Re: Peter Hood says Bulls on brink of going bust. : Tue Apr 03, 2012 5:20 pm  

I keep coming in from work and reading all these posts and trying to make sense of it all. I'm a highly intelligent woman with so many letters after my name that they won't all fit on the envelope but I really, really can't understand most of what is being mooted. Adeybull is giving fantastic support to people like me but he keeps lsoing me all the time (not your fault Adey - you couldn't do any more to explain). I just keep getting more and more depressed about the whole business, largely because I feel misinformed, underinformed and useless. I also cannot shake the belief that Peter Hood et al are driven by the ghost of Machiavelli which makes it so difficult to believe anything they say. Do Hood et al have the sort of proper advice they need? Are they taking it? Am I just being overly pessimistic?

Re: Peter Hood says Bulls on brink of going bust. : Tue Apr 03, 2012 5:27 pm  

vbfg wrote:

The good cop / bad cop act is annoying me, and I'm disposed to give what I can. Are those waiting to be convinced really going to buy this?

Particularly when the things Ryan says are just silly. Why would interested parties be paying attention to a pledge which will only strengthen the potential seller's hand? The inference is that the interested parties don't have any money either.

Re: Peter Hood says Bulls on brink of going bust. : Tue Apr 03, 2012 5:48 pm  

"This income would enable the Club to meet some upcoming liabilities including player and staff salaries and a tax bill. Once these liabilities are met the Club would have a month to six weeks to explore other income / investment opportunities including the possibility of a new ownership model."

hmmm, thats a new one. Could this be an option for supporters to buy shares in a pledge stage 2 for the next 500k if new outside investment is not forthcoming? The membership donates in stage 1 to get to 500k, and then gets the option to buy shares and a representative place at the board room table in stage 2 in exchange for another 500k?

Re: Peter Hood says Bulls on brink of going bust. : Tue Apr 03, 2012 5:54 pm  

Duckman wrote:

"This income would enable the Club to meet some upcoming liabilities including player and staff salaries and a tax bill. Once these liabilities are met the Club would have a month to six weeks to explore other income / investment opportunities including the possibility of a new ownership model."

hmmm, thats a new one. Could this be an option for supporters to buy shares in a pledge stage 2 for the next 500k if new outside investment is not forthcoming? The membership donates in stage 1 to get to 500k, and then gets the option to buy shares and a representative place at the board room table in stage 2 in exchange for another 500k?

That's how I read it too.

Re: Peter Hood says Bulls on brink of going bust. : Tue Apr 03, 2012 6:05 pm  

mat wrote:

That's how I read it too.

If we assume we get 500k from donations. Then assume any outside investment is either small or waiting for administration, then the current BOD might have to find some way of reasking the membership for more help as a last resort. The only possible way this would be even remotely feasible is if at the next time of asking we get something tangable for any further money. Which would be a share of ownership in the club, presumably with a presence in some form on the board. Would still be a big ask to get the next 500k, but might be worth a shot.

Would I put more money in in this scenario? possibly, but I would probably want to attend some type of extraordinary meeting for members explaining things face to face first.

Re: Peter Hood says Bulls on brink of going bust. : Tue Apr 03, 2012 6:22 pm  

Duckman wrote:

If we assume we get 500k from donations. Then assume any outside investment is either small or waiting for administration, then the current BOD might have to find some way of reasking the membership for more help as a last resort. The only possible way this would be even remotely feasible is if at the next time of asking we get something tangable for any further money. Which would be a share of ownership in the club, presumably with a presence in some form on the board. Would still be a big ask to get the next 500k, but might be worth a shot.

Would I put more money in in this scenario? possibly, but I would probably want to attend some type of extraordinary meeting for members explaining things face to face first.

any sort of new share issue is more time consuming to arrange than initial two weeks club had to work with. they have to issue prospectus's etc. I'd imagine thats reason they didnt go down that route for initial pledge but are maybe considering it for the 2nd amount?.

Re: Peter Hood says Bulls on brink of going bust. : Tue Apr 03, 2012 6:25 pm  

mat wrote:

any sort of new share issue is more time consuming to arrange than initial two weeks club had to work with. they have to issue prospectus's etc. I'd imagine thats reason they didnt go down that route for initial pledge but are maybe considering it for the 2nd amount?.

I'd go with that, and it might be only a fall back option which they were hoping is not needed if investment comes forward after we get to the first 500k....or it might be something they thought of this aft....or we might be reading a hell of a lot too much into one press release?

Re: Peter Hood says Bulls on brink of going bust. : Tue Apr 03, 2012 6:37 pm  

If the club does survive it will almost certainly be asking for further contributions from the fans. In the form of significantly increased season ticket prices.

The economic rationale for the cheap tickets was that increased attendances would result in increased commercial income, through sponsorship, advertising and beer sales.

It must now be abundantly clear to sponsors that actual average attendances are 3-4,000 less than season ticket sales. Fans have bought cheap season tickets knowing that they wouldnt be able to get to several matches. Once they've bought the cheap tickets ther're much more likely to stay away if performances are poor than they would be if they'd paid full price. They're probably less inclined to buy a shirt. And the beer queues aren't any longer.

It will be a major challenge for the club to restore prices to a more realistic level. Asking for further contributions on top might be a stretch.


.

Re: Peter Hood says Bulls on brink of going bust. : Tue Apr 03, 2012 6:45 pm  

Duckman wrote:

"This income would enable the Club to meet some upcoming liabilities including player and staff salaries and a tax bill. Once these liabilities are met the Club would have a month to six weeks to explore other income / investment opportunities including the possibility of a new ownership model."

hmmm, thats a new one. Could this be an option for supporters to buy shares in a pledge stage 2 for the next 500k if new outside investment is not forthcoming? The membership donates in stage 1 to get to 500k, and then gets the option to buy shares and a representative place at the board room table in stage 2 in exchange for another 500k?

This is a worry, so you pledge the 500K then what if no buyer? another 500K from where

Having gone through this pain in Wakey where the board wanted supporters to pledge or watch the club wither, we had a buyer who waited for admin and got the club for a song we lost some players and the new man honoured some debts

I have thought about pledging but looked at the response to Wakefield who were written off, it now looks a lot rosier for us 12 months on, I just fear the first pledge is a stay of execution if the duirectors have gaurentees whats the state of play with those?

Re: Peter Hood says Bulls on brink of going bust. : Tue Apr 03, 2012 6:56 pm  

REDWHITEANDBLUE wrote:

This is a worry, so you pledge the 500K then what if no buyer? another 500K from where

Having gone through this pain in Wakey where the board wanted supporters to pledge or watch the club wither, we had a buyer who waited for admin and got the club for a song we lost some players and the new man honoured some debts

I have thought about pledging but looked at the response to Wakefield who were written off, it now looks a lot rosier for us 12 months on, I just fear the first pledge is a stay of execution if the duirectors have gaurentees whats the state of play with those?

For the next 500k, if there is no buyer or at least significant investment and no more take up from the fans then its administration. But do we have a buyer waiting like wakey did? If we do then ok, I can see where we might go, if there is no such buyer its bye bye, which is why we can't just welcome administration, we don't know if anyone will bring us out of it.

I share your fear.