Re: Belle Vue back on? : Sat Dec 23, 2017 3:29 pm  

[quote="wrencat1873"]
However, I dont get where the RFL came down heavy on the Bulls ??

What I meant by that wrencat is that I'm surprised that the RFL imposed the full 12 point deduction when , because of who the Bulls are, they could have wangled a smaller penalty to give them a better chance of promotion last season. After all they are "iconic".

Re: Belle Vue back on? : Sat Dec 23, 2017 3:36 pm  

vastman wrote:

Look Eastern you're entitled to your opinion but before you dismiss mine so quickly with your trite comments let me give you an object lesson.

In 2004 Prince Buster and myself suggested the idea of a supporters group to pursue a community stadium.

The much-maligned Ted Richardson quickly realised that an independent supporter’s group would have far more impact persuading the council for support than the club alone.

Hence SWAG was born and with the addition of TRB and Jinjer and with the club supporting in the background we started all this.

SWAG is the forerunner to todays Trust in case you're wondering.

For the first five years I was on the coalface and I travelled miles and spent literally hundreds of hours working on the SWAG agenda.

In that time I met with numerous Council representatives including Box, Jeffery's and Clive Hudson and all three at various times looked me in the eye and said Ossett was a goer, Thornes was a certainty whist NM simply couldn't fail.

I know what snakes these people are from first hand experience and I’m sorry but you simply don't.

I've heard this all before and I see no more validity to this than any other - you just see what you want to see.

However what truly offends me and if you weren’t so insular it would offend you is that this even if it happens is totally unsatisfactory in reality.

Just because we get what we want and I always wanted to stay at BV if possible a huge swindle will have taken place - why don't you get that.

Acres of valuable green belt has been conned into the hands of a private investor who will simply not deliver anything like what he promised but will make millions.

Our council has been complicit in this.

Where are all the other facilities Eastern? Where are the plastic pitches the sports halls and all the other community facilities? Hell where is the car parking!

You're being robbed blind and you just can't see it. I didn't sign up for this. I'm happy enough with he BV element should it ever actually happen which I doubt but what about the rest, do we let them walk away scott free?

In all conscience I can't because I'm complicit in this. I helped make people believe they were getting something they are clearly not. I don't blame the club for taking whatever is on offer but the people of WMDC should be up in arms. I'll say again you're being robbed blind and a lot of people have been stitched up - not least the residents of NM.

You go justify to them why instead of a wonderful community facility on their doorstep they now have numerous monstrosities to look at.

You need to think a little more and see past the obvious. I don't think you and others on here are bad people but I do think there is far too much self-interest and way to many blind eyes.

It still stinks, end of.

I've no interest in Chissitt's opinions but even if I have he's not in this discussion is he.

Re: Belle Vue back on? : Sat Dec 23, 2017 4:52 pm  

I think I've read all this thread but don't recall seeing any response from the trust!
Are they happy with the present agreement?
Only when they are will I be!

Re: Belle Vue back on? : Sat Dec 23, 2017 4:54 pm  

thebeagle wrote:

Been to Belle Vue have I Vastman ?
Saw my first match there in 1955 !
Got my season ticket for 2018.
Yes I do prioritise a new stadium before anything else.
Before I bloody die.
If there is a case for pursuing the council et al if community facilities are not realised then let the appropriate bodies do so.
But why end up with nothing at all ?
As for the general public , they have not got a clue about stadium for Trinity entwined with community facilities.

OK I get your point and I do actually sympathise but you can't just ignore the wider issue here.

As I say I don't blame the club, they do what is best for the club.

However there is a wider issue here that simply can't be ignored. If we get this stadium this way it cannot be denied that we got it on the fiddle. Not us directly but we as WMDC ratepayers are complcit in defrauding other ratepayers however well meaning we may be.

If it's this or nothing we should take it - however we must carry on persuing the Council to fullfill it's obligation. Something that will unfortunately be much harder if the stadium element is removed.

Sorry but from someone involved from the start it will be a slightly hollow victory even though I accept it is a victory. Knowing the Trust members as I do it won't sit well with some of them though to alay your fears I'm sure they will be pragmatic about this.

Re: Belle Vue back on? : Sat Dec 23, 2017 4:57 pm  

Trinity1315 wrote:

I think I've read all this thread but don't recall seeing any response from the trust!
Are they happy with the present agreement?
Only when they are will I be!

There isn't one but you have to remember that the Clubs agenda and the Trusts agenda are not identical.

The club supports the idea of NM first as far as I'm aware especially the community element. However they are first and foremost a bussiness and as such will put the club first.

The Trust has a much wider agenda and has to take far more into account - so you may be waiting a while for a response I suspect.

Re: Belle Vue back on? : Sat Dec 23, 2017 5:03 pm  

vastman wrote:

There isn't one but you have to remember that the Clubs agenda and the Trusts agenda are not identical.

The club supports the idea of NM first as far as I'm aware especially the community element. However they are first and foremost a bussiness and as such will put the club first.

The Trust has a much wider agenda and has to take far more into account - so you may be waiting a while for a response I suspect.

Yeah, of course - me being blinkered as well!

Re: Belle Vue back on? : Sat Dec 23, 2017 5:23 pm  

ANTWERP RED wrote:

HA HA We were told by the RL to build a New stadium or Renovate IE: Widnes , And We did So did all the clubs in the Northwest and what have you done with the Same money that We and the rest of the Superleague teams got ? Put a Cover on the roof of your Cowshed
Can't kiss my Mum goodnight as the Female members of your menagerie family are Visiting me this Weekend
Oh I guess Some of the Sky dosh has made it's way in a Surreptitiously style to the LS17 Postcode.
That's the only reason You've Probably been allowed to stay at The Wakefield Pigsty.

Oh so you and the rest of Northeast built stadiums from SKY money, I bet that is news to nearly every one of them.

As for Salford don't you mean the Council poured millions into a Stadium for you? Even then after that in 2013, you needed an emergency fund from the Council and Peel group to the tune of £1.2m, then a year later another £400k was lent towards the stadium.

Long story short when you've actually built something yourselves out of your own back pockets, like Saints for example, not got the Council to practically fund the whole deal, or attach yourselves onto a S106 , then you can give it the big one like you are.

Re: Belle Vue back on? : Sat Dec 23, 2017 5:34 pm  

vastman wrote:

OK I get your point and I do actually sympathise but you can't just ignore the wider issue here.

As I say I don't blame the club, they do what is best for the club.

However there is a wider issue here that simply can't be ignored. If we get this stadium this way it cannot be denied that we got it on the fiddle. Not us directly but we as WMDC ratepayers are complcit in defrauding other ratepayers however well meaning we may be.

If it's this or nothing we should take it - however we must carry on persuing the Council to fullfill it's obligation. Something that will unfortunately be much harder if the stadium element is removed.

Sorry but from someone involved from the start it will be a slightly hollow victory even though I accept it is a victory. Knowing the Trust members as I do it won't sit well with some of them though to alay your fears I'm sure they will be pragmatic about this.

Agree and if the redevelopment does go ahead, it sort of proves to me that they've allowed Yorkcourt get away with murder. If no extra Community facilities eventually happen, similar to what Yorkcourt have just put into the planning office for Newmarket. It's a pity there isn't a newspaper that could do a full expose on the deal and how much extra money they've made from doing this move.
Also even with a redeveloped Belle Vue, I bet we'll still be off up Featherstone do our training as well.

Re: Belle Vue back on? : Sat Dec 23, 2017 6:23 pm  

Trinity1315 wrote:

Yeah, of course - me being blinkered as well!

What's your point, I try hard to get most but that's gone straight over my head.

Re: Belle Vue back on? : Sat Dec 23, 2017 6:27 pm  

Shifty Cat wrote:

Agree and if the redevelopment does go ahead, it sort of proves to me that they've allowed Yorkcourt get away with murder. If no extra Community facilities eventually happen, similar to what Yorkcourt have just put into the planning office for Newmarket. It's a pity there isn't a newspaper that could do a full expose on the deal and how much extra money they've made from doing this move.
Also even with a redeveloped Belle Vue, I bet we'll still be off up Featherstone do our training as well.

I suppose the easiest way to look at it is that there are two separate issues here.

Trinity's Stadium issue is solved IF and it's a huge IF it happens.

The wider issue and in many ways the more important one is far from solved and that is the 106 agreement and it's flagrant disregard.

It's fine getting what we wanted but we owe it as fans and ratepayers to get the rest of it - it's what the ratepayer deserves and frankly it's the right thing to do.

If we don't that vile man and his co-conspirators win again.

Aren't we all sick of that, I know I am.