Re: Wigan v Sts discussion - THIS THREAD ONLY PLEASE : Sat Mar 30, 2024 2:43 pm  

If we’d of finished with 13 I think we would have won that game. The ref was shocking and I’ll see it with cherry and white glasses but we got penalised for a lot of things that saints were doing mainly around the ruck. The cards I have no issue with; Dupree lead with the arm hit the guys chest and it came up to his face. Byrne was a stupid one and although people say Percival slightly dipped it was no were near enough for Byrne to have mitigation. I can understand fatigue sets in but Jesus Christ player need to start dipping for tackle's.French did drop the ball for his try, begs the question if that camera filmed it clearly, why does the video ref cam look so poor. Do they enhance the picture after it’s filmed or something. I still stick by that even though I hate loosing on GF I can live with that one as I know this team (based on some of last years performances) could have won that. Saints looked shattered at times in that game and I’m not 100% sure that they had anymore in them to raise their performance, a saints fan would probably have to correct me on this. We really need to focus on our discipline because it will cost us games. I think we’ll be without Dupree and Byrne next week maybe Thompson.

Re: Wigan v Sts discussion - THIS THREAD ONLY PLEASE : Sat Mar 30, 2024 2:49 pm  

Zig wrote:

I want to see 13 against 13. As for the indiscretion of Dodd, a trip was automatically a red card in the past it has now been downgraded to a yellow. Serious question, should players be allowed to lead with the forearm full stop?

I think they should be allowed to lead with the forearm as long as it’s not to the face/head. It’s obviously natural going into a collision that you’re going to put your arm out both for momentum and a bit of protection. Theres a fine line though between getting someone with the forearm and getting someone with the elbow so you’d have to get it right. Dupree in this instance clearly went with the elbow instead of the forearm

Re: Wigan v Sts discussion - THIS THREAD ONLY PLEASE : Sat Mar 30, 2024 2:52 pm  

WWste wrote:

If we’d of finished with 13 I think we would have won that game. The ref was shocking and I’ll see it with cherry and white glasses but we got penalised for a lot of things that saints were doing mainly around the ruck. The cards I have no issue with; Dupree lead with the arm hit the guys chest and it came up to his face. Byrne was a stupid one and although people say Percival slightly dipped it was no were near enough for Byrne to have mitigation. I can understand fatigue sets in but Jesus Christ player need to start dipping for tackle's.French did drop the ball for his try, begs the question if that camera filmed it clearly, why does the video ref cam look so poor. Do they enhance the picture after it’s filmed or something. I still stick by that even though I hate loosing on GF I can live with that one as I know this team (based on some of last years performances) could have won that. Saints looked shattered at times in that game and I’m not 100% sure that they had anymore in them to raise their performance, a saints fan would probably have to correct me on this. We really need to focus on our discipline because it will cost us games. I think we’ll be without Dupree and Byrne next week maybe Thompson.

Why Thompson?

Re: Wigan v Sts discussion - THIS THREAD ONLY PLEASE : Sat Mar 30, 2024 2:53 pm  

WWste wrote:

If we’d of finished with 13 I think we would have won that game. The ref was shocking and I’ll see it with cherry and white glasses but we got penalised for a lot of things that saints were doing mainly around the ruck. The cards I have no issue with; Dupree lead with the arm hit the guys chest and it came up to his face. Byrne was a stupid one and although people say Percival slightly dipped it was no were near enough for Byrne to have mitigation. I can understand fatigue sets in but Jesus Christ player need to start dipping for tackle's.French did drop the ball for his try, begs the question if that camera filmed it clearly, why does the video ref cam look so poor. Do they enhance the picture after it’s filmed or something. I still stick by that even though I hate loosing on GF I can live with that one as I know this team (based on some of last years performances) could have won that. Saints looked shattered at times in that game and I’m not 100% sure that they had anymore in them to raise their performance, a saints fan would probably have to correct me on this. We really need to focus on our discipline because it will cost us games. I think we’ll be without Dupree and Byrne next week maybe Thompson.

Interesting observation, I think we are a very fit team that puts in a tonne of effort. In big games I’d say we always look knackered towards the end, but it’s the kind of knackered where they’re still running their blood to water despite it. There’s been many games where I thought we were out on our feet but still managed to not concede. That said, the Catalan semi last year immediately comes to mind as a time when fatigue clearly played a huge part in costing us the game. Lees giving away a daft penalty and then the lazy tackle attempts on Tomkins. I suppose when you play such a high energy game, that kind of thing is bound to happen sometimes. It’s why we really need to improve on our attack so we can put some points on the board with our earlier dominance

Re: Wigan v Sts discussion - THIS THREAD ONLY PLEASE : Sat Mar 30, 2024 3:06 pm  

Phuzzy wrote:

Why Thompson?

He came back on after the HIA but I’d like to think if we can spare him next week we should. Lads been great and 5 games we’ve played he’s had two head knocks. Give him a rest if possible

Re: Wigan v Sts discussion - THIS THREAD ONLY PLEASE : Sat Mar 30, 2024 3:16 pm  

The Reaper wrote:

Interesting observation, I think we are a very fit team that puts in a tonne of effort. In big games I’d say we always look knackered towards the end, but it’s the kind of knackered where they’re still running their blood to water despite it. There’s been many games where I thought we were out on our feet but still managed to not concede. That said, the Catalan semi last year immediately comes to mind as a time when fatigue clearly played a huge part in costing us the game. Lees giving away a daft penalty and then the lazy tackle attempts on Tomkins. I suppose when you play such a high energy game, that kind of thing is bound to happen sometimes. It’s why we really need to improve on our attack so we can put some points on the board with our earlier dominance

Two run in with Leeds and a game against Wigan probs reading probs caught up. It’s still 5 games in and how we built in to last season I’m sure you still have growth. As a Wigan fan it feels a lot better than coming away from the games under Wolfe and Holbrook were we were hanging on for our lives and couldn’t cope with saints (at times your team looked superhuman) now it looks like it’s balanced and on paper I do think we should have won, games not played on paper obviously. You talking about the HIA tackle on Thompson? I don’t remember seeing any other tackle on Thompson, I’ve seen the HIA one and it looks like a clash of heads he’d be unlucky to get a ban for that. I’ve calmed down a bit from yesterday, Good luck for the season im sure you’ll sort the attack out.

Re: Wigan v Sts discussion - THIS THREAD ONLY PLEASE : Sat Mar 30, 2024 11:10 pm  

The Reaper wrote:

I think they should be allowed to lead with the forearm as long as it’s not to the face/head. It’s obviously natural going into a collision that you’re going to put your arm out both for momentum and a bit of protection. Theres a fine line though between getting someone with the forearm and getting someone with the elbow so you’d have to get it right. Dupree in this instance clearly went with the elbow instead of the forearm

So if the forearm hits the face/head then it should be a red? I don’t think that is the way the rules are being applied.

Re: Wigan v Sts discussion - THIS THREAD ONLY PLEASE : Sun Mar 31, 2024 12:59 am  

Zig wrote:

So if the forearm hits the face/head then it should be a red? I don’t think that is the way the rules are being applied.

No it’s not, I thought you were just asking me what my opinion was on whether leading with the forearm should be allowed or not. I wouldn’t say if a forearm hits the face it should be an auto red either, you can use common sense and take into account force and point of initial impact etc. If it’s direct to the head with a lot of force then ofc it should be a red. It’s just my opinion that leading with the forearm shouldn’t really be a problem as long as it’s not high as I think it’s a fairly natural thing to do when going into a collision

Again, I’m ok with Dupree getting a yellow, I just thought it would be a red based on my interpretation of the rules as they are. He hit the chest first so I’m fine with it not being a red. He did get him in the face with his elbow with a good amount of force though! I’d be surprised if he doesn’t pick up a ban, tho I’d honestly rather he didn’t as I’d rather the MRP be loved off other than grading the severity of red cards/things the ref has put on report or serious foul play that was clearly missed. Cant stand players getting bans for minor poop.

Re: Wigan v Sts discussion - THIS THREAD ONLY PLEASE : Sun Mar 31, 2024 9:00 am  

Reading some of the stuff on here I must have watched a different game on Friday.

What I saw was a Saints team that made 4 breaks compared to Wigan making 0.

What I saw was an admittedly very hard working Thompson make poor post contact metres and dominated in a few collisions. Compare that to Walmsley who scattered defenders for fun and Knowles who was the best player on the pitch. Thompson must earn more on his own than those two put together.

Lees was MOM and we had Matautia playing prop, second row and centre at different times and not looking out of place in any position. Who else can do that??

I love this narrative too that there’s loads of improvement left in Wigan but not Saints. Wardle was going to humiliate Hurrell apparently. What I saw was one running over the top of the other for his try.

Yes the dry tracks will help Wigan but when the wet weather comes again in October then we have the superior pack and the game plan to suit. Let’s not forget that despite the Walters, Cooper and Havard excuses, we have Bell and Passi to come back into that pack. Bell is probably the player of the season in the forwards.

Are we also ignoring we lost Percival and Batchelor for the last 20-25 mins too??

Wigan defended outstandingly well and showed they are a Champion team. Our attack is still off but in mitigation we have had a different 2-5 all season with Makinson, Hurrell and Percival all missing games and Blake finding his feet. Compare that to Wigan having a settled 2-5 all season.

Of course the red card was a factor but there’s nothing to say how the game would’ve finished without it. No one knows.

The fact remains that Wigan didn’t make a single break all game and there’s an argument to say that French lost control anyway so on another day they could’ve been nilled.

I’ve seen a few Wigan fans saying they would go unbeaten all season and Saints are finished. We are gone, no threat anymore.

Well there’s life in the old dog yet and I wouldn’t bet against us when we play you again.

Re: Wigan v Sts discussion - THIS THREAD ONLY PLEASE : Sun Mar 31, 2024 9:15 am  

Stu M wrote:

Reading some of the stuff on here I must have watched a different game on Friday.

What I saw was a Saints team that made 4 breaks compared to Wigan making 0.

What I saw was an admittedly very hard working Thompson make poor post contact metres and dominated in a few collisions. Compare that to Walmsley who scattered defenders for fun and Knowles who was the best player on the pitch. Thompson must earn more on his own than those two put together.

Lees was MOM and we had Matautia playing prop, second row and centre at different times and not looking out of place in any position. Who else can do that??

I love this narrative too that there’s loads of improvement left in Wigan but not Saints. Wardle was going to humiliate Hurrell apparently. What I saw was one running over the top of the other for his try.

Yes the dry tracks will help Wigan but when the wet weather comes again in October then we have the superior pack and the game plan to suit. Let’s not forget that despite the Walters, Cooper and Havard excuses, we have Bell and Passi to come back into that pack. Bell is probably the player of the season in the forwards.

Are we also ignoring we lost Percival and Batchelor for the last 20-25 mins too??

Wigan defended outstandingly well and showed they are a Champion team. Our attack is still off but in mitigation we have had a different 2-5 all season with Makinson, Hurrell and Percival all missing games and Blake finding his feet. Compare that to Wigan having a settled 2-5 all season.

Of course the red card was a factor but there’s nothing to say how the game would’ve finished without it. No one knows.

The fact remains that Wigan didn’t make a single break all game and there’s an argument to say that French lost control anyway so on another day they could’ve been nilled.

I’ve seen a few Wigan fans saying they would go unbeaten all season and Saints are finished. We are gone, no threat anymore.

Well there’s life in the old dog yet and I wouldn’t bet against us when we play you again.

The old narrative that Saints players do it for the love of the game Walmsley and Knowles get paid in Tesco vouchers I believe.

Enjoy the win. It was two sides with commitment levels through the roof but one played pretty well with the ball and had better discipline (according to the ref anyway and that’s the man that counts) and the others execution was poor and discipline terrible. The second side got done in the last 7 minutes, with 12 men for the second time in the game and has far more reasons to think it’ll improve as the season goes on IMO. It still might not be enough because Saints are a great side but we’ll see how it plays out. It’s a long old season!