Re: Lockers : Sat Nov 14, 2015 9:58 pm  

Widdop's problem is he's playing behind a mainly SL pack.
The lad has come through the NRL system from youth to 1st team and that must be totally different from the SL academy route. He has never played in SL.
He is very good in the system he's been brought up in.
Also, McNamara must be the most inadequate coach he's ever met.

As for Lockers, other club's fans don't rate him, we know that.
Opposition players rate him very highly.
Opposition coaches also rate him very highly as do International coaches.
I've not bothered for years what fans say about Lockers for those very reasons.

Re: Lockers : Sat Nov 14, 2015 10:12 pm  

He has played well this series one or two needless penalties but a solid performance from him. Will he be able today at that intensity in the next four nations?

Every player can be proud of their performances. Over the series we have been the better team. With this experience and with those who missed out thru injuries or missed out on selection to challenge for places also things are looking good at the minute.

Widdop plays in the nrl which is all. About set structured plays which he orchestrates perfectly, it's them set plays and patterns that beat the opposition not him. He won't let us down in defence but unlikely to take on line and rip thru it.

Re: Lockers : Sat Nov 14, 2015 10:13 pm  

Father Ted wrote:

Widdop's problem is he's playing behind a mainly SL pack.
The lad has come through the NRL system from youth to 1st team and that must be totally different from the SL academy route. He has never played in SL.
He is very good in the system he's been brought up in.
Also, McNamara must be the most inadequate coach he's ever met.

As for Lockers, other club's fans don't rate him, we know that.
Opposition players rate him very highly.
Opposition coaches also rate him very highly as do International coaches.
I've not bothered for years what fans say about Lockers for those very reasons.

Widdop has no excuses. His forwards have eat up the metres and bought him some space but he's failed to use it.

Matty Smith plays a very basic game but it showed Widdop up today.

Re: Lockers : Sat Nov 14, 2015 10:13 pm  

Father Ted wrote:

Widdop's problem is he's playing behind a mainly SL pack.
The lad has come through the NRL system from youth to 1st team and that must be totally different from the SL academy route. He has never played in SL.
He is very good in the system he's been brought up in.
Also, McNamara must be the most inadequate coach he's ever met.

As for Lockers, other club's fans don't rate him, we know that.
Opposition players rate him very highly.
Opposition coaches also rate him very highly as do International coaches.
I've not bothered for years what fans say about Lockers for those very reasons.

Opposition fans didn't rate Andy Farrell. I even stood next to opposition fans who spent the whole of each game sneering at the 'massively overrated' Ellery Hanley - until he crossed the whitewash for his fourth or fifth try. To be honest, if you've been a Wigan fan for the last 30 years, you'll long ago have learned not to give a diddly squat what opposition fans say.

Re: Lockers : Sat Nov 14, 2015 10:22 pm  

Father Ted wrote:

Widdop's problem is he's playing behind a mainly SL pack.
The lad has come through the NRL system from youth to 1st team and that must be totally different from the SL academy route. He has never played in SL.
He is very good in the system he's been brought up in.
Also, McNamara must be the most inadequate coach he's ever met.

Based on what I've seen of him he's only the first choice because he's in the NRL.
He looked poor for the majority of last season as well though, and he was playing behind a pack containing; Graham, Hodgson, Cooper, and Tom Burgess (plus Whithead, and George/Sam Burgess will probably be in the starting pack as well next season), I don't think that's a valid excuse. It seems clear to me that when you actually examine his skill set there isn't much there. No long kicking game, no game management, no passing game, no real running threat. He's a great defender, but you don't pick your halves based solely on their defense. I really don't think he offers more than Gale or Tomkins would in the halves for England behind that very good English pack.

Re: Lockers : Sun Nov 15, 2015 4:47 am  

Agreed. Widdop is supposed to be the seasoned NRL pro who plays against these guys every week and is supposed to take the lead, but he was outshone by the rookie Williams in the first game and certainly by Matty Smith's (as Charlie quite rightly says) bread-and-butter kicking game in this one. What he did do is make some good cover tackles in defence, but that the NRL training that's been drummed into him. More is needed from an international half.

Re: Lockers : Sun Nov 15, 2015 7:15 am  

moto748 wrote:

Agreed. Widdop is supposed to be the seasoned NRL pro who plays against these guys every week and is supposed to take the lead, but he was outshone by the rookie Williams in the first game and certainly by Matty Smith's (as Charlie quite rightly says) bread-and-butter kicking game in this one. What he did do is make some good cover tackles in defence, but that the NRL training that's been drummed into him. More is needed from an international half.

People have a real hang up about playing lads out of what is deemed their position. Widdop plays stand off for St George so therefore he should only play there for England but to me he still looks like a full back playing in the halves. Add in Sam Tomkins starting to look more and more like a half playing at fullback and I'd seriously consider a swap. Widdop only moved in to the halves because he couldn't get a game in front of Slater.

Zak Hardaker has defended well but offered no sort of link or threat in attack. I'd consider going 1-Widdop, 6-Tomkins and 7-Smith for next years four nations.

Re: Lockers : Sun Nov 15, 2015 10:25 am  

Lockers was deservedly MOS. Graham was average yesterday and For every penalty Lockers concedes Hill does a stupid offload in his own half. All the forwards were good throughout the series. A special mention to Ferres. Three excellent games.

On the negative side was the performance of Watkins. Everyone was banging on about McGilvary, who did well in defence. But really what chances did the winger get in all three games? Watkins didn't give one single pass. Bateman gave Hall more passes yesterday than Watkins gave in all three tests.

Re: Lockers : Sun Nov 15, 2015 11:28 am  

I think the whole England game plan was to play thru the middle leaving very little opportunity for esher centre or wingers to shine. I do think mcgilvrey deserved a start and offered more running ball out giving the props a rest than burgess did in previous games.

Re: Lockers : Sun Nov 15, 2015 12:49 pm  

Aboveusonlypie wrote:

Lockers was deservedly MOS. Graham was average yesterday and For every penalty Lockers concedes Hill does a stupid offload in his own half. All the forwards were good throughout the series. A special mention to Ferres. Three excellent games.

On the negative side was the performance of Watkins. Everyone was banging on about McGilvary, who did well in defence. But really what chances did the winger get in all three games? Watkins didn't give one single pass. Bateman gave Hall more passes yesterday than Watkins gave in all three tests.

Watkins by my reckoning butchered two very good chances. He dropped the pass from Lockers when England had space and an overlap and he then passed to the NZ player a few mins later after a good break.

Still it goes back to what I wrote on another thread - one or two games don't make or break a career. Watkins has been very good all season and I'll take the view that over 30/40 games he's been the leagies best centrw and therefore is by definition a top player.