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Re: Turner : Sat Jun 20, 2015 4:03 am  
saint at wire wrote:
I'm not knocking Turner for the brilliant kick or indeed anything else but I thought the try was offside. Can't argue with the VR though can I?


At the absolute worst I thought McDonnell was level. A "benefit of the doubt" situation if ever I saw one.
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Re: Turner : Sat Jun 20, 2015 8:33 am  
Turner is a decent centre but his defence is a massive worry. It's weird as he can put in some really good hard shots but the min he has to make a decision or a player has foot work then Hes in a world of trouble. He misses about 4/5 tackles most weeks which isn't good enough on the edges.

It seems if he makes few breaks but misses 5 tackles that fans say he had a good game. People was ranting and raving about him at catalan because he was ripping holes in them but at the same time he was missing tackles and being caught out regular in the short time he played.
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[quote][b]XBrettKennyX wrote:[/b] Once more the anti SC brigade, purposely or otherwise fail to see the point.

Thick as pig swill.[/quote]

Re: Turner : Mon Jun 22, 2015 12:12 pm  
St pete wrote:
Turner is a decent centre but his defence is a massive worry. It's weird as he can put in some really good hard shots but the min he has to make a decision or a player has foot work then Hes in a world of trouble. He misses about 4/5 tackles most weeks which isn't good enough on the edges.

It seems if he makes few breaks but misses 5 tackles that fans say he had a good game. People was ranting and raving about him at catalan because he was ripping holes in them but at the same time he was missing tackles and being caught out regular in the short time he played.


It depends on the circumstances, and the short memories of fans, I suppose. If he misses 5 tackles, but is either saved by the winger, or his miss means the winger is out of position and looks to be to blame for the missed tackle then it's forgotten. IMO missed tackles are only remembered if they pretty much directly lead to an obvious try or big gain (ie the oppo centre strolls straight through the hole Tuner has created).
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Re: Turner : Mon Jun 22, 2015 12:57 pm  
Billinge_Lump wrote:
It depends on the circumstances, and the short memories of fans, I suppose. If he misses 5 tackles, but is either saved by the winger, or his miss means the winger is out of position and looks to be to blame for the missed tackle then it's forgotten. IMO missed tackles are only remembered if they pretty much directly lead to an obvious try or big gain (ie the oppo centre strolls straight through the hole Tuner has created).



Missed tackles are what puts teams under pressure and field position so it does effect even if not directly causes a try.
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[quote][b]XBrettKennyX wrote:[/b] Once more the anti SC brigade, purposely or otherwise fail to see the point.

Thick as pig swill.[/quote]

Re: Turner : Tue Jun 23, 2015 1:25 pm  
St pete wrote:
Missed tackles are what puts teams under pressure and field position so it does effect even if not directly causes a try.


I agree, I'm referring to your comment "It seems if he makes few breaks but misses 5 tackles that fans say he had a good game"

The fans will all see and remember the breaks, but I'm not sure all fans see (or remember) the 5 missed tackles.
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Re: Turner : Tue Jun 23, 2015 2:22 pm  
Turner's missed tackle stats are precisely that - stats. Whilst statistics offer some measure of qualitative assessment, separated from their CONTEXT, they form only part of a much bigger picture.

The bigger picture at Saints - as evidenced not just by Turner but Swift's actions also, is that both players are encouraged to blaze out of the line and smash the ball carrier in an attempt to compensate for Saints stacking the majority of its defenders in the middle of the field.

This puts tremendous pressure on both players to "get it right" else we concede an easy try. Very often they do get it right. But there are occasions when other teams move just that bit quicker, or utilise dummy runners to confuse the defenders.

There's nothing forcing Saints to employ this defensive strategy. They could just as easily switch to a more balanced pattern - which would certainly help both Turner and Swift's numbers.

Given that they don't I can only assume they are broadly happy with Turner's defence and accept those errors which are made as the inevitable price which must be paid for having a very strong defence overall (according to the figures - 2nd).
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Re: Turner : Tue Jun 23, 2015 2:48 pm  
Its very difficult to criticise him too much because he has had a pretty positive impact on all our games, much improved performances this season made lots of tackle busts and put in some big hits as well. As people have already said we are not sure if these misses led to try's scored in the set, I think Walsh made 6 tackles last week and missed 5 of those, but I don,t think anybody has brought this up at the moment.
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Re: Turner : Tue Jun 23, 2015 5:51 pm  
Judder Man wrote:
Its very difficult to criticise him too much because he has had a pretty positive impact on all our games, much improved performances this season made lots of tackle busts and put in some big hits as well. As people have already said we are not sure if these misses led to try's scored in the set, I think Walsh made 6 tackles last week and missed 5 of those, but I don,t think anybody has brought this up at the moment.


I didn't see the Cas game and not seen any stats but I don't think Luke should be immune if those stats are correct. That's pathetic if true.
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Re: Turner : Tue Jun 23, 2015 7:14 pm  
If you are going to bag Turner for missed tackles you should include half the team as well.
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Re: Turner : Tue Jun 23, 2015 7:18 pm  
redex113 wrote:
If you are going to bag Turner for missed tackles you should include half the team as well.


Bag the team in the "Turner" thread ?
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