Re: Question for any Referees : Mon Aug 02, 2021 4:02 pm  

jonh wrote:

For me the on field call of try or no try is promoting too many reasons for the video ref to not overrule the decision.

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It must be looking at last night. People weren’t happy with the Charnley/Marshall incident but even if they’d gone upstairs they’d have given it. That last night was just terrible. I couldn’t quite believe my eyes. They say they need concrete proof to overturn the on field decision, well they had that and ignored it. It’s as though he actually missed the fact you could see the ball was up on the one angle that showed it and just moved past it. I froze that replay a couple of times and it is absolutely cast iron that Charnley didn’t get the ball down. The on field guys can get things wrong in the heat of the moment but the VR shouldn’t be.

Re: Question for any Referees : Mon Aug 02, 2021 4:28 pm  

I’m a wire fan and I have to agree no way was that a try last night. The commentary team knew the pundits at the end knew it the fans knew it and I’m going to sat the video ref knew it. The problem is this the sending up of try no try is ruining it, if a decision needs to be sent up it should just be the video refs call alone.

Re: Question for any Referees : Mon Aug 02, 2021 5:08 pm  

Grimmy wrote:

I've not seen the Gale/Child incident so can't comment. Can you not see that it's a bit hurtful calling a whole group of people (99.999% of which weren't involved in that decision) a cancer? Match officials get into it because they are passionate about rugby league, none of them want to spoil the game.

Protection - Bullock is clearly dropped by Lam and none of us really know why because we don't need to. Lam isn't going to go to the papers and say he has done X Y and Z. The RFL deal with things in a similar manner, officials are dropped and promoted every week based on performance following in depth video review of every call from every level of the pro and semi pro game.

I don't know where you think all these ex-pros are who you think are willing/able to referee top level rugby games. A well respected ex-Wigan player who is still involved with the club did meet with the RFL about becoming match official about three years ago. He found out the (lack of) money involved compared with the work required and quickly declined. Another couldn't pass the fitness test and jacked in after a few kids games. Maybe we should just play without officials and let the players sort it out until all these ex-pros who are happy to take all this abuse for peanuts make themselves known. That's besides the obvious point that a 34 year old who has spent 20 years playing rugby might not be as good an official as a 34 year old who has spent 20 years officiating rugby. I do think we need to try to attract ex-pros FWIW, but you're dreaming if you think many will want to do it unless we miraculously find a lot of money to pay them.

But you all just stick up for each other. One of my best mates is actually a ref and the arguments as get into are unreal because he takes the same 'whataboutism' approach.

Do you not think it's unfair (& apply this to every level of the game) that refs up and down the country and across sports are ruining games? If I have a bad game at the weekend, I have to sit in the changing room with my mates and look them in the eye, knowing I've let then down. That never happens with a ref, in all my years of playing, I've never had a ref walk into the sheds and say sorry or that they f-up. It's sickening, especially in the big games. Finals lost etc because a ref has dropped a clanger, but won't say sorry.

Make the club's pay into a pot that has to be spent on funding ex pros to become refs. I shudder to think what our club paid for the work on that cr@ppy badge etc. Improving the standard of refs should be the number 1 priority, because it's the biggest issue. Once again tho it's the old "we're broke" line. Same excuse for letting Covid make a mockery of the season. Same excuse for a low SC limit etc. Yet there's fat cat directors at the RFL doing a bad job and getting paid for it.

Re: Question for any Referees : Mon Aug 02, 2021 6:11 pm  

sergeant pepper wrote:

But you all just stick up for each other. One of my best mates is actually a ref and the arguments as get into are unreal because he takes the same 'whataboutism' approach.

Do you not think it's unfair (& apply this to every level of the game) that refs up and down the country and across sports are ruining games? If I have a bad game at the weekend, I have to sit in the changing room with my mates and look them in the eye, knowing I've let then down. That never happens with a ref, in all my years of playing, I've never had a ref walk into the sheds and say sorry or that they f-up. It's sickening, especially in the big games. Finals lost etc because a ref has dropped a clanger, but won't say sorry.

Make the club's pay into a pot that has to be spent on funding ex pros to become refs. I shudder to think what our club paid for the work on that cr@ppy badge etc. Improving the standard of refs should be the number 1 priority, because it's the biggest issue. Once again tho it's the old "we're broke" line. Same excuse for letting Covid make a mockery of the season. Same excuse for a low SC limit etc. Yet there's fat cat directors at the RFL doing a bad job and getting paid for it.

If you honestly think refs up and down the country across sports are ruining games then I'd suggest it's down to one of two things:

1. You don't understand certain decisions/agree with the rules the clubs voted for and just assume the ref is incompetent (I've seen instances of this from you on here, even when faced with meticulous explanation).
Or 2. The standards you expect have proven to be unachievable by humans doing their best in however many years you have been watching/playing the sport.

The level of scrutiny in the pro and semi pro game is unbelievable. The match officials spend a hell of a lot more time reviewing each match than the clubs involved do. A match official will be dropped for one bad decision in one game, unlike a player who will generally have to be poor for a sustained period and even then may keep his spot. If you think the officials don't care then you're miles off the mark there too. Maybe at amateur level where there is little scrutiny and there are some bad apples, but not at pro or semi pro level. Everyone at that level is going out to do their best and feels bad if they drop a clanger.

Does your best mate know you think he is a cancer to the game?

Re: Question for any Referees : Mon Aug 02, 2021 6:31 pm  

As soon as I hear anyone talking abut 'bent' refs, i stop taking them seriously. Anyone who thinks refs are bent, or biased against Wigan (or any other team) need to give their head a wobble.

Re: Question for any Referees : Mon Aug 02, 2021 6:53 pm  

Grimmy wrote:

If you honestly think refs up and down the country across sports are ruining games then I'd suggest it's down to one of two things:

1. You don't understand certain decisions/agree with the rules the clubs voted for and just assume the ref is incompetent (I've seen instances of this from you on here, even when faced with meticulous explanation).
Or 2. The standards you expect have proven to be unachievable by humans doing their best in however many years you have been watching/playing the sport.

The level of scrutiny in the pro and semi pro game is unbelievable. The match officials spend a hell of a lot more time reviewing each match than the clubs involved do. A match official will be dropped for one bad decision in one game, unlike a player who will generally have to be poor for a sustained period and even then may keep his spot. If you think the officials don't care then you're miles off the mark there too. Maybe at amateur level where there is little scrutiny and there are some bad apples, but not at pro or semi pro level. Everyone at that level is going out to do their best and feels bad if they drop a clanger.

Does your best mate know you think he is a cancer to the game?

Refs don't get to make mistakes. Simple as that. Players get to make them, as they the ones actually playing the game. There's zero reason why someone as no talented as Hicks should be allowed to mess up a game. It's completely unacceptable. I've not paid my money to see that.

Meticulous explanation . You mean shifting the goal posts to cover up this week's clanger? We've said it before and others agree - one week it's all about player safety, the next it's about ignoring someone taking a blow to the head. The second a boot hit Marshalls head, the match should have been stopped. Just like it did when Phibiln went down when Isa bumped him off.

I doubt very much that Hicks feels bad for dropping a clanger btw You only need to listen to the tool to work out that he's there for his TV time and nothing else.

Btw, yeah he does or I tell him so. Different sport, as it's RU, but everything I hate about the game i.e how sanitised it is. How much control the refs have etc, he's all for it. People like him are killing the game.

Re: Question for any Referees : Mon Aug 02, 2021 9:54 pm  

sergeant pepper wrote:

Refs don't get to make mistakes. Simple as that. Players get to make them, as they the ones actually playing the game. There's zero reason why someone as no talented as Hicks should be allowed to mess up a game. It's completely unacceptable. I've not paid my money to see that.

Meticulous explanation . You mean shifting the goal posts to cover up this week's clanger? We've said it before and others agree - one week it's all about player safety, the next it's about ignoring someone taking a blow to the head. The second a boot hit Marshalls head, the match should have been stopped. Just like it did when Phibiln went down when Isa bumped him off.

I doubt very much that Hicks feels bad for dropping a clanger btw You only need to listen to the tool to work out that he's there for his TV time and nothing else.

Btw, yeah he does or I tell him so. Different sport, as it's RU, but everything I hate about the game i.e how sanitised it is. How much control the refs have etc, he's all for it. People like him are killing the game.

Are you from Warrington ? You seem very aggressive

Re: Question for any Referees : Mon Aug 02, 2021 10:55 pm  

A cancer here, so thought I'd throw my 2 cents in as refs are taking a hammering.

Refs don't care eh? Well I've sat in changing rooms after games, not looking team mates in the eye, but myself after dropping a clanger. Believe me, it hurts as much as it does the players. I've apologised to coaches and players, but they don't give a toss or appreciate the apologies so it's no worth the effort or risk of further confrontation. How often do players and coaches genuinely appreciate the refs? It'll be a brief handshake and an empty "thanks ref"

Killing all levels of the game? Well if people like me didn't get out reffing, turning down better paid overtime at work, or sacrificing time with family, there would be NO community game, no NCL etc. Match officials are subject to intense scrutiny, but just because it's not done in public, doesn't mean it doesn't happen or that there is no consequences.
I've sat in the south stand and argued about decisions with many a fan, and unfortunately, several don't understand the laws and interpretations, and blatantly don't want to. They just want a scapegoat and some one to abuse for the sheer hell of it.

Attracting and retaining refs is one of the biggest problems in the game and reading stuff here it is no surprise. You imagine, going to a game, alone, no support, and being exposed to this hatred. Would you want to, or be able to improve? No. The toxicity means next week, there's isn't enough refs. So guys take on 2/3/4 games in a weekend. They get tired, they make mistakes. And a vicious circle continues. Or games get cancelled.

But at the end of the day, we're just a cancer so no need to treat us with any respect.