Re: Saints v Leeds - Verdict : Sat Mar 02, 2013 12:08 am  

SaintsFan wrote:

We do have someone like that. He's called Makinson and he was cooling his heels somewhere unknown instead of playing outside Percival instead of that wastrel Meli. Makinson can fly AND finish. What a great pairing those two would make. I'm sure Makinson could learn how to play on the left edge ...

Maybe Makinson would of scored a couple,but then again so did Meli and chances are he wouldnt of scored the ones Meli did.What can i say,he scores he takes crap,the team as a whole dont play well he takes crap,im waiting with baited breath for next years scapegoat if he leaves.

Re: Saints v Leeds - Verdict : Sat Mar 02, 2013 12:15 am  

brook40 wrote:

Maybe Makinson would of scored a couple,but then again so did Meli and chances are he wouldnt of scored the ones Meli did.

Of course he would have scored the tries Meli scored! Neither required strength, which is what Meli uses. It' possible other things would have happened also because not only does Makinson have pace and finishing ability, he also defends very well, is brave under the bomb and works hard.

Re: Saints v Leeds - Verdict : Sat Mar 02, 2013 12:18 am  

Valid point re: wing partnerships I think here.

Re: Saints v Leeds - Verdict : Sat Mar 02, 2013 12:36 am  

SaintsFan wrote:

Of course he would have scored the tries Meli scored! Neither required strength, which is what Meli uses. It' possible other things would have happened also because not only does Makinson have pace and finishing ability, he also defends very well, is brave under the bomb and works hard.

No, I'm no Meli fan, and I think you can certainly make the case that Makinson may have performed better overall tonight, but I doubt he would have scored Meli's second try. That was a seriously classy bit of work from Meli, involving great footwork, balance and strength. It's important to give credit where credit's due, even if I thought for the rest of the game he was almost disgracefully lazy, and was shown up by Gardner.

I think the problem with Meli isn't that he's not fast enough. I think it was more that he clearly was not expecting Percival to be making those sort of breaks, and so missed the first couple. But when he realised he might at last have a centre inside him who could get through the line, he was certainly up with him for the last two breaks.

At present, while I agree that Makinson offers more speed than Meli, I would rather Meli got the ball from 20 metres out than Makinson - he's a much better finisher. Defensively, they're both as liable to let someone in, although for different reasons. Makinson isn't as lazy as Meli in returning the ball and helping the forwards, but as he's too small to make any yards doing so, the net effect is zero. So ultimately, Meli keeps it on finishing power alone. Now if you could put Makinson's greater speed and workrate together with Meli's finishing power, you'd have a decent winger.

Re: Saints v Leeds - Verdict : Sat Mar 02, 2013 1:26 am  

Gardner and Meli would be my first choice wing partnership every day of the week, but that's just my opinion.

To say Meli just barges is way off the mark. Yes, he can barge over and score tries (his job) but he does have a lot more to his game. I thought he had a great game against Bradford last week, made some great runs up the middle with ball in hand, and took an awful lot of pressure off the forwards. Meli struggles under the high ball, and can infuriate with his laid back style on the field, but that is his character, the way he is, and any Saints player will tell you that.

His try scoring record compares very well to the rest of Super League, and although he wasn't great tonight, we look much more threatening with Francis Meli on the wing than we do with Tommy Makinson.

Re: Saints v Leeds - Verdict : Sat Mar 02, 2013 1:48 am  

Tez the Saint wrote:

I thought he had a great game against Bradford last week,

As indeed did everyone from all reports. But maybe that is because - in part at least - Bradford were crap? Leeds were not crap. They actually challenged Meli to work and, as is always the case when he is confronted by Leeds (or indeed a challenge to work) Meli is found wanting. He was found wanting in all but one respect tonight: the second try he scored was a very good one (although I believe Makinson is easily as capable of scoring a try like that because he most definitely has a great sense of balance - his finishing near the touchline has shown just how good his balance is).

we look much more threatening with Francis Meli on the wing than we do with Tommy Makinson.

We would look a lot more threatening with Makinson if (a) he got the ball and (b) space was provided for him. Imagine if Shenny had been a centre to make breaks like Percival did tonight. With Makinson's pace and finishing ability we would be cleaning up all over the place.

Re: Saints v Leeds - Verdict : Sat Mar 02, 2013 8:42 am  

A good game for the neutral, Leeds seem to be giving it a good go at the minute, but when they are happy with their table position later in the season will it all change. Saint don’t seem to be up to speed yet, and are sometimes slow in their defence. They are not yet the same old Saints in finishing especially in the last twenty. The two pointers may be hard to get this season.

Re: Saints v Leeds - Verdict : Sat Mar 02, 2013 8:58 am  

What has happened to Manu? I said last year that I thought signing Manu was a good bit of business for Saints and Turner was a good bit of business for us.

When and if he gets his game right, Manu will be one of your most devastating attackers, he often caries 3 defenders with him over the line. At the moment though, no enthusiasm in his game.

Re: Saints v Leeds - Verdict : Sat Mar 02, 2013 11:02 am  

Lots of good and valid points in this thread. Without the ball I still think we look flat when coming out of the defensive line i.e. standing off the tackles. If that doesn't improve we're always going to be in a fight with a good team. Gaz highlighted that getting out of our half is a problem but that isn't helped by our defence rarely putting the opposing teams under pressure.

Wilkin at half back is still a no and I'm tired of saying this on a weekly basis but will continue to mention it for as long as coaches keep picking there because it's a consistently awful decision. It's also a decision that every coach has made when they've been here so perhaps he is throwing out 30m spirals in training and we just haven't seen that...

On the positives. We look significantly more dangerous with the ball with Lomax at full back. Numerous times last night his speed helped create the space for Percival (who didn't have to break a tackle for any of his breaks and when was the last time a full back created that much space for us?). Unfortunately for Meli it also exposed his lack of pace, as it would have done for Gardner as well, had he been on that wing. If we're going to be creating that much space in the future then we need to have somebody who can capitalise on that.

Re: Saints v Leeds - Verdict : Sat Mar 02, 2013 11:11 am  

Nothing new really, agree completely with the post above. Lomax has to play 1. We are good organising 7 and a real prop or two away from a top team. Great game from Percival.

On a side note, the ruck speed was far too slow last night. Nobody likes a penalty-fest but he referee needed to put his foot down last night.

G