Re: Welcome to St Helens Travis Burns : Fri Sep 26, 2014 11:40 am  

St pete wrote:

No way can Turner play loose. He's not playing loose now, he's actually playing 6. We don't need him anywhere the middle of the field next year with burns and Walsh there and also Wilkin.

Stick Turner back in centre and let him, jones and Percy fight it out.

What does Wilkin bring to the pack that turner doesn't?

Re: Welcome to St Helens Travis Burns : Fri Sep 26, 2014 11:48 am  

He can point very well.

Re: Welcome to St Helens Travis Burns : Fri Sep 26, 2014 11:53 am  

Carlos Alberto wrote:

He can point very well.

Also he can sneer at the Ref , deputise for LMS as the team penalty machine, laugh at his own knock ons
and overuse the term "Elite Sports" in any and all TV interviews of which there are too many.

Re: Welcome to St Helens Travis Burns : Fri Sep 26, 2014 2:31 pm  

Magic Superbeetle wrote:

What does Wilkin bring to the pack that turner doesn't?

I'd say he has a higher workrate and effectiveness in defence

Offers less carrying the ball, similar passing/kicking game

Re: Welcome to St Helens Travis Burns : Fri Sep 26, 2014 3:47 pm  

Magic Superbeetle wrote:

What does Wilkin bring to the pack that turner doesn't?

Experience. Mountains of defence. Organisation. Passion. Aggression.


Turner brings a better kicking game and ....er.....and......let me think.....oh, nothing else.

Re: Welcome to St Helens Travis Burns : Fri Sep 26, 2014 4:07 pm  

St pete wrote:

Experience. Mountains of defence. Organisation. Passion. Aggression.


Turner brings a better kicking game and ....er.....and......let me think.....oh, nothing else.

Experience? Laffranchi has that, but doesn't seem to count for much.

Defensive work? Yeah, Wilkin comfortably takes the crown. But then Flanaghan trumps him.

Orgaqnisation? I'd say Turner is doing a pretty decent job at the moment on his own. Wilkin has been doing the makeshift leader thing for longer so probably edges it, but I wouldn't say there's much between them on that front. Either way, they'll be 4th runners for this, behind Burns Walsh and Roby so hardly a big contributing factor.

Passion and aggression? ... It's a long time since I heard those words to describe Wilkin. And Turner, to be fair. Not sure one has significantly more than the other, neither are going to rip up trees on the matter.

As for what Turner brings over Wilkin: speed, backing up, ability to offload and eye for the gap. If Lomax isn't going to be the support runner that Wellens was, mold Turner into it instead. Wilkin couldn't of scored the try that Turner did vs Castleford for example. Imo of course.

I fully expect Wilkin to be our lock next year, rightly or wrongly. But Turner hasn't been as bad as you claim. In fact he's been quite good.

Re: Welcome to St Helens Travis Burns : Fri Sep 26, 2014 4:13 pm  

Magic Superbeetle wrote:

Experience? Laffranchi has that, but doesn't seem to count for much.

Defensive work? Yeah, Wilkin comfortably takes the crown. But then Flanaghan trumps him.

Orgaqnisation? I'd say Turner is doing a pretty decent job at the moment on his own. Wilkin has been doing the makeshift leader thing for longer so probably edges it, but I wouldn't say there's much between them on that front. Either way, they'll be 4th runners for this, behind Burns Walsh and Roby so hardly a big contributing factor.

Passion and aggression? ... It's a long time since I heard those words to describe Wilkin. And Turner, to be fair. Not sure one has significantly more than the other, neither are going to rip up trees on the matter.

As for what Turner brings over Wilkin: speed, backing up, ability to offload and eye for the gap. If Lomax isn't going to be the support runner that Wellens was, mold Turner into it instead. Wilkin couldn't of scored the try that Turner did vs Castleford for example. Imo of course.

I fully expect Wilkin to be our lock next year, rightly or wrongly. But Turner hasn't been as bad as you claim. In fact he's been quite good.

Where was he when the going got tough against wolves?

He was good when we put a cricket score on cas but that's it.


Why move a average centre that struggles to defend into the pack to play 13 ?

Re: Welcome to St Helens Travis Burns : Fri Sep 26, 2014 4:21 pm  

St pete wrote:

Where was he when the going got tough against wolves?

He was good when we put a cricket score on cas but that's it.


Why move a average centre that struggles to defend into the pack to play 13 ?

Same argument for Wilkin at hull Kr? Both have looked poor when we get caned.

Because I still think he's better than the incumbant?

Re: Welcome to St Helens Travis Burns : Fri Sep 26, 2014 5:17 pm  

Magic Superbeetle wrote:

Same argument for Wilkin at hull Kr? Both have looked poor when we get caned.

Because I still think he's better than the incumbant?

Wilkin is a forward and Turner isn't. I'd play any if the kids in the pack before turner. He's basically playing 6 now so surely having burns, Walsh and turner wouldn't work and would leave us a forward down

Re: Welcome to St Helens Travis Burns : Fri Sep 26, 2014 5:43 pm  

So its Turner back to centre with Jones challenging for that position as well. My preference is to stay with Turner at centre he's learned a few more adaptive skills and his defence has improved. Jones although good in defence is very limited in attack and suffers from inconsistent decision making.

Turner has had a lot to deal with this season with a battle for individual form and having to play other positional roles, I dont think you can "cherry pick" his performance against Warrington or Catalans or Hull KR as every single player in the team put in shocking performances in these games.