Re: Moose McGuire : Sat Feb 11, 2023 1:09 am  

I don’t disagree with a lot you have said Jon, but one thing that I fundamentally disagree with is that any person can be deemed to be guilty of an offence in the public domain, when having not been found guilty in a court of law is abhorrent. Kangaroo courts and cancelling people on a whim should not be acceptable to a democratic society.

Re: Moose McGuire : Sat Feb 11, 2023 1:45 am  

Zig wrote:

I don’t disagree with a lot you have said Jon, but one thing that I fundamentally disagree with is that any person can be deemed to be guilty of an offence in the public domain, when having not been found guilty in a court of law is abhorrent. Kangaroo courts and cancelling people on a whim should not be acceptable to a democratic society.

I’m not sure where I said that.

It’s always innocent until proven guilty.

Non of us know what was said.

Let’s see how it plays out.

Re: Moose McGuire : Sat Feb 11, 2023 11:02 am  

jonh wrote:

I’m not sure where I said that.

It’s always innocent until proven guilty.

Non of us know what was said.

Let’s see how it plays out.

I was told it was allegedly a word beginning with an ‘s’ that idiots (more so 20 years back) would call a person with disabilities. I’m not getting in to the gradings of it being worse or better than some other types of slurs but it’s just so easily avoided. Bans were getting handed out like confetti for all manner of accidental offences last season, some were absolutely baffling, especially a couple of ones for contact with the ref, so to get a ban for something like this is madness on the players part. It’s not like it’s hard to stick to the F’s and C’s if he wants to start the verbals with another player.

Re: Moose McGuire : Sat Feb 11, 2023 11:39 am  

jonh wrote:

I’m not sure where I said that.

It’s always innocent until proven guilty.

Non of us know what was said.

Let’s see how it plays out.

My mistake, I apologise. I thought because you had listed Greenwood you were hinting that a player could be guilty even though it had not been proven in a court of law.

Re: Moose McGuire : Sat Feb 11, 2023 3:48 pm  

NickyKiss wrote:

I was told it was allegedly a word beginning with an ‘s’ that idiots (more so 20 years back) would call a person with disabilities. I’m not getting in to the gradings of it being worse or better than some other types of slurs but it’s just so easily avoided. Bans were getting handed out like confetti for all manner of accidental offences last season, some were absolutely baffling, especially a couple of ones for contact with the ref, so to get a ban for something like this is madness on the players part. It’s not like it’s hard to stick to the F’s and C’s if he wants to start the verbals with another player.

Wire play the Rhinos first up, how would the alleged comments be taken by Rhinos players and RL in general given the struggles that RL great R Burrow is going through. I think it says a lot about the respective character of a person if they have to resort to discriminatory comments when under duress. A prime example being T Clubb who deserved the ban he got.

Re: Moose McGuire : Sat Feb 11, 2023 8:09 pm  

sergeant pepper wrote:

Are you just going to ignore what I'd posted, or are you just going to keep trotting out more BS?

1. I don't know, or care what he said and it doesn't matter to me or a hell of a lot of others too. You want proof on that? Check out the revenue for Fury when he fights. Boxing again in know, but 1.6m people bought Tyson's exhibition bout in 2020 & he's a convicted rapist, who also said he wanted to eat someone's kids.

2. I'm not making excuses for them. I just don't care one iota what they say, think or do outside of 80mins on a rugby pitch. Simple as that really. Not sure why you, as a grown man do either?

Once again however, as you don't seem to grasp this - Having the big names, actually playing the game is the BIGGEST benefit to the sport. Not charity work, not outreach in the community or schools, not taking a knee or even helping old ladies cross the road. Delivering an exciting product on the field should be the #1 goal for RL. Having players sat in the stand is detrimental to that.

Now if you want to talk about fines instead of bans, I'm all for it. Just don't f your product up by limiting your biggest assets.

As a gay, disabled "grown man" I personally do care what is said both on and off the pitch, be it by players, fans or the mascot.

Society has moved on from the 80's where the "N" word was regularly thrown about, and whilst I'm not suggesting that word was said, other words can be just as harmful to minorities such as myself.

I know from personal experience how damaging inappropriate use of language can be.

"Grown men" should be grown up enough to understand that.

You included.

Re: Moose McGuire : Sat Feb 11, 2023 9:43 pm  

RainbowWarrior wrote:

As a gay, disabled "grown man" I personally do care what is said both on and off the pitch, be it by players, fans or the mascot.

Society has moved on from the 80's where the "N" word was regularly thrown about, and whilst I'm not suggesting that word was said, other words can be just as harmful to minorities such as myself.

I know from personal experience how damaging inappropriate use of language can be.

"Grown men" should be grown up enough to understand that.

You included.

Absolutely true. And you, me, anyone else should not be made to feel uncomfortable at a rugby game. Do you not think a large fine and some educational work we around language would be more productive all round though? I’m sure that would have resulted in an honest apology after realising what’s been said too?

Re: Moose McGuire : Sat Feb 11, 2023 9:56 pm  

Shabino wrote:

Absolutely true. And you, me, anyone else should not be made to feel uncomfortable at a rugby game. Do you not think a large fine and some educational work we around language would be more productive all round though? I’m sure that would have resulted in an honest apology after realising what’s been said too?

100% agree about the education point, however the current disciplinary rules don't appear to factor in rehabilitation and remorse. I wish they did.

Re: Moose McGuire : Sat Feb 11, 2023 10:57 pm  

RainbowWarrior wrote:

As a gay, disabled "grown man" I personally do care what is said both on and off the pitch, be it by players, fans or the mascot.

Society has moved on from the 80's where the "N" word was regularly thrown about, and whilst I'm not suggesting that word was said, other words can be just as harmful to minorities such as myself.

I know from personal experience how damaging inappropriate use of language can be.

"Grown men" should be grown up enough to understand that.

You included.

I wasn't going to reply as it's a pointless argument, but...

Kudos to you.

I'll stick to being a realist and take emotion, or personal preferences out of the argument.

The quickest, easiest and most common sense way to stop the decline of the game is by having the very best product on the pitch. The only way to do that is by having the best players playing the game. Big players + big games = big crowds and big revenue.

Add another level to it - by your own definition you used the word minority. I have zero ways of proving it, but I doubt the top reason for why the majority of people (who aren't already fans) start to watch a sport isn't because of inclusive it is. They are more likely to see a good game and want to watch more.

Being a lovely sport is great (it really is), but when said sport is literally dying and starved of money, the very last thing it needs is to sabotage itself.

I'm sure there will be some great replies and finger wagging responses. I'm not trying to be harsh (although I recognise I am being) and I'm not saying it's how it should be. Beggars can't be choosers tho imo.

Re: Moose McGuire : Sun Feb 12, 2023 10:04 am  

End of the day it’s rugby league, it’s a hard sport played by hard competitive people who will try their best to be their opposite number and if it means saying some nasty words to them then it happens. What are we going to have 26 priests playing against each other every week? Get a grip.

Players have to adopt that killer mindset especially if you are playing in the middle and become a mean nasty person otherwise you’re coming off second best. But I’ll guarantee once they’re off the pitch they won’t use those nasty words.

It you’ve played the game you’ll understand, or if you’ve played the game and don’t understand you probably played in the backs.

Chances are no fan would have heard McGuire say anything just the ref, so like a previous poster has said you’ve got a star player sat in the stands for 8 games Jesus wept.