McManus out! : Sun Mar 18, 2012 11:07 am  

Ok. It's a joke. But I'm interested to hear why people think Royce should go for admittedly poor performance and perceived recruitment mistakes when McManus has been blundering in the transfer market for years. If anyone is to blame for the current state of the squad it's him.

Meli should never have been kept. Gardner should never have been kept. Flannery should never have been kept. The Eastmond saga was allowed to drag on to the start of last season which is the primary reason we have no scrum half now. The decision to rely almost completely on the academy three years before any of its current products had reached physical maturity etc.

Royce has only been here for a couple of seasons. McManus has been making mistakes for much longer.

Re: McManus out! : Sun Mar 18, 2012 11:10 am  

did he make these choices or did thbe coaches? Certainly Eamonn has had other things to concentrate on and so will be given a season or so before real questions will be asked

Re: McManus out! : Sun Mar 18, 2012 11:22 am  

That's the thing though, these mistakes will probably take Saints the best part of ten years to recover from. I have said for years that the recruitment, retention and youth development have been neglected for years and we are going to suffer because of that now.

I have asked the question tons of times as to who is in charge of such matters at Saints but got no answer. If it is McManus then yes he's done a very poor job, but that is what will happen when you completely ignore the whole rugby side of the operation.

It's quite a serious issue as well because a lot of the potential revenue gains from the stadium will be lost through fans not turning up in the numbers they would have done had we had a competitive side. If we keep up this level of performance throughout the season I wouldn't want to be in charge of selling season ticket renewals for next season. The club has to act now and show the kind of commitment and ambition to win that made us champions in 1996 and laid the foundations find for the decade of success that followed. A new coaching structure from top to bottom would freshen things up and then we need to focus on recruitment and showing no sentimentality with retentions as well. They have to set the goal of replacing each outgoing player with a better player and also signing players for positions we require them and not just because they are available.

Re: McManus out! : Sun Mar 18, 2012 11:24 am  

Saint Simon wrote:

did he make these choices or did thbe coaches? Certainly Eamonn has had other things to concentrate on and so will be given a season or so before real questions will be asked

It's inconceivable that McManus had no input. From what I've seen and heard of other football and rugby clubs the decision is at least a 50/50 split between chairman and the coaching team. Which is as it should be given it's as much a business decision as anything else. And McManus was CERTAINLY behind the club's decision to cut away the more established pros and run with the academy. An academy that only developed into physically mature adults (barring Gaskell and a couple of others who are from a later generation) LAST SEASON (three years after the the choice was made).

McManus signed Potter. McManus signed Royce. I didn't have a problem with the former because he did have a good record with Catalans but the decision to go with Royce was highly suspect. Aside from his reputation for working with kids his coaching experience at the top level was questionable to say the least.

I've always wondered why so many players have recently chosen to back out of deals at Saints at the last minute. Sure, it's happened before. But I don't recall it ever happening so often. Of course, McManus may not be responsible. But given that we certainly needed at least some of those players I wonder whether we could have done more.

Re: McManus out! : Sun Mar 18, 2012 11:28 am  

We have two very separate issues here, and our transfer policy has very little to do with our lack of form and bewildering tactics.

If you ignore the recent form and league table, and then compare the bradford team with the saints team you would expect Saints to win 9 times out of 10. We have a good squad but we are not playing anywhere near our potential.

We have a squad that is good enough to compete for both the trophies, but we are punching well below our weight.

Re: McManus out! : Sun Mar 18, 2012 11:43 am  

rlcoach wrote:

We have two very separate issues here, and our transfer policy has very little to do with our lack of form and bewildering tactics.

This is nonsense. If you don't have a scrum half and you don't have a leader on the pitch it's very difficult to organise a cohesive attacking strategy on the pitch. And the lack of both is directly attributable to our transfer policy.

If you ignore the recent form and league table, and then compare the bradford team with the saints team you would expect Saints to win 9 times out of 10. We have a good squad but we are not playing anywhere near our potential.

I too think we have a good squad. But we have no one on the pitch capable of analysing the defence and calling attacking plays to exploit clear weaknesses. Gaskell may fulfil that role in the future but right now he's too inexperienced to do it effectively for any sustained period. All coaches allow for creative freedom on the pitch. It would be madness not to because opponents may change their gameplan to suit and once the team has crossed the whitewash it is effectively beyond influence of the coach. We don't used highly-scripted playbooks like those found in the NFL (although even NFL quaterbacks have creative latitude). Unfortunately, because we have no scrum half, no tactical brain, we are forced to keep repeating plan A. And it's killing us.

Re: McManus out! : Sun Mar 18, 2012 11:49 am  

This is ridiculous.

Saints have made 5 grand finals on the trot.

The much maligned youngsters and coach you have now got you to the grand final last year.

Yet one losing run and suddenly theres been terrible problems for years at the club. Massive knee jark reaction.

If you beat leeds next week suddenly everythying will be the dogs bollox again.

Re: McManus out! : Sun Mar 18, 2012 11:56 am  

Wilbred T Pricklepop wrote:

Yet one losing run and suddenly theres been terrible problems for years at the club. Massive knee jark reaction.

If you beat leeds next week suddenly everythying will be the dogs bollox again.

It's not just that we've not won for 5 games - it's the way the team is playing. That people are analysing how exactly we came to this point isn't knee-jerk... in fact it's the opposite.

If we squeak a win against Leeds next week, it how I'll react is seeing whether it'd been by suffocating them in a low-scoring arm-wrestle or by out-attacking them. If the former, then the inherent problems remain.

Re: McManus out! : Sun Mar 18, 2012 11:57 am  

Of course we would have done better if we had recruited better. We probably also would have won yesterdays match if Roby had of been playing. However are we really playing to our full potential?

We are not even close.

Our squad has its limits, but we are a world away from hitting them at the moment. We aren't 9th purely because of an inexperienced half back pairing, or having Lomax at 7. Likewise if we had another scrum half, we wouldn't suddenly be using more varied patterns of attack, and our runners wouldn't suddenly be hitting al sorts of different lines. They are doing what they are coached to do.

I do think are recruitment has also let us down, but I am currently more frustrated out how we are under-performing. You look at the squad, and it is very frustrating that we are not playing better. We are very capable of playing much better.

We have two problems. One is our recruitment has not been the best, and our squad is weaker. The other problem is we are under-performing. The first problem reduces are chances of winning trophies, but still allows us to be very competitive. The latter means we are 9th.

Re: McManus out! : Sun Mar 18, 2012 11:58 am  

Wilbred T Pricklepop wrote:

Saints have made 5 grand finals on the trot.

Excuse me. We have made it to SIX Grand Finals on the trot. We won the first one. A second win has now been beyond three different coaches.