Re: Mose Masoe : Tue Jun 30, 2015 9:05 pm  

redex113 wrote:

I can honestly say that Mose has won us games, I can't recall any that he has lost for us. There are a couple on here who will be glad to see him go. They can join all the forwards in super league with the same line of thought.

Mose SHOULD HAVE won us the game against Castleford. That big drive he put in on fourth tackle with ninety seconds to go took us from our own half to within drop-goal range. Had we not made a total hash of the execution it would have been another game in Mose's pocket.

It remains to be seen whether Tasi or Haggerty can approach anything like that kind of influence.

Re: Mose Masoe : Tue Jun 30, 2015 9:25 pm  

Mugwump wrote:

both Walmsley and Amor have looked a little jaded recently.

Not surprised, they have to do more minutes to make up for Mose

Re: Mose Masoe : Tue Jun 30, 2015 9:29 pm  

Twentyman wrote:

Not surprised, they have to do more minutes to make up for Mose

They certainly have a lot more appearances to make up on Mose. Guess he's just that bit tougher.

Re: Mose Masoe : Tue Jun 30, 2015 10:17 pm  

Mugwump wrote:

They certainly have a lot more appearances to make up on Mose. Guess he's just that bit tougher.

He might have played more games than Walmsley and Amor but I bet you they've played far more minutes, made far more tackles and far more carries for the team than Mose.

Re: Mose Masoe : Wed Jul 01, 2015 6:52 am  

Twentyman wrote:

He might have played more games than Walmsley and Amor but I bet you they've played far more minutes, made far more tackles and far more carries for the team than Mose.

They're expected to though because that's the game they play compared to Mose who is brought in for impact.

Whilst he can be lazy and sometimes very frustrating, usually come the big games Masoe is on it and frightens the life out of sides with his impact.

Whilst Tasi may be more consistent than Masoe, I really don't think he'll have that same gamechanging ability that Masoe has.

Re: Mose Masoe : Wed Jul 01, 2015 8:47 am  

Twentyman wrote:

He might have played more games than Walmsley and Amor but I bet you they've played far more minutes, made far more tackles and far more carries for the team than Mose.

2014

Tackles:

Amor: Outside top 10
Walmsley: Outside top 10.
Masoe: 363

Metres:

Amor: Outside top 10
Walmsley: 2288
Masoe: 1971

Carries:

Amor: Outside top 10
Walmsley: 270
Masoe: 236

Admittedly, 2015's stats are better (so far). But given that Mose plays less minutes and that figure is COMPLETELY OUTSIDE OF HIS CONTROL this accusation of "laziness" has no basis in reality . Given the same amount of game time he would have been ahead in every department on the 2014 stats sheet.

Also, Mose really shouldn't have played for the first ten games. Had we not suffered injuries I'm sure we'd have pulled him because he clearly wasn't fit. Granted, part of it was his own fault. But in mitigation he had suffered a pretty bad injury. The point I'm making is that Mose played through his issues. And as anyone who has ever tried to lose weight will testify - he worked damned hard to get himself back in shape. You can't be "lazy" and lose two, perhaps three stones of weight. Impossible.

Re: Mose Masoe : Wed Jul 01, 2015 9:34 am  

Mugwump wrote:

2014

Tackles:

Amor: Outside top 10
Walmsley: Outside top 10.
Masoe: 363

Metres:

Amor: Outside top 10
Walmsley: 2288
Masoe: 1971

Carries:

Amor: Outside top 10
Walmsley: 270
Masoe: 236

Admittedly, 2015's stats are better (so far). But given that Mose plays less minutes and that figure is COMPLETELY OUTSIDE OF HIS CONTROL this accusation of "laziness" has no basis in reality . Given the same amount of game time he would have been ahead in every department on the 2014 stats sheet.

Also, Mose really shouldn't have played for the first ten games. Had we not suffered injuries I'm sure we'd have pulled him because he clearly wasn't fit. Granted, part of it was his own fault. But in mitigation he had suffered a pretty bad injury. The point I'm making is that Mose played through his issues. And as anyone who has ever tried to lose weight will testify - he worked damned hard to get himself back in shape. You can't be "lazy" and lose two, perhaps three stones of weight. Impossible.

It's his job to be in peak condition.

I know I'm outnumbered on my opinion of Mose. And I know that he's a potential game changer. I cheer him on like every other Saints fan when he takes the ball in and when he's crunched an opposition player. I honestly believe though that Mose would be playing more minutes if he actually volunteered a bit more whilst on the pitch. Taking more carries, getting us out of our 20 etc Exactly like he did at Widnes. He actually seemed to be on the pitch a bit longer although I don't have the stats.

He is lazy, mate. And frustrating. I think most will agree with me on that aspect. When he wants to chip in though, he can be a belting player. However I'd take Walmsley & Amor over him all day long.

Re: Mose Masoe : Wed Jul 01, 2015 10:48 am  

Twentyman wrote:

It's his job to be in peak condition.

So ... why aren't you banging on about Amor being "lazy"? If anyone is seriously down on last season's performances it's Kyle.

St. Pete says he's "100% fit".

If so he's not pulling his weight. What other explanation is there?

I honestly believe though that Mose would be playing more minutes if he actually volunteered a bit more whilst on the pitch. Taking more carries, getting us out of our 20 etc Exactly like he did at Widnes. He actually seemed to be on the pitch a bit longer although I don't have the stats.

This is ridiculous. Mose has no control over the number of minutes he plays. Players who don't put their hands up and "volunteer" don't string together fifty consecutive appearances. Period. The only person responsible for Mose's lack of game time is the coach.

If Mose were as lazy as people claim then his performances would be down in the matches where he plays for longer. But the opposite is true. Mose very often plays better when he's given more time on the pitch. We've had people in this forum CRYING OUT for him to get more game time since last season!

The other thing you seem to be forgetting is just how big Mose is. It's utter lunacy to think a guy weighing in at 20+ stones can go score-for-score on a bleep test with someone like Kyle Amor who I doubt is much over 15.5 stones. Human hearts don't differ a great deal in size and capacity. If Amor and Mose both perform the same action Mose's heart must work that bit harder. Multiply this out over a season and then calculate how much work each player is doing. Not some half-assed back-of-a-fag-packet stats estimate.

He is lazy, mate. And frustrating. I think most will agree with me on that aspect. When he wants to chip in though, he can be a belting player. However I'd take Walmsley & Amor over him all day long.

He's never been dropped once. You can't get around this fact. It's not as though Keiron is some kind of "nice guy" who prefers not to come down hard on players either. We all know those players who've crossed Keiron and paid the price. It's a pretty long list. A list which Mose has never been on.

Re: Mose Masoe : Wed Jul 01, 2015 1:39 pm  

St pete wrote:

That's BS!



When he's up for it, he's good, when he's not he's awful. 8 mins from a pro rugby player is utter shocking.

This is what I mean, you seem to be blinkered on this 8 mins thing. Mose can,t be placed into any "pigeon hole" category or statistic its more complex than that. It seems as though you have difficulty in understanding that, maybe most of us will just accept the imbalanced criticism or personal opinion.

Re: Mose Masoe : Wed Jul 01, 2015 2:09 pm  

Human hearts along with all our other organs grow in proportion to our body size. Obviously, if you were to pile a ridiculous amount of weight on in fat or muscle, then that would pile a lot of pressure on the heart. However, Mose is a big big lad, not because of incessant weight training or whatever, because of his genetics. So don't be worrying about Mose's heart if he has to do a bit of graft.

We're gonna have to agree to disagree mate. I respect your opinion. He's not my cup of tea but I'll cheer him on like any other fan but as soon as he puts a poor shift in, I'll slag him off. Likewise, if he plays well I'll praise him, which I have done on pg1 of this thread.