Re: Opening SL weekend sees attendances tumbling by 12.66% : Fri May 03, 2013 10:47 pm  

waterfield's finest wrote:

Another village idiot. It obviously irks these guys enough to tempt them out of their lover's arms.

Or perhaps their mothers'.

Will, your boyfriends here!

Re: Opening SL weekend sees attendances tumbling by 12.66% : Fri May 03, 2013 11:30 pm  

William Eve wrote:

And attendances previous to that for this derby fixture were...

14,753
14,103
16,706
18,195
16,603
22,843
23,375
21,102
21,784

Where did it all go wrong this season in particular?

12,106...

But Wllliam, you don't get it. You are comparing this fixture with historical data stretching way back. Why don't you do this with every fixture rather than simply comparing it to last season? Oh yeah, it might paint a picture that you don't like - that Super League attendances for a lot of clubs have massively improved, whilst declining at other clubs. Does this point to a meltdown in the game like you suggest? You only have to go back to 2003 to see Warrington getting just 7,000 at home for their Widnes derby, whilst the now attendance powerhouse Wigan barely averaged 10,000 fans at home - they got 14,138 at the JJB for a regular round derby against St Helens, which they now consistently sell out. But you choose to just focus on the negatives - the Bradford v Leeds derby. This is what makes you a troll, rather than a constructive critic.

Re: Opening SL weekend sees attendances tumbling by 12.66% : Sat May 04, 2013 6:32 am  

Kosh wrote:

Haven't read this thread in a while. Is the OP still surprised that gates are down in the middle of the slowest economic recovery in a generation?

Such a big drop in one season can't be explained by that. Why the much better results two years ago? Are other sports seeing these falls? Anything near a ten percent fall in one season is a massive wakeup call. To my utter shock, the RFL appear to have heard it. The solution offered seems somewhat bizarre but awareness of a problem is a good start. The next good thing would be a new team at the RFL.

Re: Opening SL weekend sees attendances tumbling by 12.66% : Sat May 04, 2013 9:26 pm  

UPDATE... SL Round 14 attendances - comparison to same fixtures last year Bradford V Leeds in 2013 = 12,016 Bradford V Leeds in 2012 = 20,851 % decrease = -42.37% Hull V London in 2013 = 11,438 Hull V London in 2012 = 10,096 % increase = +13.81% ***WOW!*** St Helens V Widnes in 2013 = 11,438 St Helens V Widnes in 2012 = 14,253 % decrease = -19.75% Wigan V Salford in 2013 = 12,489 Wigan V Salford in 2012 = 13,703 % decrease = -8.86% Wakefield V Catalan in 2013 = 6,125 Wakefield V Catalan in 2012 = 7,254 % decrease = -15.56% ***Congratulations to Hull FC on bucking the downward attendance trend by slashing ticket prices for tonight's home game against London. 73 out of 94 SL fixtures in 2013 have now registered a fall in attendance compared to the same fixtures between the same teams last year. Attendances in SL in 2013 are now 120,075 down in total compared to the same fixtures between the same teams last year. Total SL attendance for 94 SL fixtures in 2013 = 805,611 (Avg: 8,570) Total SL attendance for same 94 SL fixtures in 2012 = 925,686 (Avg: 9,848) % decrease = -12.97% Total SL attendance for same 94 SL fixtures in 2011 = 857,610 (Avg: 9,124)** % decrease = -6.06% ** Widnes fixtures for SL 2011 replaced by equivalent Crusaders fixtures against same opposition.

UPDATE... SL Round 14 attendances - comparison to same fixtures last year Bradford V Leeds in 2013 = 12,016 Bradford V Leeds in 2012 = 20,851 % decrease = -42.37% Hull V London in 2013 = 11,438 Hull V London in 2012 = 10,096 % increase = +13.81% ***WOW!*** St Helens V Widnes in 2013 = 11,438 St Helens V Widnes in 2012 = 14,253 % decrease = -19.75% Wigan V Salford in 2013 = 12,489 Wigan V Salford in 2012 = 13,703 % decrease = -8.86% Wakefield V Catalan in 2013 = 6,125 Wakefield V Catalan in 2012 = 7,254 % decrease = -15.56% ***Congratulations to Hull FC on bucking the downward attendance trend by slashing ticket prices for tonight's home game against London. 73 out of 94 SL fixtures in 2013 have now registered a fall in attendance compared to the same fixtures between the same teams last year. Attendances in SL in 2013 are now 120,075 down in total compared to the same fixtures between the same teams last year. Total SL attendance for 94 SL fixtures in 2013 = 805,611 (Avg: 8,570) Total SL attendance for same 94 SL fixtures in 2012 = 925,686 (Avg: 9,848) % decrease = -12.97% Total SL attendance for same 94 SL fixtures in 2011 = 857,610 (Avg: 9,124)** % decrease = -6.06% ** Widnes fixtures for SL 2011 replaced by equivalent Crusaders fixtures against same opposition.

Re: Opening SL weekend sees attendances tumbling by 12.66% : Sun May 05, 2013 12:32 am  

William Eve wrote:

And attendances previous to that for this derby fixture were...

14,753
14,103
16,706
18,195
16,603
22,843
23,375
21,102
21,784

Where did it all go wrong this season in particular?

12,106...

Why did you stop in 2003, at the height of the rivalry?
2002 - 13,631 - Bradford finished 2nd & finalists (out of 12) @ VP
2001 - 15,106 & 12,863 - 1st & champions (out of 12) @ VP
2000 - 21,237 & 19,623 - 3rd (out of 12)
1999 - 16,049 & 24,020 - 1st & finalist (out of 14)
1998 - 19,188 - 5th (out of 12)
1997 - 16,542 - 1st (out of 12)
1996 - 10,229 - 3rd (out of 12)

Pre the disaster that is SL
1995 - 5,546 - 7th (out of 11)
1994/95 - 6,980 - 7th (out of 16)
1993/94 - 7,538 - 2nd (out of 16)
1992/93 - 8,659 - 3rd (out of 14)
1991/92 - 8,796 - 11th (out of 14)
1990/91 - 10,858 - 7th (out of 14)
1989/90 - 11,441 - 4th (out of 14)
1988/89 - 8,663 - 8th (out of 14)
1987/88 - 6,060 - 4th (out of 14)
1986/87 - 4,710 - 7th (out of 16)
1985/86 - 3,612 - 12th (out of 16)

Re: Opening SL weekend sees attendances tumbling by 12.66% : Sun May 05, 2013 9:31 am  

Him wrote:

Why did you stop in 2003, at the height of the rivalry?
2002 - 13,631 - Bradford finished 2nd & finalists (out of 12) @ VP
2001 - 15,106 & 12,863 - 1st & champions (out of 12) @ VP
2000 - 21,237 & 19,623 - 3rd (out of 12)
1999 - 16,049 & 24,020 - 1st & finalist (out of 14)
1998 - 19,188 - 5th (out of 12)
1997 - 16,542 - 1st (out of 12)
1996 - 10,229 - 3rd (out of 12)

Pre the disaster that is SL
1995 - 5,546 - 7th (out of 11)
1994/95 - 6,980 - 7th (out of 16)
1993/94 - 7,538 - 2nd (out of 16)
1992/93 - 8,659 - 3rd (out of 14)
1991/92 - 8,796 - 11th (out of 14)
1990/91 - 10,858 - 7th (out of 14)
1989/90 - 11,441 - 4th (out of 14)
1988/89 - 8,663 - 8th (out of 14)
1987/88 - 6,060 - 4th (out of 14)
1986/87 - 4,710 - 7th (out of 16)
1985/86 - 3,612 - 12th (out of 16)

You are seriously miss the point here!

This fixture, along with the rest of the clubs seems to have attracted people over the past 10 years. For some reason these people have left.

WHY?

Thats the real problem, not petty squabbling about how many people attended 20 years ago. Why can we not hang onto our fans, how can we get them back.

Re: Opening SL weekend sees attendances tumbling by 12.66% : Sun May 05, 2013 10:18 am  

jimlav wrote:

You are seriously miss the point here!

This fixture, along with the rest of the clubs seems to have attracted people over the past 10 years. For some reason these people have left.

WHY?

Thats the real problem, not petty squabbling about how many people attended 20 years ago. Why can we not hang onto our fans, how can we get them back.

That's what we want is instead of endless stats, figures and percentages. We want answers, reasons and solutions.

Re: Opening SL weekend sees attendances tumbling by 12.66% : Sun May 05, 2013 10:49 am  

jimlav wrote:

You are seriously miss the point here!

This fixture, along with the rest of the clubs seems to have attracted people over the past 10 years. For some reason these people have left.

WHY?

Thats the real problem, not petty squabbling about how many people attended 20 years ago. Why can we not hang onto our fans, how can we get them back.

I haven't missed the point, that was more a riposte to William's previous postings which can be roughly summed up as "SL=disaster : pre-SL=wonderful"
I think the reasons for the decline in Bradford v Leeds crowds are a mix of:
Bradford being a far poorer team
The recession
& Bradford's mismanagement

As for other clubs, well I haven't followed the thread in full but it looked as though, in general, crowds are down on last season but equal or up on previous seasons. Of which partly I think is due to the recession but partly not. I don't think anyone can conclusively point to 1 reason as to why crowds are down on last season, although there were one-off factors in last seasons attendances.

Re: Opening SL weekend sees attendances tumbling by 12.66% : Sun May 05, 2013 11:46 am  

William Eve wrote:

St Helens V Widnes in 2013 = 11,438
St Helens V Widnes in 2012 = 14,253
% decrease = -19.75%

As I've said before, Saints' home games are down between 2,000 and 3,000 on last year. All of them are. You could write the script now for the remaining home games of the season! However, all our gates are drastically up on 2011 when we spent the season at Widnes. In turn, our gates in 2011 were drastically down on the final season at Knowsley Road in 2010. In Saints' case you have to take bias into consideration. We slumped when fans were asked to travel a couple of miles up the road to Widnes. We boomed when a whole host of partners and children of season ticket holders bought one year season tickets and turned up to nosey at the new stadium.

I'd say this year's figures are a more accurate representation of the core supporter base in St Helens, as evidenced by our gates in the final year at Knowsley Road.

Re: Opening SL weekend sees attendances tumbling by 12.66% : Sun May 05, 2013 11:48 am  

Him wrote:

I think the reasons for the decline in Bradford v Leeds crowds are a mix of:
Bradford being a far poorer team
The recession
& Bradford's mismanagement

What about ticket and season ticket prices? Are they more realistic this season? If so then I'm sure that will have impacted the supporter turnout this year.