Re: Opening SL weekend sees attendances tumbling by 12.66% : Sun Mar 03, 2013 10:57 pm  

RLBandit wrote:

unfortunately your research counts as 'talking the game down', so we'll pretend it doesn't exist if that's OK.

think you're right there

Re: Opening SL weekend sees attendances tumbling by 12.66% : Sun Mar 03, 2013 11:05 pm  

RLBandit wrote:

Fudge! Lies! Agenda! I know what's happened here...yes, they might be the numbers AS RECORDED...but how do I know you haven't been meddling with the turnstiles?

How do you know I haven't been meddling with the westerly traffic flow on the M62 on Friday night?

Poor old SmokeyTA faces a bit of a conundrum.

Does he accept my attendance figures which he claims are not like-for-like, untrue, false, wrong and fudged? These being the comparative stats between the same teams in the same fixtures which, to date, show an overall fall in SL attendances of 12.8% compared to last year?

Or does he accept the attendance figures arrived at by a round by round comparison which are apparently like-for-like and much favoured by himself and the RFL? Which. to date, show an overall fall in SL attendances of 13.28% compared to last year?

12.82% or 13.28%... eh Smokey?

Time to decide

Re: Opening SL weekend sees attendances tumbling by 12.66% : Sun Mar 03, 2013 11:08 pm  

robt90 wrote:

think you're right there

Welcome to the VT

' resistance ' will not be tolerated

Re: Opening SL weekend sees attendances tumbling by 12.66% : Sun Mar 03, 2013 11:20 pm  

RLBandit wrote:

Haha, frustrating when facts get in the way of your argument isn't it? Come on, you must have another explanation of why the numbers are wrong? Did he forget to include straw men in the count?

Not really, I've not denied that 2012 has higher numbers, I've not even said the 2011 were lower (simply he messed up 2 attendances, which he even admitting by changing them). What i've done (quite shockingly I know) is provide reasons when applicable. Some have clear reasons - Saints/Leeds & Hull/Bradford - that you both try and downplay this joking about some M62 agenda actually speaks massive volumes about how badly you want the numbers to be down (oh I forgot, you're RL fans in general and want the sport you 'love' to florish ) whilst some are just quite poor (Bradford, London etc.). Some I believe have valid reasons for being lower, whilst some I agree don't. But I forgot 'suggesting' reasons isn't allowed. we can't challenge your man-crush now can we.

What's just tragic is when he puts up lower numbers for 2013 each week you're like some high school cheerleader with your little pom-poms cheering him on. Even using the 'straw man' phrase just because he has like you're some young girl copying everything her high school crush does to get him to like you.

So keep standing on the sidelines shouting ''GO BILLY, GO BILLY, GO!''..........the rest of us will just cringe at you.

Re: Opening SL weekend sees attendances tumbling by 12.66% : Sun Mar 03, 2013 11:21 pm  

SmokeyTA wrote: Does anyone know why is round 4 in 2012 so low? Its so low in 2013 because there is a Leeds home game missing (which when included will obviously lead to a fairly substantial year on year rise) Im assuming you havent attempted to mislead us by including the Wigan v Widnes game in round 3 2012, so the same is applicable there too. So that would be a hell of a drop in a week from 76k in round 3 to 53k in round 4 I'm merely copying your perfect (non-fudged of course... no, really) round for round comparison method Smokey. You know, just like when you claimed that Rounds 2, 3 and 4 in 2013 were better attended than they were in 2011... HERE... but failed to disclose that you'd purposely misleaded us all with the Round 3 figures in 2011 by omitting the Wigan V Castleford fixture HERE when the attendance was in fact 13,096 which means that your assertion was incorrect and deliberately misleading all along? Round 2 attendances 2011 59947 round 2 attendances 2013 69809 round 3 attendances 2011 51216 + 13096 = 64312* round 3 attendances 2013 58711 round 4 attendances 2011 59217 round 4 attendances 2013 46166 total = rounds 2,3,4 attendances 2011 170380 + 13096 = 183476* total = rounds 2,3,4 attendances 2013 174686 Happy to help. *Amendments to Smokey's agenda-driven omissions in red Careful Smokey, or else we'll all have to assume you've got an agenda

SmokeyTA wrote: Does anyone know why is round 4 in 2012 so low? Its so low in 2013 because there is a Leeds home game missing (which when included will obviously lead to a fairly substantial year on year rise) Im assuming you havent attempted to mislead us by including the Wigan v Widnes game in round 3 2012, so the same is applicable there too. So that would be a hell of a drop in a week from 76k in round 3 to 53k in round 4 I'm merely copying your perfect (non-fudged of course... no, really) round for round comparison method Smokey. You know, just like when you claimed that Rounds 2, 3 and 4 in 2013 were better attended than they were in 2011... HERE... but failed to disclose that you'd purposely misleaded us all with the Round 3 figures in 2011 by omitting the Wigan V Castleford fixture HERE when the attendance was in fact 13,096 which means that your assertion was incorrect and deliberately misleading all along? Round 2 attendances 2011 59947 round 2 attendances 2013 69809 round 3 attendances 2011 51216 + 13096 = 64312* round 3 attendances 2013 58711 round 4 attendances 2011 59217 round 4 attendances 2013 46166 total = rounds 2,3,4 attendances 2011 170380 + 13096 = 183476* total = rounds 2,3,4 attendances 2013 174686 Happy to help. *Amendments to Smokey's agenda-driven omissions in red Careful Smokey, or else we'll all have to assume you've got an agenda

Re: Opening SL weekend sees attendances tumbling by 12.66% : Sun Mar 03, 2013 11:28 pm  

William Eve wrote:

How do you know I haven't been meddling with the westerly traffic flow on the M62 on Friday night?

Poor old SmokeyTA faces a bit of a conundrum.

Does he accept my attendance figures which he claims are not like-for-like, untrue, false, wrong and fudged? These being the comparative stats between the same teams in the same fixtures which, to date, show an overall fall in SL attendances of 12.8% compared to last year?

Or does he accept the attendance figures arrived at by a round by round comparison which are apparently like-for-like and much favoured by himself and the RFL? Which. to date, show an overall fall in SL attendances of 13.28% compared to last year?

12.82% or 13.28%... eh Smokey?

Time to decide

I havent argued attendances are higher this year than last. Simply said we should take these 5 rounds of lower attendances in the context of over a decade of good growth.

Re: Opening SL weekend sees attendances tumbling by 12.66% : Sun Mar 03, 2013 11:36 pm  

SmokeyTA wrote:

I havent argued attendances are higher this year than last. Simply said we should take these 5 rounds of lower attendances in the context of over a decade of good growth.

What context should we take the figures supplied by robt for the championships between 2001/2013 ?

Re: Opening SL weekend sees attendances tumbling by 12.66% : Sun Mar 03, 2013 11:45 pm  

William Eve wrote: I'm merely copying your perfect (non-fudged of course... no, really) round for round comparison method Smokey. You know, just like when you claimed that Rounds 2, 3 and 4 in 2013 were better attended than they were in 2011... HERE... but failed to disclose that you'd purposely misleaded us all with the Round 3 figures in 2011 by omitting the Wigan V Castleford fixture HERE when the attendance was in fact 13,096 which means that your assertion was incorrect and deliberately misleading all along? Round 2 attendances 2011 59947 round 2 attendances 2013 69809 round 3 attendances 2011 51216 + 13096 = 64312* round 3 attendances 2013 58711 round 4 attendances 2011 59217 round 4 attendances 2013 46166 total = rounds 2,3,4 attendances 2011 170380 + 13096 = 183476* total = rounds 2,3,4 attendances 2013 174686 Happy to help. *Amendments to Smokey's agenda-driven omissions in red Careful Smokey, or else we'll all have to assume you've got an agenda That is all true, and it wouldnt be entirely pointless nonsense if it werent for the fact that you have also tried to mislead us Mr Eve by slightly more as well. The reason being there is also a game missing from round 4 in 2013. The Wigan v Widnes game which I mentioned previously is the missing game from round 3 in 2011, and Leeds V Widnes is the missing game, which last season was attended 13326. A higher attendance than the 2011 missing game. So, as in all other figures we have removed the games which hadnt taken place a year ago. What would be trying to mislead people by comparing a total for 21 2011 games to 20 2013 games, for 2011 to be the higher attended fixtures, Leeds Rhinos would need to get a home attendance of 8790, which is not only a few thousand LESS than the season tickets already sold which would include this game, and over 4000 down on last years attendance, it would be be below the SL average, it would be Leeds lowest crowd for an SL home game for more than 10 years.

William Eve wrote: I'm merely copying your perfect (non-fudged of course... no, really) round for round comparison method Smokey. You know, just like when you claimed that Rounds 2, 3 and 4 in 2013 were better attended than they were in 2011... HERE... but failed to disclose that you'd purposely misleaded us all with the Round 3 figures in 2011 by omitting the Wigan V Castleford fixture HERE when the attendance was in fact 13,096 which means that your assertion was incorrect and deliberately misleading all along? Round 2 attendances 2011 59947 round 2 attendances 2013 69809 round 3 attendances 2011 51216 + 13096 = 64312* round 3 attendances 2013 58711 round 4 attendances 2011 59217 round 4 attendances 2013 46166 total = rounds 2,3,4 attendances 2011 170380 + 13096 = 183476* total = rounds 2,3,4 attendances 2013 174686 Happy to help. *Amendments to Smokey's agenda-driven omissions in red Careful Smokey, or else we'll all have to assume you've got an agenda That is all true, and it wouldnt be entirely pointless nonsense if it werent for the fact that you have also tried to mislead us Mr Eve by slightly more as well. The reason being there is also a game missing from round 4 in 2013. The Wigan v Widnes game which I mentioned previously is the missing game from round 3 in 2011, and Leeds V Widnes is the missing game, which last season was attended 13326. A higher attendance than the 2011 missing game. So, as in all other figures we have removed the games which hadnt taken place a year ago. What would be trying to mislead people by comparing a total for 21 2011 games to 20 2013 games, for 2011 to be the higher attended fixtures, Leeds Rhinos would need to get a home attendance of 8790, which is not only a few thousand LESS than the season tickets already sold which would include this game, and over 4000 down on last years attendance, it would be be below the SL average, it would be Leeds lowest crowd for an SL home game for more than 10 years.

Re: Opening SL weekend sees attendances tumbling by 12.66% : Sun Mar 03, 2013 11:46 pm  

Starbug wrote:

What context should we take the figures supplied by robt for the championships between 2001/2013 ?

this years attendances will probably get compared to last years valvoline cup so we can see how far the reserve comp has come


if i didn't laugh i'd cry...

Re: Opening SL weekend sees attendances tumbling by 12.66% : Sun Mar 03, 2013 11:49 pm  

Starbug wrote:

What context should we take the figures supplied by robt for the championships between 2001/2013 ?

Its one individual club in one year. More clubs, more years, more information.