RL : Wed Jul 15, 2009 10:13 am  

There are players out the who are OOC.
Karmichael Hunt and Steve Price. It would cost the best part of £500-600k to bring them over.
That's two players costing a third of the salary cap and the other two thirds going on 22 players.
So you have to settle for something less and that's what Saints, Wire and Leeds are doing.
We have to get there yet!
We are all just so fed up with the uncertainty.
Uncertainty over the coach, same with signings or the lack of them.

: Wed Jul 15, 2009 10:16 am  

cadoo wrote:

The thing is though top quality players are available but I think the point we should pay close attention to is "at the right price". I think the club have gone from being laid back with handing out big contracts to now being really over cautious with handing out contracts.

We don't seem to be able to find that balance.

We've had a pperiod now where the club has shown players and their agents that they won't be handing out daft contracts anymore and won't be used as a bargaining tool to get them new deals at their current cubs.

I think that period of changing the clubs reputation will have stood us in good stead long term but now is the time to start signing one or 2 high profile signings again.

We don't need anymore then 2 players for next year but they do have to be top quality and to get those you have to pay a good wage. We can easily make that room available with a couple of players already gone and the option to let 4 more go so we can't use cap space as an excuse.

: Wed Jul 15, 2009 10:16 am  

It really irritates me this nonsense that some people have made up - we should sign Andy Coley and Phil Bailey for 'stability' or 'continuity'.

We don't need stability we need improvement! Teams like Saints and Leeds at the top can fall into the category of keeping players for stability and continuity but not us. We've been average all season and are AGAIN miles away from the top two. The pack has been identified by every sod on this forum as an area we need to improve on. So I fail to see how just re-signing these players like Coley and Bailey will improve the squad at all. If we want some stability at being average then by all means sign away but if we want to improve the squad and challenge the top two we are going to have to either promote players from within of better quality or spend and make some signings.

This pap from IL that top quality players are not available at the right price just makes him look a fool. I would love for him to elaborate and tell me what the right price is. Your not going to get international stars for Richie Mathers, Karl Pryce, Cameron Phelps wages! I don't even think we need international stars from the NRL. The super league is at such a low standard the fringe players would be good enough. Carl Webb would be a quality replacement for Andy Coley. He would be a vast improvement. No he wouldn't be the enforcer required but it would be a start. We can wait to Fielden comes off contract, more money to spend and look again.

We need a replacement for Gareth Hock and Phil Bailey. Had that incident with Gareth Hock not happened we could have promoted from within to replace Phil Bailey. We can still do this but not for Gareth Hock. We have lost a lot of go forward and creativity with Gareth Hock. We need a replacement. Frank Puletua and David Kidwell are exactly the type of (off contract) players that could replace him. Both are in the Tony Puletua mould that we really need.

[DaveO]

: Wed Jul 15, 2009 10:19 am  

cadoo wrote:

Well IL contradicts himself here - are Mark Riddell and Amos Roberts 'top quality'? Hell no. Trent Barrett was top quality so I don't know what he is getting at. I don't understand his definition.

Neither do I. The quote ""It's proving to be tough to get the right quality of people at the right price." covers a multitude of possibilities.

Are Riddell and Roberts the right quality for the right price? I guess they must be as he brought them to the club but they are not top quality in my book.

If they are not then why did this not apply?

"There's obviously a pressure from those fans who want to see new signings, but if they're not the right signings you're better off to wait."

So if he really is after class players this time but isn't prepared to pay the going rate I would expect no recruits at all. Otherwise if he goes for a lower standard of player then this statement "There are a lot of players around but what we have to make sure is those we sign are top quality." is meaningless.

George Carmont and Cameron Phelps we will have to consider due to the restrictions on overseas players. Although Carmont doesn't count on anything I am led to believe.

Carmont is a none federation player and I am pretty sure unlike Bailey cannot apply to get such status once his contract expires as he arrived after the rules came in - I think.

Dave

: Wed Jul 15, 2009 10:19 am  

I'd re-sign Coley but not Bailey tbh.

Coley can cover back row and we need some size to our pack. After that i'd want to be bring in a world class prop and a halfback in that order.

: Wed Jul 15, 2009 10:23 am  

cadoo wrote:

It really irritates me this nonsense that some people have made up - we should sign Andy Coley and Phil Bailey for 'stability' or 'continuity'.

We don't need stability we need improvement! Teams like Saints and Leeds at the top can fall into the category of keeping players for stability and continuity but not us. We've been average all season and are AGAIN miles away from the top two. The pack has been identified by every sod on this forum as an area we need to improve on. So I fail to see how just re-signing these players like Coley and Bailey will improve the squad at all. If we want some stability at being average then by all means sign away but if we want to improve the squad and challenge the top two we are going to have to either promote players from within of better quality or spend and make some signings.

his pap from IL that top quality players are not available at the right price just makes him look a fool. I would love for him to elaborate and tell me what the right price is. Your not going to get international stars for Richie Mathers, Karl Pryce, Cameron Phelps wages! I don't even think we need international stars from the NRL. The super league is at such a low standard the fringe players would be good enough. Carl Webb would be a quality replacement for Andy Coley. He would be a vast improvement. No he wouldn't be the enforcer required but it would be a start. We can wait to Fielden comes off contract, more money to spend and look again.

We need a replacement for Gareth Hock and Phil Bailey. Had that incident with Gareth Hock not happened we could have promoted from within to replace Phil Bailey. We can still do this but not for Gareth Hock. We have lost a lot of go forward and creativity with Gareth Hock. We need a replacement. Frank Puletua and David Kidwell are exactly the type of (off contract) players that could replace him. Both are in the Tony Puletua mould that we really need.

: Wed Jul 15, 2009 10:25 am  

whoops making a mess of this replying business!!!

I think your going to be very disappointed if you believe that bringing in two expensive players is going to improve the team that much to put us in the top 2 next year.

[DaveO]

Re: RL : Wed Jul 15, 2009 10:27 am  

Father Ted wrote:

There are players out the who are OOC.
Karmichael Hunt and Steve Price. It would cost the best part of £500-600k to bring them over.

No it wouldn't because no club would pay that. If they want to come over they would have to accept a lower wage than that. They would still be a clubs top earners but then a clubs best players tend to be!

Of course they may not want to come with the weak pound meaning UK wages of around £200K (not unreasonable for a clubs star player) might not be so attractive any more.

That's two players costing a third of the salary cap and the other two thirds going on 22 players.
So you have to settle for something less and that's what Saints, Wire and Leeds are doing.

Both Leeds and Saints have star players such a Peacock for Leeds and he won't be on peanuts. Perhaps they don't need a star overseas player given the standard of player they already have. We do IMO.

We have to get there yet!
We are all just so fed up with the uncertainty.
Uncertainty over the coach, same with signings or the lack of them.

Quite right.

Dave

: Wed Jul 15, 2009 10:32 am  

clifford wrote:

whoops making a mess of this replying business!!!

I think your going to be very disappointed if you believe that bringing in two expensive players is going to improve the team that much to put us in the top 2 next year.

They would improve the team far more than re-signing Andy Coley or Phil Bailey and would be more expensive because they are better players. But with the number of players leaving Wigan this season we should be able to sign them.

Frank and Tony Puletua are brothers and so you would think that they would command a similar wage. Both at a similar age and play the same positions. So how come Saints can do it and we can't?

Your not going to get quality players for the wages of Andy Coley.

[DaveO]

: Wed Jul 15, 2009 10:35 am  

clifford wrote:

whoops making a mess of this replying business!!!

I think your going to be very disappointed if you believe that bringing in two expensive players is going to improve the team that much to put us in the top 2 next year.

It should get us in the top 4 and that is where you need to be given the new play off format. The third placed team is Hudds who are not that great so IMO we would not need to be that great either to get there.

They are 6 points in front of us and we have 6 games we lost this year we should, if we had played to our current potential never mind to a better standard we may attain with the addition of two players, have won. Would the addition of a couple of players have got us 3 out of those 6 victories needs to put us on a par with Hudds?

On paper IMO yes but we know how unreliable "paper" form can be and that is down to the Noble factor IMO so to realise this top 4 potential we need a couple of class players AND a new coach.

Chances of getting all three under IL seem remote!

Dave