: Sat Jun 27, 2009 5:47 pm  

AJ wrote:

Where to start......

WE DO NOT NEED TO SIGN A 2nd ROWER.

Hansen, Joel, Mossop, Farrell or even Coley (give him another year, it also gives us additional prop cover) can play there.

Simply not good enough if you want this Wigan team to become sucessful, Joel Tomkins needs to be played at LF, with O'Loughlin to play right second row, with another great second rower on the left.

The halfback MUST be Myler, he will be leaving Salford, IL MUST secure him for Wigan.

We will not sign him, no evidence to prove this, I just think he'll be at Salford next year, becuase end of 2010, he'll have far more teams bidding for him.

We also need a world class prop who can go for at least half a game and mix it and overcome Graham, Peacock et al.

I agree as does everyone, N. Cayless/C. Webb/L. Burgess would be great in our squad.

We also don't NEED a fullback, Phelps is more than capable there. Not to mention why would Hull KR release Briscoe?

Phelps, were to start average, average, average, cheap yes, taking a quota spot, thats why he'll go. Money talks in the world of SL

: Sat Jun 27, 2009 5:52 pm  

But Hansen & Joel have contracts - yet another reason we dont sign a SR.

Phelps is average, but is probably cheap, but does a job, if we start mauling around changing fullbacks when there are far greater positions in crisis then we will stay a lower tier SL club forever.

: Sat Jun 27, 2009 5:55 pm  

AJ wrote:

Re: Wingers

Isn't Roberts running at the same strike rate as Colbon? You know Liam Colbon, the lad who was hounded out last year.

Gardner is the perfect example, you can be beyond average to play on the wing and be successful.

Wasting money on "star" wingers like Richards & Roberts simpily isn't necessary.

lol @ comparing Colbon to Roberts.

: Sat Jun 27, 2009 5:59 pm  

[quote="The Sneak"][/quote]

TBH i couldnt care less if we didn't win anything next year, just as long as we were challenging up in the top 4/5 in the league, with a decent run in the cup. Basically something that we can point to and say progress!

I believe that this pack.....

Fielden
Riddell
NEW PROP

O'Loughlin
Mossop
J Tomkins

Bench
Feka
Leuluai [or interchange SH, preferably not!]
O'Carroll/Prescott
Flanagan/Farrell/Hansen

Is a good enough pack to get us up there.
Obviously Hock is a loss, but Mossop is a good player, and will have had 1/2 seasons first team superleague at a top 5/6 club this season, therefore imo should be ready to warrant a first team place. Hansen is a good player, not a world beater, but a good player. Hansen is the natural successor to Bailey, very sound defensively but i think Hansen offers a bit more in a attack, if you get the right halves next to him.

I'd be happy enough if we played that pack next year, and managed to get in the top 4/5, because the it's a very young pack overall and will only get better year on year. Not to mention it contains 5/6/7 wigan produced players.

: Sat Jun 27, 2009 5:59 pm  

RB wrote:

lol @ comparing Colbon to Roberts.

They have the same try scoring ratio. Is Roberts really worth everything on top we will be paying him?

: Sat Jun 27, 2009 5:59 pm  

AJ wrote:

But Hansen & Joel have contracts - yet another reason we dont sign a SR.

Phelps is average, but is probably cheap, but does a job, if we start mauling around changing fullbacks when there are far greater positions in crisis then we will stay a lower tier SL club forever.

I know they have contracts, not on about geting rid of Joel, just believe he's not playing his prefered position (Loose Forward)

Hansen could be used in a deal as £££ + him for another SL based player.

I'll stick by what I have already said, we'll sign

Aussie/NZ Prop
SL Based Prop
Second Row
If the budget goes far enough an FB.

Targets for the 6/7 position aren't good enough, the players people are talking of just ain't going to come here I.e Finch/Orford/Lockyer

Couple of posts above our targets look like Thorman and others on that forward

: Sat Jun 27, 2009 6:23 pm  

AJ wrote:

They have the same try scoring ratio. Is Roberts really worth everything on top we will be paying him?

Roberts' lack of try-scoring is not unrelated to our inability to play to the right. Good players do not become bad players overnight. Sometimes you have to show a little faith. In a better organised, better organised, better motivated side, players like Roberts and Riddell would be far more effective. You only need to look at their time in Aus to know that these guys are not stone jugs. Passing personal judgements on players straight away - and either getting rid of them or endlessly agonising because their contracts are preventing you getting rid - is not always the answer.

IMO, we'll only know how good some of our 'quieter' players are when we get a coach who they can respond to. Look at Mossop at Huddersfield. He's been pretty good in a team who are well up the table from us, yet 'we' didn't even regard him as being worthy of selection.

Wigan desperately need a new coaching regime. The current one, for whatever reason, is stifling the development of our young players, the flare of our quality players, and the enthusiasm of our older players.

If this post seems a little off-topic, I apologise - but there's been a worrying trend on this board in recent days to start siding with Noble. Get real, folks. He's a spent force, and we're being spent along with him.

: Sat Jun 27, 2009 6:26 pm  

Cruncher wrote:

Roberts' lack of try-scoring is not unrelated to our inability to play to the right. Good players do not become bad players overnight. Sometimes you have to show a little faith. In a better organised, better organised, better motivated side, players like Roberts and Riddell would be far more effective. You only need to look at their time in Aus to know that these guys are not stone jugs. Passing personal judgements on players straight away - and either getting rid of them or endlessly agonising because their contracts are preventing you getting rid - is not always the answer.

IMO, we'll only know how good some of our 'quieter' players are when we get a coach who they can respond to. Look at Mossop at Huddersfield. He's been pretty good in a team who are well up the table from us, yet 'we' didn't even regard him as being worthy of selection.

Wigan desperately need a new coaching regime. The current one, for whatever reason, is stifling the development of our young players, the flare of our quality players, and the enthusiasm of our older players.

If this post seems a little off-topic, I apologise - but there's been a worrying trend on this board in recent days to start siding with Noble. Get real, folks. He's a spent force, and we're being spent along with him.

exactly my thoughts tbh.

: Sat Jun 27, 2009 6:27 pm  

I would imagine that Lenegan has plans this year to sign one prop and a halfback, a lot depends on who we release, for example if we sign N Cayless and keep Coley, the resigning of Coley only stops a youngster gaining experience whether he plays in the frontrow or backrow.

Same regarding fullback, if we were to sign Hunt it forces Richards and Roberts to the wings, leaving no space for Ainscough or Veivers, the youngsters will never make the step up without game time, look at ST Helens getting rid of Long and are they are filling the position from within and will probably do the same if Gilmour leaves.

What worries me just like it does others, is the fact that nothing has been announced and there are no longer any rumours linking us with players, plus who the hell's making the decisions on signings Lenegan, Noble or the new coach?

What we mustn't do is rush to sign a player and then be stuck with nothing more than an average player, I actually cringed when I heard Thorman's name mentioned, if we make only two signing fore next year I'll be happy as long as there the right signings for Wigan.

[Wigan6/Leeds1 Andy]

: Sat Jun 27, 2009 7:08 pm  

Our pack quite frankly are a bunch of puddings who couldn't scare a little girl.

Fielden - A joke
Riddell - Fat and unfit
Coley - If only we played Salford every week
Feka - Fat ++++++ Unfit +++++++
O'Carroll - still a pup in prop terms and too small to put it about
Prescott - workhorse but isn't going to dominate his opposite number
Bailey - going
Hansen - going downhill at an alarming rate
Tomkins - Needs a decent halfback to run off like he did with Barrett
Locky - Our best forward by far (who can still play)

Hock was our one forward who was aggressive, happy to put it about and had the ability to bully the opposition. Now he's gone we need some serious surgery in the forward department if we want to compete for trophies.

As a minimum we need two props who will naughty person and a second row in the Hock/Watmough mode. There might have to be some casualties along the way and by that I mean lads who have come through the youth system, but we can't keep players just because they're Wiganers if they don't offer what the team needs to be successful.

Add to that we need a world class halfback to tutor Sam over the next couple of years.

In
Prop
Prop
SR
Halfback

Out
Smith
Coley
Hock
Bailey

"Casualties" (if we can find a taker)
Goulding
Hansen
Prescott

Promoted
Farrell
Mossop

Forced to run up and down Rivington Pike during the off-season
Riddell
Feka