Re: team for friday v widnes : Sat Apr 21, 2012 4:23 pm  

SaintsFan wrote:

Let's look at the alternative, the one which reflects what I actually said, by way of an imaginary (but perfectly possible) conversation:

Coaches: 'Where do you feel happiest playing, Franny?'

Franny: 'On the wing'

Coaches: 'Ok then. Wing it is.'

So I was right when I thought you'd made the whole thing up, then.

Re: team for friday v widnes : Sat Apr 21, 2012 4:31 pm  

SaintsFan wrote:

Let's look at the alternative, the one which reflects what I actually said, by way of an imaginary (but perfectly possible) conversation:

Coaches: 'Where do you feel happiest playing, Franny?'

Franny: 'On the wing'

Coaches: 'Ok then. Wing it is.'

which would make it a coaching decision. I can assure you all players speak to their coach and let them know where they prefer to play it's nothing out of the ordinary

Re: team for friday v widnes : Sat Apr 21, 2012 4:42 pm  

I think we can all be selective in the views that we take from time to time.

I agree that when the new set up took over, they said that they would share some ideas with senior players. However it is one thing to have an opening exchange with senior players about where they thought things were going wrong. Saying that week in week out there was going to be a coaching collective is not true.

Translating this to players getting to pick where they play is a case of fitting a statement to fit your own interpretation. The discussion that the Saints players have with Daniel Anderson was around the type of attack we employed and that we did not have the personnel for the type of play anderson originally wanted.

With Rush and KC the discussion may have been more along the lines the style of attack that Royce employed and the defensive patterns he favoured and what they felt would work better.

I think the using of more experienced pros was to redress the balance that some including Foster and Gaskell where left hanging out to dry, with confidence down effecting their games. This was something that nearly all people agreed on before Royce went even those with different views on whether Royce should have stayed, or stayed longer, or gone.

Makinson whilst not having a blitering scoring record, did not have the same frailties in his game and so that is why he has made the squad more often.

As for when we will see Gaskell or Foster again, well it's a bit early to be calling time after less than 5 matches. That's a little over a month which is nothing in terms of players coming in and out of first team squads.

Re: team for friday v widnes : Sat Apr 21, 2012 5:41 pm  

Dux wrote:

So I was right when I thought you'd made the whole thing up, then.

Funny that since you agreed with some of what I said!

I've made up nothing, except the imaginary conversation which I did say was imaginary (that means made up, in case you aren't aware!).

Re: team for friday v widnes : Sat Apr 21, 2012 5:45 pm  

bewareshadows wrote:

I think we can all be selective in the views that we take from time to time.

All views are selective, all of the time.

Saying that week in week out there was going to be a coaching collective is not true.

And you know this how? You don't. As you said above, we can all be selective in the views we take. You have selected to choose not to believe a coaching collective exists; at present anyway, I choose to believe that it does.

People just interpret the evidence in their own way, as you said above.

Re: team for friday v widnes : Sat Apr 21, 2012 5:52 pm  

No1 Saint wrote:

which would make it a coaching decision. I can assure you all players speak to their coach and let them know where they prefer to play it's nothing out of the ordinary

I can assure you that I know that already. However, the context of all of this is not about players having a chat with the coach. It's about a coach and his assistant being sacked because some senior players were unhappy, then two totally inexperienced (at this level) people replacing that coaching staff (a situation no Saints fan would have tolerated if those replacements had not been who they are) and going on about playing the Saints way and players being happy in their rugby and all that stuff.

To properly appreciate a point, or indeed anything in life, you have to take it in its context. That is the context of this discussion which makes it different from, say, players having a chat with Daniel Anderson.

Re: team for friday v widnes : Sat Apr 21, 2012 5:54 pm  

SaintsFan wrote:

Because Meli wanted to play on the wing, and we have a coaching collective in place at present.

That's a joke isn't it?

Re: team for friday v widnes : Sat Apr 21, 2012 5:55 pm  

SaintsFan wrote:

I can assure you that I know that already. However, the context of all of this is not about players having a chat with the coach. It's about a coach and his assistant being sacked because some senior players were unhappy, then two totally inexperienced (at this level) people replacing that coaching staff (a situation no Saints fan would have tolerated if those replacements had not been who they are) and going on about playing the Saints way and players being happy in their rugby and all that stuff.

To properly appreciate a point, or indeed anything in life, you have to take it in its context. That is the context of this discussion which makes it different from, say, players having a chat with Daniel Anderson.

And then winning 5 out of 6 games since they were put in charge after coming off the back of 5 games without a win!

Personally I think your making stuff up with the 'coaching collective' but I guess you're entitled to your opinion. Either way it appears we are better off with the way it's going now than the way it was, coaching collective or not.

Re: team for friday v widnes : Sat Apr 21, 2012 6:51 pm  

BackrowSaint wrote:

And then winning 5 out of 6 games since they were put in charge after coming off the back of 5 games without a win!

Leeds recently lost three games in succession, but they then won a game. In fact, Leeds were terrible last season and everybody wrote them off. But hey, they still managed to beat us at OT. So unlike a lot of people I didn't put half as much importance in those losses, which were all extremely close, as many people did.

Personally I think your making stuff up with the 'coaching collective' but I guess you're entitled to your opinion.

I'm either making stuff up or I'm expressing an opinion. Do you know the difference between the two?

Let me help you. I'm expressing an opinion. I've said that all along.

Re: team for friday v widnes : Sat Apr 21, 2012 6:56 pm  

Talk Some Sense! wrote:

That's a joke isn't it?

Let me ask you something.

If McManus had announced that Mike Unknown* who oversaw youth development at Crunulla Sharks plus Keiron Legend* who retired from playing there a year ago were going to coach Saints after the sacking of Royce Simmons, would you have been happy at that appointment?

PS: For those still unsure of the difference, the names with the asterisks marked beside them are made up. That is, they are imaginary.