Re: For Saddened! : Mon Nov 14, 2011 10:30 pm  

Saint Simon wrote:

exactly, so we can rotate him with wheeler so neither plays too much!

Re: For Saddened! : Mon Nov 14, 2011 10:33 pm  

SaintsFan wrote:

Well, it didn't appear to take its toll on Makinson. In fact, he just got better and better and not only that but made that extra effort and displayed that extra skill for his try, which broke our duck in the GF. Not all players are the same. His kick returns got stronger as the season progressed. His confidence grew and his skill grew. He just grew. He shouldn't be held back IMO.

He made 16 appearances last year, to expect him to back that up this year to play every week would be foolish. The rest of this paragraph has little to do with what I said.

I have to say that is total rubbish. Meli gives big game experience? You're having a larf, surely! We went to pieces when he was on the wing in the GF, as we always do, because Meli is utter rubbish in big games. I wouldn't want any of our young players learning anything from him. In fact, he should have been watching Makinson. Makinson showed him up as a winger, and Makinson hadn't played on the wing prior to playing for the first team.

So Meli hasn't played in big games? Hasn't played in World Cups? Give it a rest.

Re: For Saddened! : Mon Nov 14, 2011 10:36 pm  

Saint Simon wrote:

exactly, so we can rotate him with wheeler so neither plays too much!

I wouldn't have Wheeler anywhere near half back until he's proved his fitness.

Re: For Saddened! : Mon Nov 14, 2011 10:47 pm  

Billinge_Lump wrote:

He made 16 appearances last year, to expect him to back that up this year to play every week would be foolish.

Don't be silly. Like I said, he was improving with each game. That wouldn't happen if it was all getting too much for him! If he is good enough, he is old enough. He is definitely good enough. Gaskell does still need breaks IMO; Makinson does not. It would be foolish to do anything other than have him play in every game. Just as we did with Foster.

So Meli hasn't played in big games? Hasn't played in World Cups? Give it a rest.

Playing in them is one thing, being good enough to pass on anything of any value to younger players is another altogether and it is the latter point which you made (big game experience) which I ridiculed. Meli is not a big game player. He is probably one of our most unreliable players in big games. Personally, I don't want to see him anywhere near another big game.

Re: For Saddened! : Mon Nov 14, 2011 10:53 pm  

Billinge_Lump wrote:

I wouldn't have Wheeler anywhere near half back until he's proved his fitness.

a bit harsh, he had wigan wrapped up on good friday until his injury

Re: For Saddened! : Mon Nov 14, 2011 11:01 pm  

SaintsFan wrote:

Don't be silly. Like I said, he was improving with each game. That wouldn't happen if it was all getting too much for him! If he is good enough, he is old enough. He is definitely good enough. Gaskell does still need breaks IMO; Makinson does not. It would be foolish to do anything other than have him play in every game. Just as we did with Foster.

Gaskell got better with each game he played, why is it different for him? He is good enough for first team rugby, however a back line containing Foster, Wheeler, Lomax, Gaskell and Makinson is too inexperienced for my liking. I see no problem with taking one or more of them out of the firing line for the next year or two.

Playing in them is one thing, being good enough to pass on anything of any value to younger players is another altogether and it is the latter point which you made (big game experience) which I ridiculed. Meli is not a big game player. He is probably one of our most unreliable players in big games. Personally, I don't want to see him anywhere near another big game.

He had no problem at centre in the GF, look at Wigan in 2006ish when they thought they could bin all their experience off and replace them with highly rated youngsters, they set back the careers of the likes of Brown and Robinson. It's a trap we don't want to fall into, and luckily the club doesn't appear to want to.

Re: For Saddened! : Mon Nov 14, 2011 11:04 pm  

Saint Simon wrote:

a bit harsh, he had wigan wrapped up on good friday until his injury

In a game we lost, which is my point exactly .

Losing a centre to injury is less problematic than losing a half back IMO. I'd be looking to rotate Lomax, Gaskell and Hohaia (although I still think that Lomax could be as successful as Tomkins at full back...)

Re: For Saddened! : Mon Nov 14, 2011 11:15 pm  

Billinge_Lump wrote:

In a game we lost, which is my point exactly .

Losing a centre to injury is less problematic than losing a half back IMO. I'd be looking to rotate Lomax, Gaskell and Hohaia (although I still think that Lomax could be as successful as Tomkins at full back...)

i thought Lomax was a shoe in for our future fullback, until Makinson exploded onto the scene, now i just cant decide! Lomax is more creative, but Makinson is possibly better under the bomb, and is faster. Both can beat a man one on one. Its a good problem to have

Re: For Saddened! : Mon Nov 14, 2011 11:46 pm  

Saint Simon wrote:

i thought Lomax was a shoe in for our future fullback, until Makinson exploded onto the scene, now i just cant decide! Lomax is more creative, but Makinson is possibly better under the bomb, and is faster. Both can beat a man one on one. Its a good problem to have

That it is.

Re: For Saddened! : Tue Nov 15, 2011 7:44 am  

Rogues Gallery wrote:

I think you'll find Howler will be used at hooker at Saints. That appeared to be his best position when he was playing for New Zealand Warriors.
He will probably start from the bench with Roby moving to loose forward, or he could start at half back and move him to hooker as Wigan do with Tommy L.

After seeing him start at hooker in the GF, I figured he'd replace Moore on our bench.
He'll come on, take some responsibility at dummy half but also jazz things up with some extra energy from first reciever.

As for Makinson; if he's going to start on the wing (and unless we improve our distribution to the right), I'd move him over to the left to see him get more of the ball.

However, by the end of the season, I would love it if we were regulary seeing something like

#1 Makinson
#3 Wheeler
#6 Gaskell
#7 Lomax

I think Tom could be a cracking full back - I just want him to get the ball in hand more. He's not just fast, he's got the skills aswell.