Re: Tommy Makinson : Sun Mar 16, 2014 1:09 pm  

The Chair Maker wrote:

Tommy Mak is a good young winger.

However he was and is, not a superstar winger more like a decent reliable wing who will put in a fair shift.

He is better than Gardner was at 22 years of age.

He is inferior to Charnley and Burgess at Wigan, and Hall and Briscoe at Leeds.
Players such as Lineman at Hull and Justin Carney of Castleford are also arguably better.
Monaghan at the Wolves is superior.
I also don't think he is the best winger at Saints, as I regard Swift as better than him.

I would agree with this, Gardner has had some decent centres in his career, Makinson hasn't had that during his development.
Hall, Briscoe, Charnley, Burgess, Carney, Monaghan, Lineham, Swift, Makinson Broughton for me.

Re: Tommy Makinson : Sun Mar 16, 2014 1:15 pm  

SaintsFan wrote:

Based on this season's form, no way is Makinson inferior to Charnley!

form is temporary class is permanent.

Fact is Charnley is one of our top 3 wingers, as proven by his try scoring record and also his international caps.
He is also only 4 or 5 months older than Tommy.

re Swift v Makinson

Swift is younger, has a better try scoring rate, makes more metres, more tackle busts, more clean breaks, makes fewer errors and makes more metres per carry.

Re: Tommy Makinson : Sun Mar 16, 2014 1:24 pm  

The Chair Maker wrote:

re Swift v Makinson

Swift is younger, has a better try scoring rate, makes more metres, more tackle busts, more clean breaks, makes fewer errors and makes more metres per carry.

First time I can remember Saints having a pair of pacey wingers in a long long time.
Its great. Don't really see the need for a measuring competition.

When we had sully this was blunted by having Ste Hall on the other wing.
When we had Albert there was Ade.

I like and rate both.

Re: Tommy Makinson : Sun Mar 16, 2014 1:26 pm  

SaintsFan wrote:

Everybody was average at best last year and since making his debut until this season he has only got into the 17 when Gardner has been injured, which he has been quite often, fortunately. I know it's hard for you to admit it Pete, but I was spot on about him and he's now got to the stage where nobody can deny he's a good winger. Gwon, you can admit it. I was right about him and you were wrong!

After 5 games I'm not making any silly comment he's the real deal. I like tommy, I've always liked tommy but in the past his form has been hit and miss. Don't get me wrong he always gives 100%, his defence is good but in the past he struggled to beat a man.

If he can keep this up all year then I'll gladly say he's the real deal but top players do it more or less every week.

Re: Tommy Makinson : Sun Mar 16, 2014 1:41 pm  

Makinson has started the season well, so has Swift.

But I can't see either playing on the wing for England because of the size difference compared to Aus/NZL.

2 very good SL wingers in the making, though

Re: Tommy Makinson : Sun Mar 16, 2014 8:47 pm  

The Chair Maker wrote:

form is temporary class is permanent.

Fact is Charnley is one of our top 3 wingers, as proven by his try scoring record and also his international caps.
He is also only 4 or 5 months older than Tommy.

How long has Charnley been Wigan's first choice winger? And when was Tommy allowed to become Saints' first choice winger? There you have the reason for Charnley's superior try scoring record AND his international caps. Charnley's defence is dodgy and always has been.

Re: Tommy Makinson : Sun Mar 16, 2014 8:51 pm  

SaintsFan wrote:

How long has Charnley been Wigan's first choice winger? And when was Tommy allowed to become Saints' first choice winger? There you have the reason for Charnley's superior try scoring record AND his international caps. Charnley's defence is dodgy and always has been.

I like Tommy but you'd have to be crazy to take him over Charnley. I'd take Charnley over Tommy every day of the week and twice on Sunday because he's a top quality player.

Hall, Briscoe and Charnley are head and shoulders above the rest but Tommy is the next tier to them.

Re: Tommy Makinson : Sun Mar 16, 2014 9:22 pm  

SaintsFan wrote:

How long has Charnley been Wigan's first choice winger? And when was Tommy allowed to become Saints' first choice winger? There you have the reason for Charnley's superior try scoring record AND his international caps. Charnley's defence is dodgy and always has been.

I've missed your arguments!

Re: Tommy Makinson : Sun Mar 16, 2014 9:27 pm  

For me, makinson has scored some tries that charnley wouldn't. More precisely he's scored some tries that he had no right to score (the one against hull Kr in the playoffs for example) - that doesn't make him better than charnley, but equally it means he's not far away.

I don't think he's seen his physical size be an issue so far this year. Even when he runs infield he still seems strong in the tackle. He works well with turner and offers more threat on the wing then we've seen in a long time. He's not been outplayed yet by his opposite winger, and that's all you can ask.

There are very few wingers I'd swap makinson for

Re: Tommy Makinson : Sun Mar 16, 2014 9:28 pm  

SaintsFan wrote:

How long has Charnley been Wigan's first choice winger? And when was Tommy allowed to become Saints' first choice winger? There you have the reason for Charnley's superior try scoring record AND his international caps. Charnley's defence is dodgy and always has been.

Charnley became Wigans first choice winger in 2011. He has only played 20 more games than Makinson but has scored 64 more tries.