Re: Opening SL weekend sees attendances tumbling by 12.66% : Mon Mar 18, 2013 8:27 pm  

ThePrinter wrote:

Yet even if the lower figure of 11,200 is correct that is still better than any Saints/Wakey crowd at Knowsley Road during the SL era.

That isn't the point of this thread though. The comparison has been with the same fixtures last season. While there are bound to be mitigating factors in all the rounds - the weather, the time of year, what have you - Saints' crowds are consistently down this season and we aren't alone (but we probably have witnessed the biggest fall in numbers). What kind of crowd the game would have attracted at KR was irrelevant. All the figures are up on our leaving gate from KR.

Re: Opening SL weekend sees attendances tumbling by 12.66% : Mon Mar 18, 2013 8:33 pm  

wrencat1873 wrote:

I think for Saints, some success or a cup run will see the fans flocking back,

I don't think so. I'm starting to think that last season was a blip, as although our gates are still above those from our final season at KR, they are pretty much the same number down on last season's gates. Some of the problem is the stadium IMO. A lot of our 'new' supporters, according to the head honcho anyway, were actually family members of those already attending, mostly female partners and their children. Unfortunately, three quarters of the stadium does not offer much in the way of protection from the elements. In fact, quite often the experience has been that the temperature is lower and the wind stronger IN the stadium than around its perimiter, due to a kind of funnel effect created by the lack of backs to three of the stands. If the stadium experience is actually colder and less protected than at KR, which it is, then even with such luxuries as covered toilets families will not be easily attracted back. (Although on some matchdays to get to the covered toilets involved paddling through puddles of rain)

So far as the overall drop in numbers is concerned, why it has happened is a mystery.

Re: Opening SL weekend sees attendances tumbling by 12.66% : Mon Mar 18, 2013 9:27 pm  

ThePrinter wrote:

I've neither used the words ''nothing wrong'' nor ''extraordinary achievement'', in think I highlighted how I thought we got a slice of luck with Tomkins being injured.

So I didn't say I don't find nothing wrong with it, I do. But what I find wrong is how poorly other teams have played in the Playoffs over the years when the title is within reach. Bradford finished 10 points behind the leaders in 2005 and lost 5 more games than the leaders (the same as Leeds in 2012) but I didn't see the same complaints as we do now back then.

As for detracting from the regular season, since 1996 (when SL begin) in football's Championship (2nd tier), the team finishing 3rd has only won the playoffs (and been promoted) 7 times in 17 years, yet this league is often referred to as being as exciting as the Premiership and doesn't suffer at all from this format........I guess it's different folks outlook on life

And how will less Playoff spots help some of the worst crowd offenders so far this year (Salford, London, Bradford), the latter 2 were given slim hope of maybe hitting the top 8, if it was down to top 5 they'd have had no chance and would probably be getting even less home fans to games. Would more Cas fans have turned out against London at the weekend? No. Would more Hudds fans be turning up if we did top 5? They haven't done well in top 8 playoffs even though its 'easier' so would a 'tougher' playoff format see fans flocking for Season Tickets?

But there's the paradox. You're right, in that no, I can't really see a team winning it from 7th or 8th. Nor, in my view, do fans of the clubs challenging for those places. Which is why they're not flocking to watch their teams trying to scrape that 8th place. They don't think it means anything other than one, maybe two, more games. The only teams that could ever win from fifth are the "big" clubs who've had a poor run somewhere. No smaller club, scraping a lower place, will ever win it.

Re: Opening SL weekend sees attendances tumbling by 12.66% : Tue Mar 19, 2013 9:31 am  

if 5th is the highest it has ever been won from then cut to the chase, have a top 5 GF play-off, then to keep interest for those 6-10 have a plate series with a final at O/T before the GF and the winners get a shield and a bit of cash.....at least those 6-10 will be closer in competitive level than the teams 6-8 are to the top 5

Re: Opening SL weekend sees attendances tumbling by 12.66% : Tue Mar 19, 2013 10:08 am  

pie.warrior wrote:

if 5th is the highest it has ever been won from then cut to the chase, have a top 5 GF play-off, then to keep interest for those 6-10 have a plate series with a final at O/T before the GF and the winners get a shield and a bit of cash.....at least those 6-10 will be closer in competitive level than the teams 6-8 are to the top 5

Agreed, or just cut back to top 5 or 6, which creates a more intense end of season comp which, if marketed and promoted well, should ensure decent crowds for all of the play off series.
It's nice for the "minnows" to have a taste of play off footy but, they are just moments in the sun.

Re: Opening SL weekend sees attendances tumbling by 12.66% : Tue Mar 19, 2013 10:10 am  

SaintsFan wrote:

I don't think so. I'm starting to think that last season was a blip, as although our gates are still above those from our final season at KR, they are pretty much the same number down on last season's gates. Some of the problem is the stadium IMO. A lot of our 'new' supporters, according to the head honcho anyway, were actually family members of those already attending, mostly female partners and their children. Unfortunately, three quarters of the stadium does not offer much in the way of protection from the elements. In fact, quite often the experience has been that the temperature is lower and the wind stronger IN the stadium than around its perimiter, due to a kind of funnel effect created by the lack of backs to three of the stands. If the stadium experience is actually colder and less protected than at KR, which it is, then even with such luxuries as covered toilets families will not be easily attracted back. (Although on some matchdays to get to the covered toilets involved paddling through puddles of rain)

So far as the overall drop in numbers is concerned, why it has happened is a mystery.

Would it not be possible to fill in the gaps behind the stands, or add corner seating/terracing to help with the "wind tunnel" problem ?

Re: Opening SL weekend sees attendances tumbling by 12.66% : Tue Mar 19, 2013 10:18 am  

corners are filled with seats/terracing...the problem is the 6-8ft gap between the roof and the top of the back wall............Apparently if the gap is closed some on the saints forum say it will cause a billowing of the wind and blow the roof off. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Re: Opening SL weekend sees attendances tumbling by 12.66% : Tue Mar 19, 2013 11:33 am  

pie.warrior wrote:

corners are filled with seats/terracing...the problem is the 6-8ft gap between the roof and the top of the back wall............Apparently if the gap is closed some on the saints forum say it will cause a billowing of the wind and blow the roof off. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I dont think the corners are full filled in, although if the roof could blow off unless there are the gaps behind all of the 4 stands, that is a major design fault.
Personally, I though the ground was excellend, but some of our group thought the opposite.

Re: Opening SL weekend sees attendances tumbling by 12.66% : Tue Mar 19, 2013 12:04 pm  

the 2 corners near the fully enclosed seating section are seated, the other 2 are more open.......it is very windy and the rain blows in....well it did good friday last year and we got soaked and the concourse area for refreshments was like a paddling pool....

Re: Opening SL weekend sees attendances tumbling by 12.66% : Tue Mar 19, 2013 12:52 pm  

wrencat1873 wrote:

The level of apathy from the Leeds fans for the Leeds Wakefield play off last season was incredible.
Despite a 3000 strong contingent of Wakefield fans, who were riding high on the back of 7 straight wins, the crowd at Headingley was only 8000+, there were more people there for the Boxing Day trial match !

Regarding the play offs, the teames finishing 7/8th rarely win their game and it is something of a filler.
We should revert to top 5 or 6, which gives the top teams slightly less chance of an automatic spot, which should prevent the type of games such as Wigan at Widnes last season, when several players were rested and also means that a team from the bottom half of the league does not qualify for the finals series.

There are many reasons for some of the poor crowds and it is the individual clubs responsibility to maximise their own support and revenues and although almost every team in the comp is capable of making the 8, the issues with the make up of play offs do reduce the value of the competition and that cant be right.

You have to remember different circumstances for different clubs. Since the start of the 2009 season (the first Top 8 year) up until the Leeds/Wakey game, the amount of Cup, Playoffs & WCC games.......
- Leeds = 28 (including 5 big days out at Wembley and Old Trafford)
- Wakefield = 7
That number today after the 2012 Playoffs and 2013 WCC stands at 33-8
That is a lot of extra games to pay for, several hundred pounds if you tried attending each one. Also, and I don't mean to sound cocky, but much different attitudes for both clubs. For Leeds fans it was 1 step on the path to the GF where many tipped or expected them to get to and possibly a mindset of quite a few to save their money for the later games........Wakey fans on the other hand probably didn't think or expect to go all the way but would've been quite satisfied with just dumping Leeds out.