacking stars but the all I'm saying is the 'stat' a him commiting 7 defensive errors to Battye's one is not accurate.

If Battye is perfect about everything else, he still only achieved 3 games where he could be said to make 1 defensive error.
Game 1 Atoni made 23 tackles and missed none against Salford 14-13
Game 2 Atoni makes 23 tackles and missed 2 against Rhinos 26-0
Game 3 Atoni makes 31 tackles and misses 1 against Giants 0-8

I'd still lose Atoni as we need someone who has a metre gaining and off load Game. We have plenty who can tackle (ish)
I just don't subscribe to the pile on phylosophy of just blaming everything on someone who has a flaw.

Re: Taxi for Proctor too? : Sun May 28, 2023 5:47 pm  

PopTart wrote:

You don't. But the stats are still facts. It's only the spin that count as the "damn lies"
I've been as big a critic as anyone of Atoni's attacking stars but the all I'm saying is the 'stat' a him commiting 7 defensive errors to Battye's one is not accurate.

If Battye is perfect about everything else, he still only achieved 3 games where he could be said to make 1 defensive error.
Game 1 Atoni made 23 tackles and missed none against Salford 14-13
Game 2 Atoni makes 23 tackles and missed 2 against Rhinos 26-0
Game 3 Atoni makes 31 tackles and misses 1 against Giants 0-8

I'd still lose Atoni as we need someone who has a metre gaining and off load Game. We have plenty who can tackle (ish)
I just don't subscribe to the pile on phylosophy of just blaming everything on someone who has a flaw.

How do you know? What if the defensive error referred to is not one that is recorded by statistics?

[PopTart]

Re: Taxi for Proctor too? : Sun May 28, 2023 6:32 pm  

Sacred Cow wrote:

How do you know? What if the defensive error referred to is not one that is recorded by statistics?

The rest of the post explains why.

Re: Taxi for Proctor too? : Sun May 28, 2023 6:40 pm  

PopTart wrote:

The rest of the post explains why.

It really doesn’t.

[PopTart]

Re: Taxi for Proctor too? : Sun May 28, 2023 6:50 pm  

Sacred Cow wrote:

It really doesn’t.

Well OK, but so I understand for next time, can you explain what it is, and if its not recorded, how does anyone know he did it 7 times?

Re: Taxi for Proctor too? : Sun May 28, 2023 6:55 pm  

PopTart wrote:

Well OK, but so I understand for next time, can you explain what it is, and if its not recorded, how does anyone know he did it 7 times?

I have no idea whether what it was it was done 7 times, i didn’t make the original comment. But as i keep trying to explain there are in game factors that aren’t measured by stats, things like defensive positioning and reads, kick pressure etc. These will be picked up on by the coaching staff during the post match video review. It’s really not that difficult to understand.

Re: Taxi for Proctor too? : Sun May 28, 2023 7:09 pm  

PopTart wrote:

Well OK, but so I understand for next time, can you explain what it is, and if its not recorded, how does anyone know he did it 7 times?

PT are you honestly struggling with that or are you so stubborn that you're arguing about everything in defence of the club?

Scenario 1: Fullback in the defensive line. Told to drop back by team mate. Advice ignored. Kick over the top onto space. Picked up by the opposition and try. Defensive error. Not recorded as a "stat".

Scenario 2: You are told to slide across in the defensive line. You ignore the call. The opposition have an overlap and subsequently score. Defensive error. Not recorded as a "stat".

Scenario 3. You're stood as first marker. Your mate taps your right buttock to defend the right side. You go left. The opposition scoot right and make a ton of meters. Defensive error. Not recorded as a "stat".

I could genuinely go on but I'm hoping you get the jist

[PopTart]

Re: Taxi for Proctor too? : Sun May 28, 2023 8:04 pm  

marc271841 wrote:

PT are you honestly struggling with that or are you so stubborn that you're arguing about everything in defence of the club?

Scenario 1: Fullback in the defensive line. Told to drop back by team mate. Advice ignored. Kick over the top onto space. Picked up by the opposition and try. Defensive error. Not recorded as a "stat".

Scenario 2: You are told to slide across in the defensive line. You ignore the call. The opposition have an overlap and subsequently score. Defensive error. Not recorded as a "stat".

Scenario 3. You're stood as first marker. Your mate taps your right buttock to defend the right side. You go left. The opposition scoot right and make a ton of meters. Defensive error. Not recorded as a "stat".

I could genuinely go on but I'm hoping you get the jist

Ok, I get that.
So how do we know Battye did it once and Atoni 7 times in a game.
I get that you can see a non slide while watching but you can't tell whether they were told and 7 times? Or that he was the only one.
Seems a bit excessive.

So I'm not being defensive on behalf of the club. It's nothing to do with them. I've already said I'd get rid of Atoni. I'm just not convinced that stat is real. Especially when used to imply Mash is favouring him over Battye because of it, when all the other stats show Battye to be twice as bad.

Re: Taxi for Proctor too? : Sun May 28, 2023 10:24 pm  

Anyway, Proctor is stinking the place out, stats or no stats.
Has he done an interview yet or done any community work for his wedge or has he a holiday exclusion clause?