Re: Kieron New Coach : Wed Oct 22, 2014 10:02 am  

Judder Man wrote:

I think one of the worse coaching debut's was Ian Millward if I remember rightly was Leeds 70 Saints 0 and he inherited a good team where Browny had to rebuild one and Cunningham needs to take it one step further.

Pretty sure milwards coaching debut was a win away at hull on a Friday night. Brian carney had a nightmare that night.

Re: Kieron New Coach : Wed Oct 22, 2014 10:05 am  

St pete wrote:

Pretty sure milwards coaching debut was a win away at hull on a Friday night. Brian carney had a nightmare that night.

It was indeed. I remember it well for two landmark decisions made by Millward - Tommy Martyn reinstated at stand off and Paul Wellens picked at full back for the first time. Both had blinders.

Re: Kieron New Coach : Wed Oct 22, 2014 11:20 am  

Dux wrote:

It was indeed. I remember it well for two landmark decisions made by Millward - Tommy Martyn reinstated at stand off and Paul Wellens picked at full back for the first time. Both had blinders.

Christ, ad people think Brown does weird things. Hanley was off his rocker.
We got a couple of decent towellings when he was in charge, memorably the away trip to Bradford in the playoffs, two weeks before beating them in the final. Millward was never adverse to popping a 70 point loss into his season (not just when coaching us, either), just got to have something about you to have 70 points put past you when coaching both Saints AND Wigan.
Anderson cut these drubbings out, but, after 2006, our performance in Finals started to wane. Given the ridiculous line up he was fielding in 2006, combined with the RFL pushing a quick PTB at the time, he wasn't solid gold.

Brown was a weirdo, and I never liked the "its just another 2 points" stance, but even after all the crap he dished up in 2013, the performances quickly bucked up when we got towards the close of the season. This year, despite all the injuries we got the LLS, when we did have all our players, we looked sharp. In the early part of the season, he threw a lot of experience at the youngsters, before reigning it in and doing exactly what needed to be done to win the playoffs.

I'm still scratching my head as to how we did it, but were the MFing champions. We won ugly a few times this season when our backs were against the wall and I'm one of the few, apparently, who's 99% sure that even if Flower had stayed on the pitch, we'd still have won.

Brown didn't make me feel confident, at all. I think that's the problem. Things seemed so random, even for sport. Now he's all done and dusted, though, he's the first coach in 3 (4 if you count Rush) to get us a trophy. That is in the history books and that you cannot deny.

Re: Kieron New Coach : Wed Oct 22, 2014 11:43 am  

I felt it was less random under Brown to be honest.

As for not being able to push us to that final spot, well he did without any halfbacks, pivot fullback or pivot loose forward.

When you look at who was out in the final it seems he over acheived, but if you gave us our best line up, I would have backed brown to win the GF.

The 2006 league was a freak league for a top team to lose only 4 games by a maximum of (was it 4 or 5 points).

After that we had the consistency which helped us alot with the CC and progressing through to finals. But in terms of that last effort in the GF. I would take Milward over Anderson each day of the week.

Re: Kieron New Coach : Wed Oct 22, 2014 11:52 am  

bewareshadows wrote:

I felt it was less random under Brown to be honest.

As for not being able to push us to that final spot, well he did without any halfbacks, pivot fullback or pivot loose forward.

When you look at who was out in the final it seems he over acheived, but if you gave us our best line up, I would have backed brown to win the GF.

The 2006 league was a freak league for a top team to lose only 4 games by a maximum of (was it 4 or 5 points).

After that we had the consistency which helped us alot with the CC and progressing through to finals. But in terms of that last effort in the GF. I would take Milward over Anderson each day of the week.

The 4 games we lost in 2006 was by 1,2,3 and 4 points each - a hell of an effort.

I would actually say Brown is a pretty happy medium between the rigid structure of Anderson, that brought us success at the time but took years to coach out of them when he left and the total chaos of Millward, which lurched from one drama to the next.

I can't help but feel that Millward should of done better with the team he had (yes I know he was very successful, but he had teams capable of grand slams that he never achieved.)

Re: Kieron New Coach : Wed Oct 22, 2014 12:21 pm  

[quote="Magic Superbeetle"]
I would actually say Brown is a pretty happy medium between the rigid structure of Anderson, that brought us success at the time but took years to coach out of them when he left and the total chaos of Millward, which lurched from one drama to the next.

quote]

I would agree where Browny "sits at the coaching table", the problem we have is that our last 3 coaches where lacking a bit of charisma, personality etc call it what you will.
Its the last couple of superleague games and the play offs is where Browny started to connect with the fans and later he will be more remembered for the 2 pieces of silverware, that was long overdue.

Re: Kieron New Coach : Wed Oct 22, 2014 1:15 pm  

St pete wrote:

Pretty sure milwards coaching debut was a win away at hull on a Friday night. Brian carney had a nightmare that night.

I remember that game so well, it was like a renaissance for the entertaining rugby you associate with Saints. Millward seemed to just let them off the leash and express themselves...bringing Tommy Martyn back into the team, who epitomised what Saints are all about. Hanley did a good job on us and made us a well drilled, hard to beat side but it was like trying to make Barcelona play like Chelsea. It just didn't fit, although the likes of Long respected him immensely.

Who can forget the wide to west try? That's Saints all over. If I remember right, Wigan beat us something like 42-4 at KR only the week before, we went to their ground in the play offs and beat them 54-16. Which strangely as it seems, I enjoyed far far more than the 75-0 victory. Anthony Sullivan's try that night was fantastic.

I digress...my point is, Millward was brilliant for us, and I forgive him the odd brain fart during his reign and even coaching Wigan.

Re: Kieron New Coach : Thu Oct 23, 2014 3:21 pm  

Re: Brown.

I had reservations when he came. His Hudds team had tailed off after that demonic defensive season they had and that tempered any enthusiasm I had for him. Last year I wasn't expecting much. We lost out on Chris Hill and took a punt on Walmesley. It helped Brown to identify what we knew we were missing i.e. a half back, Lomax at full back and a grafting prop. We addressed that and started this season like a house on fire. We were great.

Defensively we dropped off and never really had that intensity until later in the season when we were battling teams without half backs. Almost every game in the final few weeks felt like an arm wrestle. Somehow, despite our vulnerabilities we still made it through and Brown deserves a lot of credit, as do the players, for the belief they had in themselves. If you put the effort and commitment in that can be enough to get you through the playoffs and it was never more in evidence than in the Grand Final when composure and patience played a bit part.

Next year we look stronger and it's a great base on which KC can build upon. I'm sure the club is already looking beyond that because bringing through some quality half backs of our own is a priority from today onwards.

On the 2006 side, it might be a while before we see anything like them again, however, if we stay free from injuries next year we have a good chance of seeing a team which has the potential to lead from the front again.

Re: Kieron New Coach : Thu Oct 23, 2014 4:05 pm  

Twentyman wrote:

Anthony Sullivan's try that night was fantastic.

Seconds before half time, when half the stand had nipped to the bar to get a jump on the queue!?

That match also had one of Stevo's (few) great commentary lines. As Long lined up a penalty in the closing minutes - "Bring on the salt, the wound is wide open!"

Re: Kieron New Coach : Fri Oct 24, 2014 12:29 am  

It's a measure of the standard of analysis in SL that throughout all last season - from game one right up to the Semi (when everyone was obsessed with Wigan and Warrington's "scintillating" attacking play) - virtually no one thought to mention a) Saints full strength pack is both enormous and effective and b) the dominant SL pack usual wins the GF.