Re: How The Mighty Have Fallen. : Tue Oct 23, 2018 5:36 pm  

Les Norton wrote:

I don’t know him personally like you do so can’t comment.

You’re obviously bitter that we’ve got one over you and secured the mighty Agar.

Probably not that but he might be bitter that Gary Hetherington has delivered a decade and a half of sustained success based on developing home grown players, which is what all Warrington fans want to see.

If I heard that any of that "Headingley set" was coming to Warrington: Hetherington, McDermott, Sinfield, Peacock, JJB, I'd be very pleased, as I was when Leuluai joined.

[Fantastic Mr Catpiss]

Re: How The Mighty Have Fallen. : Wed Oct 24, 2018 7:40 am  

On top of this, furner might not even be going now.

Re: How The Mighty Have Fallen. : Wed Oct 24, 2018 8:23 am  

Fantastic Mr Catpiss wrote:

On top of this, furner might not even be going now.

He heard Agar was coming.

[Uncle Rico]

Re: How The Mighty Have Fallen. : Wed Oct 24, 2018 9:12 am  

Jimathay wrote:

He's returning to England for family reasons, according to a statement from St George.

His results as a head coach aren't great, but he was at Wire, St George, and now Leeds in an assistant / member of the performance team capacity, not a head coach.

St George and Leeds would have no doubt done their due dilligance before hiring him - RL is a pretty small and well-connected sport - if he was as bad as social media and this forum makes out, he would have struggled to find work, yet oportunities keep presenting themselves to him.

Maybe as a member of a back-room setup, as a player development officer, head of performance or whatever, rather than the head coach, he's pretty good?

I still reflect of Richie Mathers' Tweets after he got the NRL gig -

"Not my place to. All im saying is Rich Agar is a brilliant coach, worked unbelievably hard, players loved him and ANY criticism is WAY off."
...
"Your completely entitled to your opinion but your so far off the mark. Hell of a lot of reasons but Agar 1000% wasn't one of them."

I trust Mathers' take on Agar and heard the same from another source, so good luck to the guy. That's not saying I'd want him back as a head coach BTW

Re: How The Mighty Have Fallen. : Wed Oct 24, 2018 9:55 am  

Some coincidental exits yesterday with Peacock Agar and Furner.
Very easy to link these 3 together.

Re: How The Mighty Have Fallen. : Wed Oct 24, 2018 10:10 am  

Wires71 wrote: Agar was head of recruitment for the St George womens' team. I don't know him from Adam but I do know we were dross in 2017 and he was assistant coach. https://www.nrl.com/news/2018/06/04/st- ... emiership/ Agreed we were dross in 2017. We reached 2 finals in 2016. I'm don't know his level of accountability in either, but people seem to want to pin 2017 on him, and ignore 2016 as it doesn't fit the Agar is crap narrative. He wasn't just head of recruitment for the Women's team, that was one of his responsibilities, including juniors and the "high performance unit". https://www.dragons.com.au/news/2018/10/22/agar-returns-to-england/ That was sort of my point - his head coach record isn't good - if Leeds announced he was their new head coach, then I would look on it with derision. But he might actually be pretty good at a "head of performance" (or however you want to title it) type of role within the backroom setup.

Wires71 wrote: Agar was head of recruitment for the St George womens' team. I don't know him from Adam but I do know we were dross in 2017 and he was assistant coach. https://www.nrl.com/news/2018/06/04/st- ... emiership/ Agreed we were dross in 2017. We reached 2 finals in 2016. I'm don't know his level of accountability in either, but people seem to want to pin 2017 on him, and ignore 2016 as it doesn't fit the Agar is crap narrative. He wasn't just head of recruitment for the Women's team, that was one of his responsibilities, including juniors and the "high performance unit". https://www.dragons.com.au/news/2018/10/22/agar-returns-to-england/ That was sort of my point - his head coach record isn't good - if Leeds announced he was their new head coach, then I would look on it with derision. But he might actually be pretty good at a "head of performance" (or however you want to title it) type of role within the backroom setup.

Re: How The Mighty Have Fallen. : Wed Oct 24, 2018 10:21 am  

Jimathay wrote: Agreed we were dross in 2017. We reached 2 finals in 2016. I'm don't know his level of accountability in either, but people seem to want to pin 2017 on him, and ignore 2016 as it doesn't fit the Agar is crap narrative. He wasn't just head of recruitment for the Women's team, that was one of his responsibilities, including juniors and the "high performance unit". https://www.dragons.com.au/news/2018/10/22/agar-returns-to-england/ That was sort of my point - his head coach record isn't good - if Leeds announced he was their new head coach, then I would look on it with derision. But he might actually be pretty good at a "head of performance" (or however you want to title it) type of role within the backroom setup. Yes 2016 we reached 2 finals and I never accepted this as relatively successful for a team with a coach in his 7th year. It is only successful for Price because of the low base he worked from and only 11 months in which to do it. In 2015 we were dross too ending the league in 6th and beaten by Hull KR in the semi. So in Agar's tenure. 2015 - Dross 2016 - Lost both finals. 2017 - Dross Then we can reflect on comments from Wakefield and Hull supporters which are not a ringing endorsement. Then these comments from our very own K. Brown. Kevin Brown on 2017 wrote: I couldn’t believe the state of the club given how close it was to becoming champions the season before. “It was frightening in regards to standards and how far they’d slipped – it was an eye-opener. It wasn’t a happy time but things got so bad, they simply had to change* I would not be in a hurry to have him back but do not wish him ill. *https://www.totalrl.com/kevin-brown-admits-standards-slipped-at-warrington-prior-to-prices-arrival/

Jimathay wrote: Agreed we were dross in 2017. We reached 2 finals in 2016. I'm don't know his level of accountability in either, but people seem to want to pin 2017 on him, and ignore 2016 as it doesn't fit the Agar is crap narrative. He wasn't just head of recruitment for the Women's team, that was one of his responsibilities, including juniors and the "high performance unit". https://www.dragons.com.au/news/2018/10/22/agar-returns-to-england/ That was sort of my point - his head coach record isn't good - if Leeds announced he was their new head coach, then I would look on it with derision. But he might actually be pretty good at a "head of performance" (or however you want to title it) type of role within the backroom setup. Yes 2016 we reached 2 finals and I never accepted this as relatively successful for a team with a coach in his 7th year. It is only successful for Price because of the low base he worked from and only 11 months in which to do it. In 2015 we were dross too ending the league in 6th and beaten by Hull KR in the semi. So in Agar's tenure. 2015 - Dross 2016 - Lost both finals. 2017 - Dross Then we can reflect on comments from Wakefield and Hull supporters which are not a ringing endorsement. Then these comments from our very own K. Brown. Kevin Brown on 2017 wrote: I couldn’t believe the state of the club given how close it was to becoming champions the season before. “It was frightening in regards to standards and how far they’d slipped – it was an eye-opener. It wasn’t a happy time but things got so bad, they simply had to change* I would not be in a hurry to have him back but do not wish him ill. *https://www.totalrl.com/kevin-brown-admits-standards-slipped-at-warrington-prior-to-prices-arrival/

Re: How The Mighty Have Fallen. : Wed Oct 24, 2018 11:37 am  

The Kevin Brown quote doesn't mention Agar.

It just confirms what I think we all agree on - there was a LOT wrong behind the scenes in the final few years of Smith's tenure.

Player recruitment and succession planning (Smith's punts and projects eg Bailey, our halfback situation was dire, players not wanting to sign for us after meeting TS), Smith had clearly lost his mojo, the players didn't like working with Mick Turner (who also arrived for the 2015 season) etc.

I'm not trying to be an Agar champion - I just think he's unfairly become a lightning rod for all that was wrong.

Re: How The Mighty Have Fallen. : Wed Oct 24, 2018 12:00 pm  

Can't give Brown an argument. He said pretty much bar his own contribution on how it was.

By and large Brown this season has be fair to good with the exception of leaving arguably his 2 worst performances for both finals.

Re: How The Mighty Have Fallen. : Wed Oct 24, 2018 1:00 pm  

Jimathay wrote:

The Kevin Brown quote doesn't mention Agar.

It just confirms what I think we all agree on - there was a LOT wrong behind the scenes in the final few years of Smith's tenure.

Player recruitment and succession planning (Smith's punts and projects eg Bailey, our halfback situation was dire, players not wanting to sign for us after meeting TS), Smith had clearly lost his mojo, the players didn't like working with Mick Turner (who also arrived for the 2015 season) etc.

I'm not trying to be an Agar champion - I just think he's unfairly become a lightning rod for all that was wrong.

Yes we agree on that. Just as I don't think it is fair he is blamed for everything, it is not fair for him to avoid any responsibility either. He is culpable along with TS.