Re: Go forward : Tue Mar 16, 2021 12:57 pm  

MattyB wrote:

Heard it was more his dad.

*You know the type..... there's a number of them at every age group at every amateur club up and down the country.

I had a PM once saying a bloke voicing his displeasure on here was Hampshire’s dad. Not the way to go about things surely and after being peeved about being a utility player here, he’s gone on to be a utility player at Cas, Leigh and Wakey, so it looks like even teams lower down the pecking order haven’t fancied him as a halfback either.

Re: Go forward : Tue Mar 16, 2021 1:09 pm  

The pieman wrote:

what i was trying to suggest is that you have 2 young half backs who came through at the same time. Lots of hype about them. 1 is fulfilling his potential whilst the other (based on the hype on forums / agent talk etc) isnt

if you was going to advise Harry Smith about fulfilling his potential, as Adrian Lam what would you be saying to him? I was using the Williams / Hampshire as an example of what can be achieved if you knuckle down. I am sure there are many other examples that he could use. George Williams wasnt always played in the halfs if i recall correctly, as he spent quite a bit of time at hooker.

The other way to look at it is 1 had a successful career at Wigan and now in Oz, whilst the other didnt, Whether fans think Hampshire was given a fair chance or not is now irrelevant, as coaches at Cas and Leigh also didnt see him as a half back, and i dont think he plays much time there at Wakey either.

i have nothing against Ryan Hampshire. Like i've said in another post, based on forum talk both him and Williams were the next Wigan / GB half back pairing for years to come, but it clearly hasnt worked out that way for whatever reason. It could be ability, work ethic, talent, i genuinely dont know

Rocky is one of the hardest working players playing the game.

I think there were a few issues with his time at Wigan which caused him to lose a bit of career momentum.

Wigan youth system is getting a bit of a reputation of not looking after the junior players from Yorkshire as it does the local lads. Appreciate there is always going to be banter but it seems a little more than that almost an us against them mentality.

Not saying it is true but I’ve heard it from quite a few lads and it probably doesn’t do our ability to attract lads from Yorkshire any favours. Rocky certainly felt that way.

Another issue was the rigidity of the systems. He was a natural off the cuff player and one of the best you will see. Played with his eyes up, Wigan wanted him to conform to a more structured style of play which isn’t really his game. He did try to go along with it but ultimately it was a bit of a square peg round hole situation.

His advisors could see it wasn’t working for him and probably became a bit too vocal about it.

I think the time he spent at Wigan ultimately damaged his progress and if he had worked with another coach/system that allowed him to play his natural game he’d currently be held in higher regard,

Smith for me is much more suited to the organiser structured role he will be asked to play. I’d say there are more comparisons with Deacon than others mentioned. A lad with a controlling style who can also offer that bit of threat from time to time, but generally directs traffic and sets up field position/plays.

Re: Go forward : Tue Mar 16, 2021 1:26 pm  

jonh wrote:

Rocky is one of the hardest working players playing the game.

I think there were a few issues with his time at Wigan which caused him to lose a bit of career momentum.

Wigan youth system is getting a bit of a reputation of not looking after the junior players from Yorkshire as it does the local lads. Appreciate there is always going to be banter but it seems a little more than that almost an us against them mentality.

Not saying it is true but I’ve heard it from quite a few lads and it probably doesn’t do our ability to attract lads from Yorkshire any favours. Rocky certainly felt that way.

Another issue was the rigidity of the systems. He was a natural off the cuff player and one of the best you will see. Played with his eyes up, Wigan wanted him to conform to a more structured style of play which isn’t really his game. He did try to go along with it but ultimately it was a bit of a square peg round hole situation.

His advisors could see it wasn’t working for him and probably became a bit too vocal about it.

I think the time he spent at Wigan ultimately damaged his progress and if he had worked with another coach/system that allowed him to play his natural game he’d currently be held in higher regard,

Smith for me is much more suited to the organiser structured role he will be asked to play. I’d say there are more comparisons with Deacon than others mentioned. A lad with a controlling style who can also offer that bit of threat from time to time, but generally directs traffic and sets up field position/plays.

Is it really? Who said that? What evidence is there?

Re: Go forward : Tue Mar 16, 2021 1:33 pm  

nathan_rugby wrote:

Is it really? Who said that? What evidence is there?

As I said not sure if it’s true but it is certainly the way some of the lads that have been in the system have said and felt and it is certainly a perception around some of the more elite juniors amateur level perhaps perpetuated by lads who still have links with their junior clubs.

Re: Go forward : Tue Mar 16, 2021 1:43 pm  

Whichever way it goes with Smith, he couldn't ask for a better setup or have better people around him.

Lam & Tommy are two top draw mentors. Hastings will be able to tell him a cautionary tale, or two, as well as other things.

Outside of that our development systems are 2nd to none. He'll get support, opportunity and a fair crack at establishing himself.

Re: Go forward : Tue Mar 16, 2021 5:19 pm  

I'm trying to think what young Yorkshire lads we've even got:

Smithies - first choice every week, even post-ban

Kilner - I'd expect to get more of a go this year. I'd assumed he was younger than Partington and Byrne but he isn't actually. Maybe he has a bit of a case that he should have had more than the one game to be fair. He looked good on debut.

Borough - Don't think he can claim he's better than Powell or Leuluai.

Anyone I missed?

Re: Go forward : Tue Mar 16, 2021 5:40 pm  

Grimmy wrote:

I'm trying to think what young Yorkshire lads we've even got:

Smithies - first choice every week, even post-ban

Kilner - I'd expect to get more of a go this year. I'd assumed he was younger than Partington and Byrne but he isn't actually. Maybe he has a bit of a case that he should have had more than the one game to be fair. He looked good on debut.

Borough - Don't think he can claim he's better than Powell or Leuluai.

Anyone I missed?

These tend to be lads that haven’t made first grade.

Now I appreciate there may be an element of sour grapes however I’ve known plenty of lads that haven’t made it at other clubs who speak highly of the experience regardless.

Re: Go forward : Tue Mar 16, 2021 5:41 pm  

Grimmy wrote:

I'm trying to think what young Yorkshire lads we've even got:

Smithies - first choice every week, even post-ban

Kilner - I'd expect to get more of a go this year. I'd assumed he was younger than Partington and Byrne but he isn't actually. Maybe he has a bit of a case that he should have had more than the one game to be fair. He looked good on debut.

Borough - Don't think he can claim he's better than Powell or Leuluai.

Anyone I missed?

Micky Mac,

EDIT - sorry just saw you meant who weve got now

Re: Go forward : Tue Mar 16, 2021 5:43 pm  

MattyB wrote:

Heard it was more his dad.

*You know the type..... there's a number of them at every age group at every amateur club up and down the country.

was his Dad, but the club acted very poorly in it all also

Re: Go forward : Tue Mar 16, 2021 6:01 pm  

jonh wrote:

These tend to be lads that haven’t made first grade.

Now I appreciate there may be an element of sour grapes however I’ve known plenty of lads that haven’t made it at other clubs who speak highly of the experience regardless.

Ah fair enough. Hard to say to be honest without really scrutinising at that level. The fact we are getting plenty lads from other areas coming through does show the door isn't shut at least.

I'd wager there is probably some basis to it at scholarship level though. You have a Wigan kid who the club have probably been keeping an eye on since he was 12, likely knows some of the people at the club already on a personal level, his club coach will probably know the scholarship coach. Then you have someone picked up by a scout based on a BARLA Cup game against Pats. Don't know him, no club coach in your ear about him.

You don't get to train with them much at that level and only have a few games. No prizes for guessing which player is probably going to get picked at first, especially in some positions where there are only one or two spots in the 17. If they can get past that hurdle then by academy stage I'd hope it would level out more as they are training together regularly and the coaches will have had more time to get to know the players. Not ideal but I don't know how it gets fixed without having more time with the players at an earlier stage somehow, but that's difficult at that age when they can't drive themselves, have school commitments and rarely play against teams from outside the county for their clubs.