Re: Rochdale Hornets : Sat Oct 13, 2012 1:37 pm  

The Chair Maker wrote:

If Ian Talbot does well at Rochdale coaching the team there, then it also opens up a career pathway for him to bigger and better things.

So you are happy to use the Championships in the same way the NRL uses SL then? If so, that smacks of the same kind of arrogance.

Re: Rochdale Hornets : Sat Oct 13, 2012 3:12 pm  

SaintsFan wrote:

So you are happy to use the Championships in the same way the NRL uses SL then? If so, that smacks of the same kind of arrogance.

I really don't see why it is using. If it works well, it will be a symbiotic eelayionship that both sides benefit from. I would be more worried as a Rochdale speccie if saints weren't taking it so seriously. In the end, it will only benefit saints if it improves Rochdale, it certainly is of no use to saints if Rochdale go down the tubes.

Re: Rochdale Hornets : Sat Oct 13, 2012 3:42 pm  

SaintsFan wrote:

So you are happy to use the Championships in the same way the NRL uses SL then? If so, that smacks of the same kind of arrogance.

Knock knock...

Re: Rochdale Hornets : Sun Oct 14, 2012 1:18 pm  

The Chair Maker wrote:

If Ian Talbot does well at Rochdale coaching the team there, then it also opens up a career pathway for him to bigger and better things.

Same goes for other young coaches.

At present its basically SL or bust for wannabee top line coaches. The likes of Shaun Wane have gone from being under 20 coaches to being in charge of some of SL's best players. That represents a massive step up, and im sure Wigan would have preferred Wane to have made an interim move to coaching say Leigh (while still employed by Wigan) so that he could find his feet there, before being thrown head first into SL.

This is how the aussies work with their system. They also use SL as a final finishing school.

Excellent point, I had only been thinking about the players.

SaintsFan wrote:

So you are happy to use the Championships in the same way the NRL uses SL then? If so, that smacks of the same kind of arrogance.

Superleague is a feeder league for NRL coaches. No amount of sticking our heads in the sand and being offended is going to change that.

If we don't like that trim the league down to 8 elite teams, split the sky money 8 ways and increase the cap to between £2 and £3 million. But that would upset some people so we cannot possible do that can we.

Re: Rochdale Hornets : Sun Oct 14, 2012 8:48 pm  

The Chair Maker wrote:

If Ian Talbot does well at Rochdale coaching the team there, then it also opens up a career pathway for him to bigger and better things.

Same goes for other young coaches.

At present its basically SL or bust for wannabee top line coaches. The likes of Shaun Wane have gone from being under 20 coaches to being in charge of some of SL's best players. That represents a massive step up, and im sure Wigan would have preferred Wane to have made an interim move to coaching say Leigh (while still employed by Wigan) so that he could find his feet there, before being thrown head first into SL.

This is how the aussies work with their system. They also use SL as a final finishing school.

That's not quite true though is it (or you are purposely missing parts out)
Wane went from U18 coach, winning their Grand Final, to U20's coach, winning their Grand Final(s), to assistant coach winning their Grand Final and Challenge Cup, before he got the head coaches job.

He's served his time and deserves his chance. It's up to him to take it.

Re: Rochdale Hornets : Tue Oct 16, 2012 9:39 am  

Here's a thought. I've just been reading a thread on the VT about the televising of championship games.
If we've got players at Whitehaven and Rochdale, then, if there were more of these games televised, then would you find extra veiwers in St Helens fans?
If this were the case for multiple championship clubs, would the competetion suddenly become a more attractive proposition for TV companies? Maybe a cheeky bid from someone like Channel 4 or 5 to televise a game a week? Even if it were telvised late at night, it wouldn't be a huge drawback considering how easily people can record and replay programs these days.

The development of the club's youngsters is one of the most interesting and rewarding parts of being a supporter, imo. If our kids were on telly, it would go straight on my Sky+ box.

Re: Rochdale Hornets : Wed Oct 17, 2012 8:03 pm  

Rogues Gallery wrote:

That's not quite true though is it (or you are purposely missing parts out)
Wane went from U18 coach, winning their Grand Final, to U20's coach, winning their Grand Final(s), to assistant coach winning their Grand Final and Challenge Cup, before he got the head coaches job.

He's served his time and deserves his chance. It's up to him to take it.

It wasnt meant to be a criticism of Wane, I just think that in a more ideal world Wigan would have liked to have seen Wane cut his teeth at a lesser club such as Leigh. He would then have been better prepared for making the step up to SL. I think its a valid argument to say that Wanes inexperience cost Wigan Grand Final and also challenge cup success.

We in Britain tend to throw managers (in both Sport and business) into a sink or swim environment. Is it any wonder that UK sport is full of oversees coaches and there are now few British run businesses left.

I would also point out that Michael Mcguire wasnt given a head coaches job in the NRL until he could prove he could do the head coaches role in SL. Similar things happen with many other NRL coaches. They go from assistant coach, to SL head coach then NRL head coach.

The fact Wane won academy grand finals doesnt necessarily make him a great coach. He may have merely been a solid coach blessed with a crop of juniors better than all the rest.
While trophies are all that some fans think coaching is about. Its also as much about developing individuals and a team into a better unit.
At the junior levels its nice to pick up the minor prizes, but ultimately its far more important that you improve upon what you are given.

Re: Rochdale Hornets : Thu Oct 18, 2012 3:34 pm  

According to Gareth Walker (RL Express journo) on Twitter, a few Saints lads have gone to Rochdale on a permanent basis. Gaz Frodsham biggest name amongst them.

Re: Rochdale Hornets : Thu Oct 18, 2012 3:39 pm  

Dux wrote:

According to Gareth Walker (RL Express journo) on Twitter, a few Saints lads have gone to Rochdale on a permanent basis. Gaz Frodsham biggest name amongst them.

Ex saints players Fordham wasnt at saints last season out of the lads that as gone they is only Alex trumpet that played for our 20s last season

Re: Rochdale Hornets : Fri Oct 19, 2012 6:58 pm  

Dux wrote:

According to Gareth Walker (RL Express journo) on Twitter, a few Saints lads have gone to Rochdale on a permanent basis. Gaz Frodsham biggest name amongst them.

You feel the club never wanted to give up on Frodsham. A player of definite quality but has just not been able to get on the field. Warren Thompson is another player said to be on his way to Rochdale. I do not really understand why the club did not give him a chance. Seemed a much better player than Paul Johnson, who has been a success since leaving Saints. In his only first team game against Fev in the cup looked dominant and scored a good try. Maybe Saints feel that these lads have the ability to blossom in the championship. They are at the very least good professionals that can make Rochdale a stronger club.