Re: Quarter Final Aftermath : Sat May 12, 2012 10:28 pm  

Cherry.Pie wrote:

Prescott has been just as good as Mossop so far this year although they have slightly different playing styles. Mossop has a better work rate but Prescott is harder to bring down and a much better ball player. Prescott is also more important in Wigan's attacking moves and more likely to put players through gaps. I'd take both of them over LMS, Laffranchi, Perry etc.

Prescott is three years older and has 40 odd more appearances than Mossop, I'd expect him to be doing better than Mossop had they been of comparable ability. Prescott should be coming into his prime about now, he's not much better than he was when he first broke into your team.

I'd take Mossop, I agree with that, but not Prescott.

Re: Quarter Final Aftermath : Sat May 12, 2012 10:36 pm  

Billinge_Lump wrote:

Prescott is three years older and has 40 odd more appearances than Mossop, I'd expect him to be doing better than Mossop had they been of comparable ability.

not necessarily an excuse but something to consider, i believe prescott was doing a law degree along side playing which he finished at the end of the 2010 season and i personally believe he has become a much more mature player since, but well see what he does this year.

Re: Quarter Final Aftermath : Sat May 12, 2012 10:39 pm  

Phuzzy wrote:

Ah, ok. I see where you're coming from. However to put it purely down to structures is not giving credit where it's due. This is a very good Wigan team. The best I've seen in quite a while. Hence the 2 trophies in as many seasons and currently standing top of the league and one game away from Wembley again. We won at a canter today without even playing to our ability and, as the saying goes, that's always the sign of a good team. Saints time will come again. Of that I have no doubt. But as it stands, your current team couldn't play the gameplan that this Wigan side does. However, as a hypothetical I agree with what you're saying. Maybe you could have put it better though and not been so quick to dismiss what is clearly an important part of the success; i.e. the ability to play to the structures in the first place.

I think what he's saying, is that the top three of four teams (I am counting us in this due to last years finishing position ) players are of a similar standard. Squads are better in some areas than others, but on the day each team can beat the other. However, Wigan's current set up (not much changed from Maguire's in reality, but sometimes the best management is not to change things that are working) gives you that edge. Players are comfortable in their positions and what they are expected to do, plays have been worked on and everyone knows what they are doing. We just look clueless at times.

Re: Quarter Final Aftermath : Sat May 12, 2012 10:42 pm  

the wrestler wrote:

not necessarily an excuse but something to consider, i believe prescott was doing a law degree along side playing which he finished at the end of the 2010 season and i personally believe he has become a much more mature player since, but well see what he does this year.

Fair enough, but I've not seen much in his game to make me think that there's potential there for him to get much better than he is.

Re: Quarter Final Aftermath : Sat May 12, 2012 11:06 pm  

Some amazing bury your head in the sand posts on here. The facts of the matter are James Roby is the best hooker in superleague but he makes your side one dimensional. He isn't one dimensional but the Saints side reliance on him is beyond belief! Wigan are laughing their paps off at the minute knowing if they close him down the game is won.

As for my original post about who'd get in a combined team if I had to name them like I say it's a Wigan 1-7 and in the pack Roby would get a start and Soliola and TP may scrape bench spots but that is literally it.

Things need to change starting with having a player who's miles better then Hohiha in Gaskell starting at 6! If you guys can't use him I'm sure we'd find use for him.

Re: Quarter Final Aftermath : Sat May 12, 2012 11:17 pm  

NickyKiss wrote:

Some amazing bury your head in the sand posts on here. The facts of the matter are James Roby is the best hooker in superleague but he makes your side one dimensional. He isn't one dimensional but the Saints side reliance on him is beyond belief! Wigan are laughing their paps off at the minute knowing if they close him down the game is won.

As for my original post about who'd get in a combined team if I had to name them like I say it's a Wigan 1-7 and in the pack Roby would get a start and Soliola and TP may scrape bench spots but that is literally it.

Things need to change starting with having a player who's miles better then Hohiha in Gaskell starting at 6! If you guys can't use him I'm sure we'd find use for him.

I'm confused! After what you have said above, are you now admitting our 4th choice halfback would get in your squad.

Re: Quarter Final Aftermath : Sat May 12, 2012 11:21 pm  

NickyKiss wrote:

Some amazing bury your head in the sand posts on here. The facts of the matter are James Roby is the best hooker in superleague but he makes your side one dimensional. He isn't one dimensional but the Saints side reliance on him is beyond belief! Wigan are laughing their paps off at the minute knowing if they close him down the game is won

Well I suppose that is a more logical post than what some have come out with today.

I understand your point, but when a side has been coached into playing to plan A (the ruck area) with no plan B then it will always be their 'comfort zone'. Lesser teams have real problems round the ruck, so when that is exposed we come out of our shell and play some decent rugby. When we come up against quality teams (like Wigan) and we don't find it as easy in that area we panic and sit in that 'comfort zone' as that's all this set of players know. We aren't coached in a way to express ourselves and test the edges, so when plan A fails....we continue on with it.

Rush isn't a full time head coach, so he is not expected to coach us out of this habit, but when Brown comes in we should see a real difference I reckon. I think one of Roby's strengths is his clever and instinctive distribution (something that is rarely picked up on) and that is an area that can be looked at IMO when Brown gets here; he is far from a one trick pony.

The Saints TEAM as a whole is one-dimension; I wouldn't shift all the blame onto James Roby,

Re: Quarter Final Aftermath : Sun May 13, 2012 12:16 am  

Phuzzy wrote:

Is this a serious post? So the side that has comprehensively beaten you on BOTH occassions and outperformed you player for player would have 8 players to the beaten sides 9? Or even 7 to 10?!?! Your pack has been completely dominated on BOTH occassions. Your backs have looked ponderous and your halves clueless. Mate...you've lost the plot! Can I just ask what exactly you're basing these choices on? Stats? Performance from either match? Or shall we just put it down to wishful thinking?

To make it simple for you I'll state it again - Our players are underperforming because they have been poorly coached for a long time and our tactics are predictable and one-dimensional. Our players are of a generally higher natural standard and of a greater level of talent than yours. Stick a quality coach in charge of our current squad for a few months and things would be rather different. If roles had been reversed and you'd had Royce instead of Maggie the last couple of years you'd have done well to make top 4 and wouldn't have had a sniff of any trophies. Warrington (by some distance) and Saints/Leeds (rather more marginally) have better squads than you do at the moment, but none of them have done as good a job of sow's ear maximisation as you have the last couple of years. Depressingly.

Re: Quarter Final Aftermath : Sun May 13, 2012 2:40 am  

Duke Eddington wrote:

I'm confused! After what you have said above, are you now admitting our 4th choice halfback would get in your squad.

He's correctly making the point that Gaskell should be our 1st choice at 6!! Why the coaching team at Saints can't see what everyone else can is beyond me.

Re: Quarter Final Aftermath : Sun May 13, 2012 4:20 am  

Northampton_Saint wrote:

Based on player ability/talent and not current form (which is all you'll be using to judge on naturally but which would be criminally unfair given our respective current coaching situations):

1. Tompkins
2. Richards*
3. Wheeler
4. Carmont*
5. Meli
6. Finch
7. Lomax (not a #7 but would need to be in my team somewhere and Finch would make him 10x more effective there)
8. La Frank
9. Roby
10. TP
11. Soliola
12. Hock
13. O'Loughlin
14. Mossop
15. Clough **
16. Wilkin
17. Hohaia ***

* Both look past their best, especially Richards, so you can have Charnley and Goulding instead if you want. Shenton should probably feature ahead of Goulding on the talent/ability scale, but has been so disappointing for Saints so far that I just can't justify it.

** Clough has admittedly been **** for 2 years but I'm still hopeful he'll reignite with a decent coach.

*** OK, OK I'm joking... Leuluai

I make that a 9-8 Saints win (10-7 if you still hold out any hope of Shenton coming good, 11-6 in the ever increasingly unlikely event that Perry isn't washed up now), no 3 or 4 man holding down and ground-writhing required.

And no McIlorum instead of Roby

hahahahahaha and you called me biased hahahahaha!!!!

wheeler has about the same ability as goulding but goulding is playing miles better.
charnley has been the best winger this season so for you to say meli just shows how much of an idiot your being.
ok lomax's future looks good but he isn't better than a harry sunderland and the only GOOD world cup winning half back playing in superleague tommy.
'la frank' get real mossop is better by the biggest country mile you can find, and its saying something as he has been your best forward all season.
roby allways looks really good against decent teams and allways get bummed up but nobody mentions how he allways plays rubbish against us because he cant find the space and time to scoot.
Tp well this is where we show are depth because take your pick lima and prescott are as good as him and this season both have been better plus he isn't a prop!
not a wigan fan in the world would swap are backrowers showing the last couple of season why hansen is qaulity the best work horse in the league and is solid now