Re: Rumours and signings v9 : Thu Oct 16, 2014 2:35 pm  

Aboveusonlypie wrote:

Yes I get this impression from watching the NRL on Premier. Every club seems to have 2 wingers who are tall, quick and powerful. Maybe that's why there has been no interest in Ryan Hall all these years. They just don't need our wingers. Forwards are a different matter.

Frankly I think going over at age 20/21 is a big risk. I know people say that he can get a Super League club easily, but there is a cautionary tale in what happened to Richie Mathers at Gold Coast and Jordan Tansey at the Roosters. They only played a handful of games between them and were never the same when they came back. We like to joke about Mathers, but he was a very useful player at Leeds.

A risk worth taking from the players point of view.

If Burgess does join Sydney I think he has the potential to be a bigger success than the likes of Mathers or Tansey and some might say Tomkins too. He is joining an excellent team and has the potential to score for fun behind a pack that will protect him. He will also have the pick of SL clubs should he wish to return and you would think that Wigan would be his first choice.

Even Mathers returned to a Wigan contract.

Perhaps the greater risk is to remain where he is? The door at Sydney may not be open forever so make hay while the sun shines.

Re: Rumours and signings v9 : Thu Oct 16, 2014 3:46 pm  

Can someone please enlighten me on how the salary cap works? It has been quoted several times that Burgess is only on 11K - does this mean he will have only earned 11K this year despite playing in so many games and being in a successful team? Lockers is on a contract of approx 100 -120K, I think, and I presume players such as Matty Smith and other established players are on 70-80K.
But how does the system work? Do they get paid this amount whether they play or not and whether they win or not? Or is this figure just the basic salary and there are win bonuses on top?
In the old days players would get a basic payment for playing and then win bonuses, the size of the bonus depending on the importance of the game. Does this win bonus system still happen - but if it does how can this be quantified precisely at the start of the season when nobody knows how successful a team will be and there is the finite maximum of the salary cap ( approx 1.8M - plus dispensations for home-grown players etc)? And if it doesn't, has poor Joe really only earned 11K this year?

Re: Rumours and signings v9 : Thu Oct 16, 2014 4:13 pm  

Fames wrote:

Can someone please enlighten me on how the salary cap works? It has been quoted several times that Burgess is only on 11K - does this mean he will have only earned 11K this year despite playing in so many games and being in a successful team? Lockers is on a contract of approx 100 -120K, I think, and I presume players such as Matty Smith and other established players are on 70-80K.
But how does the system work? Do they get paid this amount whether they play or not and whether they win or not? Or is this figure just the basic salary and there are win bonuses on top?
In the old days players would get a basic payment for playing and then win bonuses, the size of the bonus depending on the importance of the game. Does this win bonus system still happen - but if it does how can this be quantified precisely at the start of the season when nobody knows how successful a team will be and there is the finite maximum of the salary cap ( approx 1.8M - plus dispensations for home-grown players etc)? And if it doesn't, has poor Joe really only earned 11K this year?

Depends entirely on how Burgess' contract is structured. It's entirely possible that his base was 11k this year, and there weren't many bonuses on top of that. No one but the wigan club will be able to tell you if that's 11k base with bonuses, or 11k all in.

In terms of the cap there's 2 preconditions: first of all, is Burgess earning a base of under 20k? Since the answer is yes, it is assumed for the sake of the cap that he will appear 5 times that year - and his cap value becomes base + (appearance bonus x 5) - this is true regardless of whether he plays 1,5 or 27 games. Win bonuses on top of that assume the team will win 18 games that year, regardless of how many games the team actually wins - so his cap value will become base + (appearance bonus x 5) + (win bonus x 5) - this is how disparities between actual pay and cap value occur. It's also worth noting that the number of games assumed played etc changes depending on whether the player earns over 20k.

The second precondition is does that cap value place Burgess in the top 25 earners at the club? If the answer is no, than his cap value is 0! If it is yes, than the cap value remains the same regardless of actual earnings throughout the year...

Re: Rumours and signings v9 : Thu Oct 16, 2014 4:51 pm  

dany1979 wrote:

According to Wigan Observor Paramatta are interested in Dudson.

My dad said that last night, thought he was taking the mick!! I'd lose no sleep if Dudson moved on although maybe they'd manage a Sam Moa style transformation on him.

[Wigan6/Leeds1 Andy]

Re: Rumours and signings v9 : Thu Oct 16, 2014 4:56 pm  

NickyKiss wrote:

My dad said that last night, thought he was taking the mick!! I'd lose no sleep if Dudson moved on although maybe they'd manage a Sam Moa style transformation on him.

Had really high hopes for him 18 months ago, but has regressed at an alarming rate and is no more than a braindead penalty machine plodder.

Re: Rumours and signings v9 : Thu Oct 16, 2014 9:15 pm  

Indeed. Parra can't be that desperate can they? I don't think Dudson would shine even in the Championship.

Re: Rumours and signings v9 : Thu Oct 16, 2014 9:18 pm  

Played a few games for us in the championship.. absolutely awful

Re: Rumours and signings v9 : Fri Oct 17, 2014 10:47 am  

stillinthepast wrote:

On the Roosters Forum (Chookpen) it says that Sheck is expected to play Fullback with Tuopou on one wing and Joe on the other it goes on to say that Joe is on 11k in GB with 80/90k offered in Aus. I don't know which currency they are talking about but if it is the same in both cases it equals the same difference. They also say compared with other contracts in Aus it is no big deal.
Another thing is they do not seem to have there wingers high in the pecking order of importance, they think a realy good centre, halfback or blockbusting forward ( has one Aussie poster said) is worth far more than any winger, as long as a winger can run fast catch a ball and get it over the line they will do. They seem to think wingers are 10 a penny over there and are easy to come buy.

Could that view of wingers be the main reason why Hall has never moved there?

Re: Rumours and signings v9 : Fri Oct 17, 2014 12:43 pm  

I was checking out the Joe Burgess story regarding him signing for the Roosters when I noticed the thread headed "How did Wigan get so it wrong with Joe Burgess"
This thread seems to have been locked since 28/18 posted that we should not get carried away just on the one report which originated in the M.E.N. 14th Oct.,

I had noticed on the official Roosters web site (chookpen) a 8 page article on the subject of Joe going, on checking the first post on this thread (15th Oct) it said Roosters to sign Joe Burgess, source (Manchester Evening News)

I then checked the official Roosters site for the last 4 days and not one mention of signing Joe, this is also the case with the Sydney Morning Herald.

So it seems that the origin of this story leads back every time to the M.E.N. So could this not be just Agents putting little snippets of news/rumours in certain ears ?.

Re: Rumours and signings v9 : Fri Oct 17, 2014 12:51 pm  

The WEP says Wigan are pulling out all the stops to keep him but face an uphill battle.