Re: Football Chat Thread : Mon Jun 06, 2011 3:17 pm  

A year on from the World Cup and nothing has changed, same old players who have let us down time after time and still don't have their positions under threat. It's time we finished their international careers and gave the new younger lads a chance before the Euros.

The past few games who have been the stand out players? Bent, Young & Wilshere - the new younger players. Speaks volumes.

Re: Football Chat Thread : Mon Jun 06, 2011 4:07 pm  

What we're all saying is that without investment i.e. financial backing for signings, Everton is a dead end job for Moyes. He's waited patiently for the money to arrive and it hasn't. How long is he prepared to wait whilst other managers' careers forge ahead? It feels as if he's waiting for the Manchester United job to come up but I can't see them chancing their arm on a guy who hasn't won anything outside of a bottle of bubbly.

I'm in agreement with the Everton fans that Villa is not really a step up. It is though a step to a club with better financial backing, solvency and possibly growth and it might be the best offer that he gets because he is unlikely to attract interest from one of the more successful clubs until he's done something that blows our socks off.

If we're being honest what's the difference between his success rate and Big Sam's? Moyes might coach more attractive football but the similarities are there i.e. more than treading water on a modest/limited budget. Perhaps the quality of his football makes him a more attractive option but there are questions over (as stated above) his ability to fashion a truly attractive team (and there are factors external to him that influence that I know). If you were the chairman of one of United/Chelsea/City/Arsenal (rule out Liverpool as he's not going there) you're unlikely to go for Moyes because he is still not done anything other than extract the very best out of modest resources which to me suggests he be framed in the context of 'has potential'. We don't know what he can do with decent financial backing and even then it's not like he's been perfect when he has splashed out.

Moyes has to aim at the second tier in the same way that Mark Hughes does. Everton may sit in that second tier results wise but they are currently closer to, if not at, the bottom of that tier in terms of financial backing. The question that must be going through his mind is how long is he prepared to sit and wait to be poached or for Everton to get some money. The longer he sits and waits without moving further up the table (and it's getting harder every single year) the more his stock gradually decreases and he becomes less and less a viable alternative for a team with money to spend.

Re: Football Chat Thread : Mon Jun 06, 2011 4:08 pm  

Bang wrote:

A year on from the World Cup and nothing has changed, same old players who have let us down time after time and still don't have their positions under threat. It's time we finished their international careers and gave the new younger lads a chance before the Euros.

The past few games who have been the stand out players? Bent, Young & Wilshere - the new younger players. Speaks volumes.

For a minute there I thought you were talking about Chelsea lol.

Re: Football Chat Thread : Mon Jun 06, 2011 8:21 pm  

McClennan wrote:

I'm in agreement with the Everton fans that Villa is not really a step up. It is though a step to a club with better financial backing, solvency and possibly growth and it might be the best offer that he gets because he is unlikely to attract interest from one of the more successful clubs until he's done something that blows our socks off.

The problem for Moyes is; his reputation is very very high, he's won personal accolades, he's been consistent and he's got over losing big players. He doesn't really need to step up, if you would consider Villa and their slight wealth a step up, that is. If he moves to Villa and turns them into a better outfit, great, but the chances of him turning them into a top 4 side are unlikely. Many are grooming Moyes for a top job already, with rumours 'Arry could be going for the England job in 2012, Fergie retiring is a realistic prospect soon and the Chelsea job will be a nice challenge for a year, he could well be in for a good chance at a top club sooner, rather than later, so letting the Villa 'train' pass won't really matter.

Me personally, I'd like to see Moyes go into Europe and try his hand in Germany or Italy, purely because (Italy at least) it would be better for his 'education' of the game. Germany because I feel it's a prosperous league that would allow him to develop better than the Premier League.

Re: Football Chat Thread : Mon Jun 06, 2011 8:38 pm  

In the farce that is FIFA, Blatter brings in opera singer Placido Domingo as an advisor

Re: Football Chat Thread : Mon Jun 06, 2011 8:46 pm  

Roddy B wrote:

The problem for Moyes is; his reputation is very very high, he's won personal accolades, he's been consistent and he's got over losing big players. He doesn't really need to step up, if you would consider Villa and their slight wealth a step up, that is. If he moves to Villa and turns them into a better outfit, great, but the chances of him turning them into a top 4 side are unlikely. Many are grooming Moyes for a top job already, with rumours 'Arry could be going for the England job in 2012, Fergie retiring is a realistic prospect soon and the Chelsea job will be a nice challenge for a year, he could well be in for a good chance at a top club sooner, rather than later, so letting the Villa 'train' pass won't really matter.

Me personally, I'd like to see Moyes go into Europe and try his hand in Germany or Italy, purely because (Italy at least) it would be better for his 'education' of the game. Germany because I feel it's a prosperous league that would allow him to develop better than the Premier League.

Not sure that Villa are complete no-hopers for the top 4.....If Liverpool fans can harbour hopes of breaking into the top 4, then Villa surely deserve similar hopes, with a similarly wealthy backer as the Merseysiders?

Let's not forget that Villa finished above both Liverpool and Everton just over a year ago, and but for O'Neill walking out and then Houllier proceeding to wreck all his work, Villa could easily have been in the mix this season.

They still have the basis of a good side, a very good youth system, producing some highly promising players, they just need a good coach, to be backed with an adequate transfer fund.....Personally, I would say the Villa job is a very attractive one to somebody like Moyes.....Its basically the Everton job with cash (which is what he has been craving for years), and its as good as he can hope for at present....As many have pointed out, he does not presently have the CV for a truly big job....Villa would be the obvious stepping stone to a United-sized job....He's proved all he can at Everton - Villa would prove he can do it with added cash.

Re: Football Chat Thread : Mon Jun 06, 2011 9:37 pm  

McClennan wrote:

What we're all saying is that without investment i.e. financial backing for signings, Everton is a dead end job for Moyes. He's waited patiently for the money to arrive and it hasn't. How long is he prepared to wait whilst other managers' careers forge ahead? It feels as if he's waiting for the Manchester United job to come up but I can't see them chancing their arm on a guy who hasn't won anything outside of a bottle of bubbly.

I'm in agreement with the Everton fans that Villa is not really a step up. It is though a step to a club with better financial backing, solvency and possibly growth and it might be the best offer that he gets because he is unlikely to attract interest from one of the more successful clubs until he's done something that blows our socks off.

If we're being honest what's the difference between his success rate and Big Sam's? Moyes might coach more attractive football but the similarities are there i.e. more than treading water on a modest/limited budget. Perhaps the quality of his football makes him a more attractive option but there are questions over (as stated above) his ability to fashion a truly attractive team (and there are factors external to him that influence that I know). If you were the chairman of one of United/Chelsea/City/Arsenal (rule out Liverpool as he's not going there) you're unlikely to go for Moyes because he is still not done anything other than extract the very best out of modest resources which to me suggests he be framed in the context of 'has potential'. We don't know what he can do with decent financial backing and even then it's not like he's been perfect when he has splashed out.

Moyes has to aim at the second tier in the same way that Mark Hughes does. Everton may sit in that second tier results wise but they are currently closer to, if not at, the bottom of that tier in terms of financial backing. The question that must be going through his mind is how long is he prepared to sit and wait to be poached or for Everton to get some money. The longer he sits and waits without moving further up the table (and it's getting harder every single year) the more his stock gradually decreases and he becomes less and less a viable alternative for a team with money to spend.

That's a brilliant post mate, well said. I'd agree with all of that.

Moyes' future job aside, if he left there's no doubt about we are fooked big time. Can't see who'd want to face the test of trying to work with a limited amount of money and a short squad of players.

Re: Football Chat Thread : Mon Jun 06, 2011 9:58 pm  

flipper wrote:

In the farce that is FIFA, Blatter brings in opera singer Placido Domingo as an advisor

International soccer

Re: Football Chat Thread : Mon Jun 06, 2011 9:59 pm  

£18m for Jordan Henderson? What on earth are Liverpool playing at?

Re: Football Chat Thread : Mon Jun 06, 2011 10:07 pm  

ash4hullfc wrote:

£18m for Jordan Henderson? What on earth are Liverpool playing at?

Where are you reading/hearing this, boss?