Re: Danny McGuire's disallowed try : Sat Jul 02, 2011 9:31 am  

Steve Fox wrote:

"a kick whereby the ball is dropped from the hands (or hand) and is kicked immediately it rebounds from the ground"

That's the definition of a drop kick in the laws of the game. Not simultaneous contact between ball, ground and boot but immediately after it has rebounded from the floor.

McGuire did that. The ball wasn't bouncing round the floor for seconds before he kicked it. He met the ball as it bounced from the pitch.

What happened was that Alibert asked the wrong question in saying "did it hit the ground?", wrong because drop kicks ARE allowed to hit the ground.

He should have asked if the ball was dropped deliberately rather than accidentally and did McGuire kick it soon enough to qualify as a drop kick.

As I recall Ganson didn't watch a single replay in real time in making his decision so how can he possibly have judged if the ball was "kicked immediately it rebounds from the ground" as required by the laws?

The fact is that, in the heat of the moment, the 3 officials seems to have had a collective brain fart and forgotten about the possibility of a drop kick and instead got confused with a situation where a ball is dropped accidentally by a player and must then be kicked before it hits the ground if not to be ruled a knock on.

I cant believe some people are convincing themselves it was a try based on it being a drop goal. Have you every seen a drop goal from that position before?

Rugby League fans have got to be the most baised fans in any sport. Had that happened the other way round and it was Sam doing the 'drop kick', everyone on here would be saying it wasnt a try.

Re: Danny McGuire's disallowed try : Sat Jul 02, 2011 9:38 am  

Bondi_Warrior wrote:

I cant believe some people are convincing themselves it was a try based on it being a drop goal. Have you every seen a drop goal from that position before?

Rugby League fans have got to be the most baised fans in any sport. Had that happened the other way round and it was Sam doing the 'drop kick', everyone on here would be saying it wasnt a try.

Can you not get your head round the difference between a drop kick and a drop goal?

Just because all drop goals are drop kicks doesn't mean that all drop kicks are drop goals (successful or otherwise).

Re: Danny McGuire's disallowed try : Sat Jul 02, 2011 9:43 am  

I've never previously seen a half-volley kick ruled a knock-on. It was a good hit from Tomkins, a great play from Maguire, and I would have ruled it as a try, even accepting that the ball touched the ground before the boot made contact. It would have made amends for the shocking forward pass that gave Wigan the ascendency. Between those two decisions, it's hard not to conclude that the officials decided the result, against the balance of the play. Shame, after such a cracking contest.

Re: Danny McGuire's disallowed try : Sat Jul 02, 2011 9:43 am  

Steve Fox wrote:

"a kick whereby the ball is dropped from the hands (or hand) and is kicked immediately it rebounds from the ground"

That's the definition of a drop kick in the laws of the game. Not simultaneous contact between ball, ground and boot but immediately after it has rebounded from the floor.

McGuire did that. The ball wasn't bouncing round the floor for seconds before he kicked it. He met the ball as it bounced from the pitch.

What happened was that Alibert asked the wrong question in saying "did it hit the ground?", wrong because drop kicks ARE allowed to hit the ground.

He should have asked if the ball was dropped deliberately rather than accidentally and did McGuire kick it soon enough to qualify as a drop kick.

As I recall Ganson didn't watch a single replay in real time in making his decision so how can he possibly have judged if the ball was "kicked immediately it rebounds from the ground" as required by the laws?

The fact is that, in the heat of the moment, the 3 officials seems to have had a collective brain fart and forgotten about the possibility of a drop kick and instead got confused with a situation where a ball is dropped accidentally by a player and must then be kicked before it hits the ground if not to be ruled a knock on.

Do you actually believe that tripe? Or is this your first week watching RL?

He dropped the ball, it hit the floor. It's immediately a knock-on. As such, the fact he kicked it a moment later is irrelevant. A drop-kick is only permitted for a drop-out kick or when kicking for a drop-goal.

Seriously, I've seen some fans crying in desperation for a try (we're all guilty of it at times) but this is embarrassing. It was a knock-on - granted, a matter of a split-second - but it's as clear as day. Clutching at straws doesn't even come close.

Re: Danny McGuire's disallowed try : Sat Jul 02, 2011 9:44 am  

Steve Fox wrote:

Can you not get your head round the difference between a drop kick and a drop goal?

Just because all drop goals are drop kicks doesn't mean that all drop kicks are drop goals (successful or otherwise).

Can you not get your head around a no try? or even a knock on?

Re: Danny McGuire's disallowed try : Sat Jul 02, 2011 9:45 am  

Cronus wrote:

A drop-kick is only permitted for a drop-out kick or when kicking for a drop-goal.

If you show me where it says that in the laws of the game I'll readily concede that I'm wrong.

Re: Danny McGuire's disallowed try : Sat Jul 02, 2011 9:53 am  

Steve Fox wrote:

If you show me where it says that in the laws of the game I'll readily concede that I'm wrong.

Following your logic, if a player drops the ball accidentally he can lash out with the foot and if he connects just after it bounces, it's play on.

You're making a fool of yourself.

Re: Danny McGuire's disallowed try : Sat Jul 02, 2011 9:55 am  

I was at Cas so I didn't see the incident, but a dropkick is made when the ball is deliberately placed on the foot on the half-volley. If the player drops the ball and kicks it on the half volley, then it is a knock-on.

Re: Danny McGuire's disallowed try : Sat Jul 02, 2011 9:57 am  

Cronus wrote:

Do you actually believe that tripe? Or is this your first week watching RL?

He dropped the ball, it hit the floor. It's immediately a knock-on. As such, the fact he kicked it a moment later is irrelevant. A drop-kick is only permitted for a drop-out kick or when kicking for a drop-goal.

Seriously, I've seen some fans crying in desperation for a try (we're all guilty of it at times) but this is embarrassing. It was a knock-on - granted, a matter of a split-second - but it's as clear as day. Clutching at straws doesn't even come close.

You can make a drop kick anywhere you want, quite a few grubber kicks are done on the half volley.

Re: Danny McGuire's disallowed try : Sat Jul 02, 2011 10:00 am  

Teessidewire wrote:

You can make a drop kick anywhere you want, quite a few grubber kicks are done on the half volley.

I understand that, but this wasn't a drop-kick, no matter how far certain people stretch their imagination.

McGuire shaped to kick as Tomkins tackled him - it was this tackle that put him off making a clean kick. The ball hit the floor, bounced up and McGuire knocked it forward with his foot.

There was a clear bounce, then a split-second before contact with the foot. Knock-on.