Re: Football Chat Thread - Euro 2012 edition : Sun Sep 02, 2012 2:25 pm  

WireFanatic III wrote:

Still think I should be towing the old "it will be fine, don't worry about it" line?

I still stand by what I posted after the first game of the season, there is no way we will qualify for the CL. Rogers is out of his depth, our squad is an utter shambles and transfer deadline day was just a complete joke. Like I said, it would be nice if he could prove me wrong and get us back up there, but I very much doubt he will still be here come Christmas.

And the icing on the cake will be if we have to bring Michael Owen back. That will just reek of desperation.

Clearly we were never going to get into the CL, it doesn't require a genius to know that. Think you're harsh to dismiss Rodgers, he seems like a decent enough manager with all the right ideas and tactics. We're still paying for the mistakes of past management, reducing the wage bill, average age, etc. Yes, it's disappointing what happened on deadline day, it's also disappointing to see us easily dismissed by a quite average Arsenal side, but things will get better IMO, it will take time as we don't have the funds or assets to sell to generate £100m+, which is what it would take. Dalglish and Comolli blitzed our best chance to get back up there, Rodgers will now pay the consequences.

Re: Football Chat Thread - Euro 2012 edition : Sun Sep 02, 2012 2:34 pm  

Roddy B wrote:

Clearly we were never going to get into the CL, it doesn't require a genius to know that. Think you're harsh to dismiss Rodgers, he seems like a decent enough manager with all the right ideas and tactics. We're still paying for the mistakes of past management, reducing the wage bill, average age, etc. Yes, it's disappointing what happened on deadline day, it's also disappointing to see us easily dismissed by a quite average Arsenal side, but things will get better IMO, it will take time as we don't have the funds or assets to sell to generate £100m+, which is what it would take. Dalglish and Comolli blitzed our best chance to get back up there, Rodgers will now pay the consequences.

He has ideas and he has his way of playing football, but at the moment the players are the ones that are underperforming but obviously people will say that was down to the manager. Me personally, I don't think he's the right man for the job but as I've always said, I would like him to prove me wrong. I'm just sick of people coming in, and then having to have one season as a "stop gap" just to get used to everything, to get back up to scratch. The more stop gaps we have, the more it puts us behind the top teams and we can't afford to keep doing it.

Re: Football Chat Thread - Euro 2012 edition : Sun Sep 02, 2012 3:02 pm  

WireFanatic III wrote:

He has ideas and he has his way of playing football, but at the moment the players are the ones that are underperforming but obviously people will say that was down to the manager. Me personally, I don't think he's the right man for the job but as I've always said, I would like him to prove me wrong. I'm just sick of people coming in, and then having to have one season as a "stop gap" just to get used to everything, to get back up to scratch. The more stop gaps we have, the more it puts us behind the top teams and we can't afford to keep doing it.

The problem is we have new management coming in under new ownership, everything is new and it's incredibly hard to start from scratch. Our owners tried to blag it with Dalglish, seeing him turn around the results made them think things would be as simple as that, but Dalglish cocked up and now they realise we have to start from scratch. We've reduced our wage bill by about £20m a year and we still have players that we don't want here or are being overpaid. It's going to be hard for Rodgers, but I think the owners and fans have to understand we'll have to take steps back to take steps forward. FFP is around the corner which is apparently going to change things, the best we can do is prepare for that, as we've no chance of getting into the CL for at least another year or two.

Re: Football Chat Thread - Euro 2012 edition : Sun Sep 02, 2012 3:14 pm  

Roddy B wrote:

The problem is we have new management coming in under new ownership, everything is new and it's incredibly hard to start from scratch. Our owners tried to blag it with Dalglish, seeing him turn around the results made them think things would be as simple as that, but Dalglish cocked up and now they realise we have to start from scratch. We've reduced our wage bill by about £20m a year and we still have players that we don't want here or are being overpaid. It's going to be hard for Rodgers, but I think the owners and fans have to understand we'll have to take steps back to take steps forward. FFP is around the corner which is apparently going to change things, the best we can do is prepare for that, as we've no chance of getting into the CL for at least another year or two.

Serious question - If indeed it does take you several years before you can make Chamions League, do you think your present owners will hang around for the duration, seeing as they have already been quite vocal in their desire for an almost instant return to the CL?

It seems quite clear that they are budgeting for actually making the Champions League much sooner than, at present, looks likely....I just wonder if they will have the patience (and the financial backing) to stick with what could be a lengthy project?

Re: Football Chat Thread - Euro 2012 edition : Sun Sep 02, 2012 3:14 pm  

WireFanatic III wrote:

Still think I should be towing the old "it will be fine, don't worry about it" line?

I still stand by what I posted after the first game of the season, there is no way we will qualify for the CL. Rogers is out of his depth, our squad is an utter shambles and transfer deadline day was just a complete joke. Like I said, it would be nice if he could prove me wrong and get us back up there, but I very much doubt he will still be here come Christmas.

Do you think that's wise to make that assessment off less than a handful of competitive fixtures? I've seen the reactions already on Twitter which are worse that despondent. I'm not sure what the fans expect. How soon do these people expect Rodgers to overhaul the squad and playing culture? If the fans want the attractive football that Rodgers is promising then they should get behind their team instead of complaining just because they can't handle getting ribbed off opposition fans on a Monday morning.

Re: Football Chat Thread - Euro 2012 edition : Sun Sep 02, 2012 3:27 pm  

Dita's Slot Meter wrote:

Serious question - If indeed it does take you several years before you can make Chamions League, do you think your present owners will hang around for the duration, seeing as they have already been quite vocal in their desire for an almost instant return to the CL?

It seems quite clear that they are budgeting for actually making the Champions League much sooner than, at present, looks likely....I just wonder if they will have the patience (and the financial backing) to stick with what could be a lengthy project?

I think their hope was to get in ASAP, obviously, but they know with the increased everything that being in the CL brings, it's pivotal if FFP is to be done properly for us to be there to compete. If FFP comes in and we're not in Europe, everybody else will bridge ahead of us, we're already playing catch up with things like matchday revenue, the last thing we need is seeing other teams make more than us through being in Europe.

Them staying at the club depends on a lot of things, getting into Europe is one of them. Another is the stadium, if they can't find investment to build a new one, or they aren't able to extend Anfield, that could also force them out, as they want to develop the club for a future sale IMO. They believe they can do this by 'out-thinking' the competition instead of outspending, but the huge differences between US sports and Football will make this a far bigger challenge IMO. They don't strike me as idiots, I think they are up to it but it will require luck, skill and a fair amount of dollar.

Re: Football Chat Thread - Euro 2012 edition : Sun Sep 02, 2012 3:35 pm  

McClennan wrote:

Do you think that's wise to make that assessment off less than a handful of competitive fixtures?

If we do get into the CL, then I'll hold my hands up and admit I was wrong. At the moment though, I've not seen anything that would get us anywhere other than a "possible" Europa League qualifying place.

McClennan wrote:

I've seen the reactions already on Twitter which are worse that despondent.

Mike, I've seen what's been on twitter and some people have been posting stuff worse than me and I'm the most pessimistic person on the face of this planet.

McClennan wrote:

I'm not sure what the fans expect.

They want instantaneous results, and in a way, the way we've been the last couple of seasons, I don't blame them.

McClennan wrote:

How soon do these people expect Rodgers to overhaul the squad and playing culture?

Again, they want it done immediately.

McClennan wrote:

If the fans want the attractive football that Rodgers is promising then they should get behind their team instead of complaining just because they can't handle getting ribbed off opposition fans on a Monday morning.

I've been getting a s**t load of stick from Everton fans over the last couple of weeks, but doesn't bother me in the slightest. They have been very quiet though this weekend. Some people that I have seen on twitter want to blame select players, the coach, the MD, the referee etc. Like I keep saying, I'll give Rogers a chance to turn it around. He wasn't my choice for the job, but the way things are going at the moment, it's not doing my negative nature any good.

Re: Football Chat Thread - Euro 2012 edition : Sun Sep 02, 2012 4:37 pm  

McClennan wrote:

Do you think that's wise to make that assessment off less than a handful of competitive fixtures? I've seen the reactions already on Twitter which are worse that despondent. I'm not sure what the fans expect. How soon do these people expect Rodgers to overhaul the squad and playing culture? If the fans want the attractive football that Rodgers is promising then they should get behind their team instead of complaining just because they can't handle getting ribbed off opposition fans on a Monday morning.

The problem a lot of our fans seem to have is they think these Americans should just pull money out and pay for everything. They think they should cough up £300m for a stadium, but it must be interest free loans if we have to lend the money. They think we should do whatever it takes to sign a player, that budgets and possible salary policies should be thrown out of the window. They think if we don't get something then somebody isn't doing their job and they must be sacked (latest being Ian Ayre).

As I said before, I have a fair amount of faith in Rodgers, he strikes me as a good coach with great principles. His 'way' seems to be the right one and I like his style of player. However, he has a huge job on his hands, not only must he get us to compete, he must completely overhaul the squad and reduce the wage bill and average age of the squad. Unbelievable management and unbelievable luck will be required to get us into the CL, I don't think we'll get it but we must get ourselves in the best position possible to challenge for fourth next season.

Re: Football Chat Thread - Euro 2012 edition : Sun Sep 02, 2012 5:13 pm  

Geez, i nip out to the shop expecting we've lost and i see 2-3 when i get back.

Re: Football Chat Thread - Euro 2012 edition : Sun Sep 02, 2012 7:11 pm  

WireFanatic III wrote:

Still think I should be towing the old "it will be fine, don't worry about it" line?

I still stand by what I posted after the first game of the season, there is no way we will qualify for the CL. Rogers is out of his depth, our squad is an utter shambles and transfer deadline day was just a complete joke. Like I said, it would be nice if he could prove me wrong and get us back up there, but I very much doubt he will still be here come Christmas.

And the icing on the cake will be if we have to bring Michael Owen back. That will just reek of desperation.

How is our squad a shambles? We have the best midfield we've had in years, granted we're light up front but to say our squad is a shambles is ridiculous. If you thought things would improve over night then I'm sorry but you're wrong, it will take a long time for the team to adjust to Rodgers' passing style, maybe even a full season. He's a manager, not a miracle worker. I have faith in him, I think that he'll bring the CL nights back to Anfield in a few years.

We weren't that bad today btw. Arsenal played a very shrewd game; defend deep and catch us on the counter attack. We had chances, we should of had a penalty, we were sloppy in the final third but we weren't that bad.

Keep the faith.