Re: Bevan French 4yr deal : Fri Apr 05, 2024 11:27 am  

WYSIWYG2 wrote:

So that's 6 players so far. You may add another 10 from other clubs and that would be it. There would be a hell of a lot more NRL players who would walk into SL teams. You can discount Hull, Cas and London and my team Leigh, at the moment, with the horrendous injury list. So there are only 8 teams fighting for a top 6 spot, and only 2 of them have a chance of winning the GF or playing at the same intensity as the NRL - Saints and Wiggin.

The NRL have 17 teams who play at that intensity every week.

No they don't.

They clearly have a better comp with more good players and teams but to suggest that every team plays at the intensity of the recent derby is complete nonsense. There are several teams struggling over there currently. Knights beat the Dragons comfortably today.

None of that matters anyway. Your assertion that French would be average over there has nothing to do with the intensity of the competition. His try scoring record in that comp as a much lesser player was excellent. He's twice the player now. There are relatively few players in world rugby capable of the things French finds second nature. Just like Robinson etc. before him. Those type of players flourish wherever they ply their trade.

Re: Bevan French 4yr deal : Fri Apr 05, 2024 11:28 am  

WYSIWYG2 wrote:

So that's 6 players so far. You may add another 10 from other clubs and that would be it. There would be a hell of a lot more NRL players who would walk into SL teams. You can discount Hull, Cas and London and my team Leigh, at the moment, with the horrendous injury list. So there are only 8 teams fighting for a top 6 spot, and only 2 of them have a chance of winning the GF or playing at the same intensity as the NRL - Saints and Wiggin.

The NRL have 17 teams who play at that intensity every week.

People will fall off their chairs that you think more NRL players would walk in to Superleague clubs than the other way round! State the obvious why don't you.

Nobody is disputing it's a better league but simply pointing out that you're wrong that good players here would go to the NRL and just be average Joe's. Loads of lads have gone from over here to the NRL and excelled. I've seen bits of 3 NRL games yesterday and today and I've not seen a team yet that I think would run over the top of this current Wigan side and I've seen plenty of average players on show (I've also seen loads of World Class players as well).

Re: Bevan French 4yr deal : Fri Apr 05, 2024 11:50 am  

WYSIWYG2 wrote:

So that's 6 players so far. You may add another 10 from other clubs and that would be it. There would be a hell of a lot more NRL players who would walk into SL teams. You can discount Hull, Cas and London and my team Leigh, at the moment, with the horrendous injury list. So there are only 8 teams fighting for a top 6 spot, and only 2 of them have a chance of winning the GF or playing at the same intensity as the NRL - Saints and Wiggin.

The NRL have 17 teams who play at that intensity every week.

I can't see other SL teams catching up to Saints and Wiggin to be honest. And with IMG removing relegation some teams are happy to tick their finance and social media boxes rather than build a team strong enough to compete.

To be fair though its not up to Saints and Wigan to lower their standards to allow others to catch up, its up to the others to raise their standards.

Amongst many other factors both clubs invest heavily into their youth systems and provide a conveyor belt of talent each year, some who play first team but also lots of others that forge a good career in the game at other clubs.

There was a brilliant pic that Saints tweeted last week of Peet and Wellens stood next to each other watching the closely fought Saints v Wigan Academy game just 24 hours after the Good Friday game. That's a good reason why both clubs are the best two sides in the comp.

Re: Bevan French 4yr deal : Fri Apr 05, 2024 11:58 am  

Phuzzy wrote:

No they don't.

They clearly have a better comp with more good players and teams but to suggest that every team plays at the intensity of the recent derby is complete nonsense. There are several teams struggling over there currently. Knights beat the Dragons comfortably today.

None of that matters anyway. Your assertion that French would be average over there has nothing to do with the intensity of the competition. His try scoring record in that comp as a much lesser player was excellent. He's twice the player now. There are relatively few players in world rugby capable of the things French finds second nature. Just like Robinson etc. before him. Those type of players flourish wherever they ply their trade.

You're absolutely right - there are some poor sides in the NRL and some very inconsistent ones - just like any sporting league. It isn't a league filled with Harlem Globetrotters like some seem to believe. They have far more resources but pundits over there still discuss the limited depth of the player pool on a regular basis.

Andrew Johns and Brad Fittler praised the X factor of Bevan French recently - he's a unique player with an all round skill set.

Re: Bevan French 4yr deal : Fri Apr 05, 2024 5:16 pm  

Mark_P1973 wrote:

i'll disagree re Sneyd

he hasnt had a gig at a top club over here (Salford, Cas and Hull), and there must be a reason why. I'll admit on his day he can play (or kick), but i just dont think he is consistent enough within a game, let alone over the course of a season, hence why he's never gone to Wigan, Saints, Leeds etc

Fair enough but I honestly believe if Sneyd were at Souths this season they would be 3 from 4 not 1 from 4.

Sezer getting serious wraps and he isn’t as good as Sneyd.

I think also it’s a bit disrespectful to say he hasn’t had a gig at a top club Hull won back to back Challenge Cups, with him being named Lance Todd Trophy winner on both occasions, once when they beat us. Hull were a good club back then, not the shower they are at the moment.

Re: Bevan French 4yr deal : Fri Apr 05, 2024 5:48 pm  

jonh wrote:

Fair enough but I honestly believe if Sneyd were at Souths this season they would be 3 from 4 not 1 from 4.

Sezer getting serious wraps and he isn’t as good as Sneyd.

I think also it’s a bit disrespect to say he hasn’t had a gig at a top club Hull won back to back Challenge Cups, with him being named Lance Todd Trophy winner on both occasions, once when they beat us. Hull were a good club back then, not the shower they are at the moment.

Sneyd would do a job in the NRL, no doubt in my mind. I’m not saying he’d be a top player or at a top club but he is a prime example of the sort of guy who’d be wrote off by people who believe the NRL is 17 bionic men per team each and every week. I’ve just had a flick through the team lists from this weekend and nobody can tell me he isn’t better than Sezer, Hutchinson, Cogger etc. Those 3 guys hardly looked Superleague quality over here.

Re: Bevan French 4yr deal : Fri Apr 05, 2024 6:10 pm  

Sezer gets a starting shirt in the NRL, now just imagine for one awful second that French had announced he was going home at the end of last season and the club announced that Sezer would be his replacement, meltdown amongst the Wigan fanbase wouldn't cover it and can you imagine the mockery over on RedVee

Re: Bevan French 4yr deal : Fri Apr 05, 2024 8:19 pm  

There is no denying that the NRL is the better comp and I suppose having 17 teams (potentially rising) dilutes the quality a little but some people make out each NRL team has 17 supermen playing each week and our best players are comparible with their worst. For me that’s not the case, I honestly think more Wigan players would get spots in the NRL than wouldn’t, same with Saints. I know it’s early doors but loads of opposition Superleague fans said Smithies and KPP would be back in no time without making the grade, both have gone straight into the 13 and both are doing well, Pryce who couldn’t hold down a spot at Huddersfield is getting good reviews from the reserve grade and fans are calling for him to get in the 17 at Newcastle.
French I have no doubt would get a contract for a club as a half in the NRL, the level of halves in the NRL isn’t great at the moment but his game is better suited to Superleague and Wigan will be paying him a big marquee wage and have given him a 4 year deal, NRL clubs would likely be offering him less money and a much shorter contract, maybe you could say he’s not backed himself but rugby is a short career and it’s about making as much money as possible really, if French went to Oz next year on a 2 year deal for less money he would be 31 by the time his next contact started and the likelihood of him getting a big deal at 31 to make it worthwhile financially would be quite slim imo plus he’s got a better chance to extend his career even further over here.

Re: Bevan French 4yr deal : Sat Apr 06, 2024 9:03 am  

I was reading a bit on Smithies from a raiders fans point of view. It stinks of the same attitude that some of our own SL fans believe.
He hit 40 tackles, ran 100m+ and did 80 minutes. He topped the tackle count and was pretty high up on metres made. Comments like wait until we get him fit and when we get him on the weights was pretty much the whole topic. It begged the question, how has he done all this while obviously so inferior? While the super athletes in the same team haven't hit the tackles or the metres, especially when both are combined in that same game?
Obviously some cracking players over there but not all are super stars. The depth and standard of average is better, leading to more intensity on a more regular basis. That keeps your better players having to play at a higher level more often. I also imagine some of our lads who have gone over and not made it and many NRL with almost careers who come here, are in the same boat as some young players of our own academy (like what has been mentioned). They end up with good SL careers but at 20 are let go from Wigan, Saints and Leeds because they was deemed not quite good enough at that stage. Some 50 games in they would be at the NRL average level or even more. Example players like Ellis who to me seems better than quite a few forwards on display in most rounds over there.
I think we are all guilty of the Raider fan outlook, Dupree is sort of an example of most of what I have just wrote. He was let go from Leeds, forged a reputation at lower level before SL at Salford then on to a GF winner at Wigan... He was a massive part of our role to that GF and his stats hold up well. I'm still guilty of that raiders fan mentality though ...
"Wait until he's Wigan fit" and "can't wait until he's had a pre season with us" and so on.
Maybe some truth but I do think some of it is a players attitude because of the path they have had to walk and a large dose of being in the right place under the right coach at the right time for things to work out.
Bevan was looking like a super star over there his strike rate was as good as it gets, injury at the wrong moment, allied to maybe the wrong coach and then maybe some of his own attitude or issues all ended with him playing lower grade. I think fans had binned him because of a game he said he was forced to play injured where he took the ball up once from wing. I'm sure both sides of that story are maybe true depending on where your standing.. What that did was give one of the most natural rugby players you could see a move to SL and Wigan. Both needed each other at that same point of time and I couldn't be happier they did. He found the team mates, fans, club and most definitely coach he needed and we found a player who's given us a highlight reel as good as any. If he does stay the full contract and can stay reasonably fit we will have seen one of the best to adorn the shirt. He is in that category for me.
I imagine that story could have many different paths and I do believe if things had worked out different we would be looking at a top end NRL player with if only he played for us wishes every time we saw some magic.

Re: Bevan French 4yr deal : Sat Apr 06, 2024 11:09 am  

That Mon wrote:

I was reading a bit on Smithies from a raiders fans point of view. It stinks of the same attitude that some of our own SL fans believe.
He hit 40 tackles, ran 100m+ and did 80 minutes. He topped the tackle count and was pretty high up on metres made. Comments like wait until we get him fit and when we get him on the weights was pretty much the whole topic. It begged the question, how has he done all this while obviously so inferior? While the super athletes in the same team haven't hit the tackles or the metres, especially when both are combined in that same game?
Obviously some cracking players over there but not all are super stars. The depth and standard of average is better, leading to more intensity on a more regular basis. That keeps your better players having to play at a higher level more often. I also imagine some of our lads who have gone over and not made it and many NRL with almost careers who come here, are in the same boat as some young players of our own academy (like what has been mentioned). They end up with good SL careers but at 20 are let go from Wigan, Saints and Leeds because they was deemed not quite good enough at that stage. Some 50 games in they would be at the NRL average level or even more. Example players like Ellis who to me seems better than quite a few forwards on display in most rounds over there.
I think we are all guilty of the Raider fan outlook, Dupree is sort of an example of most of what I have just wrote. He was let go from Leeds, forged a reputation at lower level before SL at Salford then on to a GF winner at Wigan... He was a massive part of our role to that GF and his stats hold up well. I'm still guilty of that raiders fan mentality though ...
"Wait until he's Wigan fit" and "can't wait until he's had a pre season with us" and so on.
Maybe some truth but I do think some of it is a players attitude because of the path they have had to walk and a large dose of being in the right place under the right coach at the right time for things to work out.
Bevan was looking like a super star over there his strike rate was as good as it gets, injury at the wrong moment, allied to maybe the wrong coach and then maybe some of his own attitude or issues all ended with him playing lower grade. I think fans had binned him because of a game he said he was forced to play injured where he took the ball up once from wing. I'm sure both sides of that story are maybe true depending on where your standing.. What that did was give one of the most natural rugby players you could see a move to SL and Wigan. Both needed each other at that same point of time and I couldn't be happier they did. He found the team mates, fans, club and most definitely coach he needed and we found a player who's given us a highlight reel as good as any. If he does stay the full contract and can stay reasonably fit we will have seen one of the best to adorn the shirt. He is in that category for me.
I imagine that story could have many different paths and I do believe if things had worked out different we would be looking at a top end NRL player with if only he played for us wishes every time we saw some magic.

Take all the South Seas Islanders out of the equation and it wouldn’t look great.