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Re: Salary cap amendment : Sat Nov 12, 2011 5:44 pm  
[quote="Saddened!"]But they aren't Pete. Do you really think these allowances will actually be spent on English players? This whole situation came about because Wigan needed a centre and couldn't get one because they didn't have enough on the cap to get a quality player. So they moaned about the cap and got these dispensations passed with no thought put into the decision. The day after Leneghan boasts about now being in a position to sign a £100k+ a year NRL centre.


If your paranoid the RFL have bent over backwards for Wigan to keep Sam tomkins in rugby league then your going to go in to overdrive in the coming weeks/months.

Beleive me, Wigan ain't gone in to this joint venture with Saracens for "coaching ideas"
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Re: Salary cap amendment : Sat Nov 12, 2011 7:11 pm  
St pete wrote:
If your paranoid the RFL have bent over backwards for Wigan to keep Sam tomkins in rugby league then your going to go in to overdrive in the coming weeks/months.

Beleive me, Wigan ain't gone in to this joint venture with Saracens for "coaching ideas"

:?:

What have you heard?
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Re: Salary cap amendment : Sat Nov 12, 2011 8:01 pm  
Whatever justifications are given, whatever excuses are made, whatever benefits to the game are alleged, this is a move by the RL 100% purely and simply to cave in to Wigan's demands to be allowed to bring in an antipodean centre next season instead of being forced to promote some of their homegrown talent there instead, completely in opposition to the supposed reason for it happening. It will ultimately benefit only the 3 or 4 richest and most successful clubs in the game (who, by very definition, are the richest and most successful clubs and so need no extra benefit at all), making an utter mockery of the whole concept of having a salary cap in the first place. It will force every other club who cannot afford the salary cap as it stands already to face either bankruptcy, or eternal mediocrity and uncompetitiveness (which will ultimately lead to the same thing with ever more disinterested supporters staying at home with their cash to watch Scum Utd. on telly instead). It cannot and will not prevent the talent drain from a league that simply does not have the financial resources to be able to remotely compete with the other markets for that talent.

These are all facts. Story, end of.

Other clubs may eventually benefit too, British RL may even benefit very slightly in the very short term as well (although it's hard to argue that point given that it is basically just a blank cheque for clubs to be able to go and sign a slightly better class of antipodean in future, ignoring home grown talent a la Wigan's current centre situation instead), but the only reason this has happened is to give in to pressure to be allowed to cheat their way back to competitiveness from the biggest and noisiest club in the game. It sickens me frankly and makes me angrier and angrier the more I think about it.
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Re: Salary cap amendment : Sat Nov 12, 2011 9:53 pm  
The salary cap rules are a matter for the clubs not the RFL so presumably a majority voted at their meeting to push this through. Deciding it is an RFL conspiracy is wacko.
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Re: Salary cap amendment : Sun Nov 13, 2011 12:33 pm  
I get the angst about this deal because its Wigan, but thank god the RFL have finally allowed clubs to make a stand financially. Tomkins - like it or not - is potentially a household name, and its hugely important that RL keeps him for as long as possible. I have no problem at all with a line being drawn in the sand with respect to RU poaching. Players going to the NRL is different - they are still eligible for England. Gareth Ellis leaving Leeds for wests is a billion miles from him joining an RU side.
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Re: Salary cap amendment : Sun Nov 13, 2011 6:36 pm  
BrisbaneRhino wrote:
I get the angst about this deal because its Wigan, but thank god the RFL have finally allowed clubs to make a stand financially. Tomkins - like it or not - is potentially a household name, and its hugely important that RL keeps him for as long as possible. I have no problem at all with a line being drawn in the sand with respect to RU poaching. Players going to the NRL is different - they are still eligible for England. Gareth Ellis leaving Leeds for wests is a billion miles from him joining an RU side.


I wonder how the other Wigan lads feel about tomkins being paid so much?

I've got a little feeling it's not gone down well :wink:
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Re: Salary cap amendment : Sun Nov 13, 2011 9:14 pm  
I made a point that I wouldlike a scheme similar to this but the RFL pay the wages over and above the cap, someone then pointed out that it would be difficult because you would not know which players were in or out each year.

Wigan have paid the max already, to keep tomkins, but lets say next year tomkins is the only Wigan player in the ETS/knights, how will wigan be able to stick to the wages if there is not enough players to cover the nessasary allowances. Or will it be a case of current contracts will be honored. Ie once your team reaches the maximum players needed to earn the extra 100k, if you don't have the players in the squad the following year you will not have to offer reduced contracts.
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Re: Salary cap amendment : Sun Nov 13, 2011 10:05 pm  
St pete wrote:
I also think it would free up cap space to bring quality nrl players to super league instead of over hill Aussies looking for a pay day.

I'd also go down the Aussie route abd say we will only pick players from super league for England.


That's the problem though isn't it, we'll never attract the top quality Australian NRL players whilst they still have an opportunity to play 'rep footy' because the aussies won't pick them, that leaves the players that are no longer playing for their country because they are too old or have 'issues'. Then we have the non Australian NRL players from the likes of New Zealand, PNG etc, then it comes down to how we can compete against the NRL clubs not just in terms of money but the level of competition and the lifestyle they can offer.

Looking at that New Zealand side that played against England and how many of them are better than the current non-aussie imports we already have?

If we want to attract the best Australian players to our league we need two or three key things to happen, 1) The ARL needs to relax their restrictions on non picking non NRL based players for the Australian National Side, 2) We need to be able to compete on a level financial playing field as the NRL, and to some extent 3) We need to prove we can offer a competitive club competition on a similar level to that of the NRL.

The problem is non of those things are going to happen anytime soon, and so we come back to needing to focus on keeping our best players in our competition OR producing a larger volume of better young players which is the real trick.

I'm all for trying to keep the likes of Sam T and our own fantastic young & older players in the game but we need to be very very careful that any amendments & new rules put into place are strictly for that purpose and are not full of loopholes to be exploited as has been suggested here.
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Re: Salary cap amendment : Sun Nov 13, 2011 11:52 pm  
BrisbaneRhino wrote:
I get the angst about this deal because its Wigan, but thank god the RFL have finally allowed clubs to make a stand financially. Tomkins - like it or not - is potentially a household name, and its hugely important that RL keeps him for as long as possible. I have no problem at all with a line being drawn in the sand with respect to RU poaching. Players going to the NRL is different - they are still eligible for England. Gareth Ellis leaving Leeds for wests is a billion miles from him joining an RU side.


Not really; the effect is very similar, the only difference is in respect of the international game
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Re: Salary cap amendment : Sun Nov 13, 2011 11:56 pm  
Tony Stark wrote:
That's the problem though isn't it, we'll never attract the top quality Australian NRL players whilst they still have an opportunity to play 'rep footy' because the aussies won't pick them, that leaves the players that are no longer playing for their country because they are too old or have 'issues'. Then we have the non Australian NRL players from the likes of New Zealand, PNG etc, then it comes down to how we can compete against the NRL clubs not just in terms of money but the level of competition and the lifestyle they can offer.

Looking at that New Zealand side that played against England and how many of them are better than the current non-aussie imports we already have?

If we want to attract the best Australian players to our league we need two or three key things to happen, 1) The ARL needs to relax their restrictions on non picking non NRL based players for the Australian National Side, 2) We need to be able to compete on a level financial playing field as the NRL, and to some extent 3) We need to prove we can offer a competitive club competition on a similar level to that of the NRL.


tony, you say "If we want to attract the best Australian players to our league....".

Thats a very big "if" for me. I'd prefer us to concentrate developing our own players as a priority.
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