[DaveO]

Re: O'Carroll signs for Hull : Tue Sep 06, 2011 8:43 pm  

jonh wrote:

Lauaki will play the secondrow, covering the frontrow as required, both Dudson and Flower can cover both front and backrow, although long term i feel both will be frontrowers.

Thomas gives us emergency cover in the pack and also at centre, allowing Joel to also cover the backrow.

Lauaki, Dudson, Flower and Thomas?

It should be Leigh fan talking about where they fit in next season not a Wigan fan!

Our recruitment strategy at the moment does seem a little risky but our hand has been somewhat forced by the quality of what is on the market, and players retiring/taking up contracts elsewhere.

There is no compulsion to sign anyone nor was there a reason to be unable to match Hull's deal for O'Carroll until we seemingly started signing dross and paying them wages we could have used for O'Carroll. Fielden and O'Carroll next year would have meant no need for any of the above front rowers in 2012.

We have had in my opinion thus far to target potential over quality, the important thing is that we tap into that potential very quickly and our ability to do that could decide our fate next year and beyond.

Wigan have always had a knack with players who looked good elsewhere of turning them into very good players but there has to be something there in the first place and to expect it to work out with so many average and one totally past it player is worse odds than Euromillions. If we really have signed those four the recruitment is woeful and will do nothing to help season ticket sales maintain their current level never mind increase.

Re: O'Carroll signs for Hull : Tue Sep 06, 2011 9:07 pm  

Here are some of the stats for the players that are rumoured to be signing with Wigan compared to some of the current Wigan players.

Metres per game / Carries per game / Metres per carry

Gil Dudson - 46 / 6 / 7.4
Hame Lauaki - 69 / 10 / 6.7
Ben Flower - 68 / 9 / 7.2
Andy Coley - 82 / 12 / 7.0
Gareth Hock - 76 / 11 / 7.2
Harrison Hansen - 67 / 11 / 6.1
Liam Farrell - 63 / 10 / 6.4
Chris Tuson - 36 / 6 / 6.2

Gareth Thomas - 81 / 11 / 7.4
Stefan Marsh - 52 / 10 / 5.0
Joel Tomkins - 83 / 13 / 6.4
George Carmont - 96 / 11 / 8.8


Tackles per game / Missed Tackles / Marker Tackles

Gil Dudson - 13 / 1 / 2.2
Ben Flower - 26 / 1.8 / 4.8
Hame Lauaki - 12 / 0.5 / 1.7
Andy Coley - 24 / 1.2 / 4
Gareth Hock - 15 / 0.5 / 0.8
Harrison Hansen - 25 / 1 / 3.8
Liam Farrell - 32 / 1 / 6.3
Chris Tuson - 18 / 0.9 / 3.4

Gareth Thomas - 20 / 1.2 / 3.5
Stefan Marsh - 14 / 1 / 1.6
Joel Tomkins - 18 / 1 / 3.1
George Carmont - 18 / 1 / 3


Tackle Busts / Clean Breaks (per game)

Gil Dudson - 0.2
Ben Flower - 1.3
Hame Lauaki - 1.4
Andy Coley - 0.5
Gareth Hock - 0.5
Harrison Hansen - 0.9
Liam Farrell - 1.5
Chris Tuson - 0.6

Gareth Thomas - 1.5 / 0.2
Stefan Marsh - 1 / 0.1
Joel Tomkins - 1.7 / 0.4
George Carmont - 2 / 0.6


Errors / Penalties (per game)

Gil Dudson - 0.2 / 0.1
Ben Flower - 0.3 / 0.8
Hame Lauaki - 0.4 / 0.5
Andy Coley - 0.4 / 0.6
Gareth Hock - 0.5 / 0.6
Harrison Hansen - 0.5 / 0.3
Liam Farrell - 0.4 / 0.6
Chris Tuson - 0.9 / 0.3

Gareth Thomas - 0.8 / 0.7
Stefan Marsh - 0.6 / 0
Joel Tomkins - 1.2 / 0.6
George Carmont - 1.1 / 0.3

Re: O'Carroll signs for Hull : Tue Sep 06, 2011 9:37 pm  

Cherry.Pie wrote:

Here are some of the stats for the players that are rumoured to be signing with Wigan compared to some of the current Wigan players.

Metres per game / Carries per game / Metres per carry

Gil Dudson - 46 / 6 / 7.4
Hame Lauaki - 69 / 10 / 6.7
Ben Flower - 68 / 9 / 7.2
Andy Coley - 82 / 12 / 7.0
Gareth Hock - 76 / 11 / 7.2
Harrison Hansen - 67 / 11 / 6.1
Liam Farrell - 63 / 10 / 6.4
Chris Tuson - 36 / 6 / 6.2

Gareth Thomas - 81 / 11 / 7.4
Stefan Marsh - 52 / 10 / 5.0
Joel Tomkins - 83 / 13 / 6.4
George Carmont - 96 / 11 / 8.8


Tackles per game / Missed Tackles / Marker Tackles

Gil Dudson - 13 / 1 / 2.2
Ben Flower - 26 / 1.8 / 4.8
Hame Lauaki - 12 / 0.5 / 1.7
Andy Coley - 24 / 1.2 / 4
Gareth Hock - 15 / 0.5 / 0.8
Harrison Hansen - 25 / 1 / 3.8
Liam Farrell - 32 / 1 / 6.3
Chris Tuson - 18 / 0.9 / 3.4

Gareth Thomas - 20 / 1.2 / 3.5
Stefan Marsh - 14 / 1 / 1.6
Joel Tomkins - 18 / 1 / 3.1
George Carmont - 18 / 1 / 3


Tackle Busts / Clean Breaks (per game)

Gil Dudson - 0.2
Ben Flower - 1.3
Hame Lauaki - 1.4
Andy Coley - 0.5
Gareth Hock - 0.5
Harrison Hansen - 0.9
Liam Farrell - 1.5
Chris Tuson - 0.6

Gareth Thomas - 1.5 / 0.2
Stefan Marsh - 1 / 0.1
Joel Tomkins - 1.7 / 0.4
George Carmont - 2 / 0.6


Errors / Penalties (per game)

Gil Dudson - 0.2 / 0.1
Ben Flower - 0.3 / 0.8
Hame Lauaki - 0.4 / 0.5
Andy Coley - 0.4 / 0.6
Gareth Hock - 0.5 / 0.6
Harrison Hansen - 0.5 / 0.3
Liam Farrell - 0.4 / 0.6
Chris Tuson - 0.9 / 0.3

Gareth Thomas - 0.8 / 0.7
Stefan Marsh - 0.6 / 0
Joel Tomkins - 1.2 / 0.6
George Carmont - 1.1 / 0.3

Going off those stats Ben Flower looks a handy player and could improve out of sight at a club like Wigan and Dudson again has materials to work with. His metres per carry is very impressive and if Wigan can get him fitter and stronger he could turn in to a very shrewd signing.

Thomas could have been a cracking League player but he came accross 10 years too late.

Re: O'Carroll signs for Hull : Tue Sep 06, 2011 10:30 pm  

DaveO wrote:

Lauaki, Dudson, Flower and Thomas?

It should be Leigh fan talking about where they fit in next season not a Wigan fan!

There is no compulsion to sign anyone nor was there a reason to be unable to match Hull's deal for O'Carroll until we seemingly started signing dross and paying them wages we could have used for O'Carroll. Fielden and O'Carroll next year would have meant no need for any of the above front rowers in 2012.

Wigan have always had a knack with players who looked good elsewhere of turning them into very good players but there has to be something there in the first place and to expect it to work out with so many average and one totally past it player is worse odds than Euromillions. If we really have signed those four the recruitment is woeful and will do nothing to help season ticket sales maintain their current level never mind increase.

So basically your beef seems to be losing O'Carroll a player we have coped without since.......forever! We have Fielden next year regardless, and more squad depth.

I fail to see any problem at all with losing O'Carroll a player who has never had a significant impact for 3 players with potential to actually make an impact next year and beyond.

Recently I have chosen to ignore most of your posts but the outcry against signing 3 players to replace 1 player in the team who realistically has contributed 0, is beyond belief.

I will personally back the club on this one and the Thomas deal for commercial reasons, there is no point debating with you as our views and opinions are poles apart hence my reason for ignoring most of your recent posts that only seem aimed at slating the club without seeing any of the blatant positives from the moves.

Re: O'Carroll signs for Hull : Wed Sep 07, 2011 6:47 am  

Until signings are announced a lot of the posts are speculation and until we see any of the actual signings perform in the Wigan shirt there cannot be constructive criticism.

Expecting major signings each year cannot be balanced by the development and retention of the Wigan academy players. Players will not be short changed just to stay at their home town club. Just as any young player knows that as long as Tomkins x2, Charnley, Farrell, Hansen,Prescott etc are staying then they will have to rely on players getting injured or be an exceptional talent to get in the first team and be a top class to be offered a deal that is better than can be gained elsewhere.

Re: O'Carroll signs for Hull : Wed Sep 07, 2011 9:56 am  

DaveO wrote:

Lauaki, Dudson, Flower and Thomas?

It should be Leigh fan talking about where they fit in next season not a Wigan fan!

There is no compulsion to sign anyone nor was there a reason to be unable to match Hull's deal for O'Carroll until we seemingly started signing dross and paying them wages we could have used for O'Carroll. Fielden and O'Carroll next year would have meant no need for any of the above front rowers in 2012.

Wigan have always had a knack with players who looked good elsewhere of turning them into very good players but there has to be something there in the first place and to expect it to work out with so many average and one totally past it player is worse odds than Euromillions. If we really have signed those four the recruitment is woeful and will do nothing to help season ticket sales maintain their current level never mind increase.

We have Fielden regardless because of his contract. O'Carroll has never played more than a handful of games before getting injured. So I am not sure why you are bleating about his loss.

Re: O'Carroll signs for Hull : Wed Sep 07, 2011 10:00 am  

Not keen on this decision tbh but time will tell.

Re: O'Carroll signs for Hull : Wed Sep 07, 2011 10:18 am  

Mr.No.It.All wrote:

Not keen on this decision tbh but time will tell.

The club offered him a new contract, but he rejected it. Granted the terms are likely to have been less than brilliant, but given his injury record, it is unfair to have expected Wigan to have offered much more than a year.

Re: O'Carroll signs for Hull : Wed Sep 07, 2011 11:12 am  

It would be a pity if the departure of O'Carroll was allowed to turn into the same type of melodrama that we had following the departure of Shaun Ainscough, a player who has not been missed by any stretch of the imagination.

I honestly don't see why O'Carroll, who - though it's down to injuries, to be fair to him - has barely played for Wigan in the Michael Maguire era, is suddenly such a loss.

Given what Wigan have achieved in the last two years, why is this kind of thing even an issue? With the best will in the world, we can't keep everyone - surely we all realise that? And Eamon O'Carroll's long-term absence up until now has not exactly been a blow to us.

Re: O'Carroll signs for Hull : Wed Sep 07, 2011 11:26 am  

We also have an excellent prospect coming through the ranks Tom Spencer who is much bigger than Eamon and I mean bigger in height not girth. Just ask Rogues.