Re: Quarter Final Aftermath : Mon May 14, 2012 1:03 pm  

FearTheVee wrote:

True - swap Lance for Finch and I reckon Saints may well have won that game.

Hopefully the bluntness of the performance will force a bit of a reshuffle from Rush/KC as I don't think Lance/Lomax will get us over the line in big games. We need to find the right halves combination and my personal opinion is that the only "right" halves combination at Saints will have Gaskell in it. For me, he is the only natural half back in the squad.

The big decisions are who plays alongside him and at full back.

If we are going to go back to using Gaskell in the halves then we will need to retain Wello at fullback because he was assisting Lomaskell last season. He will still be needed in the same role this season.

Given that we have now been dumped out of the Cup, I think we should just revert to the arrangement that worked well last year: Lomax and Gaskell in the halves, with Wello as fullback and hoping that Laffranchi takes up the mantle in the forwards (in terms of leadership I mean) since he has the most experience there and doesn't appear to be as injury prone as TP.

We should then stick with that. It will require proper coaching from our current regime as both Lomax and Gaskell still need that kind of input.

I would also ensure that Makinson is in the starting 17 every week as he needs regular game time to continue his own development and he is definitely a young player worth developing.

However, I don't expect anything to change.

Re: Quarter Final Aftermath : Mon May 14, 2012 1:15 pm  

FearTheVee wrote:

True - swap Lance for Finch and I reckon Saints may well have won that game.

Hopefully the bluntness of the performance will force a bit of a reshuffle from Rush/KC as I don't think Lance/Lomax will get us over the line in big games. We need to find the right halves combination and my personal opinion is that the only "right" halves combination at Saints will have Gaskell in it. For me, he is the only natural half back in the squad.

The big decisions are who plays alongside him and at full back.

Doesn't matter what we do with the ball if our defence is going to be without the bite that a champion side needs. Come on Nathan. Win that Challenge Cup then pop over here for the play off run.

Re: Quarter Final Aftermath : Mon May 14, 2012 2:26 pm  

I remember going to a wigan saints match about 5 or 6 years ago at the JJB as it was then. Saints were the best team in the league at the time. I remember, before kick off watching the two teams warming up and my uncle turned to me and said "We're going get battered today." Deep down I knew he was right. You were miles ahead of us at the time, and just competing with you was hard enough with the likes of Sculthorpe, Long, Cunningham, that aussie centre (can't think of his name), etc, etc.

Yes, we may have got close and even won the odd game, but you were far better than us. We are in front of you ATM, admittedly not by that much, but any saints fans trying to pretend otherwise is seriously in denial. (Northampton saint - seriously you would have more saints players in a combined side than Wigan at this moment in time.)

We were very poor on sat as were you, but I think we won at a canter really. I didn't go as I was on hol and only watched it on TV last night (without knowing the score) and at no time was I remotely worried which felt really strange. This is a Wigan fans point of view and you may not like it, but that is how I view it.

Thoughts?

Think you need to listen to Saddened a bit more cos his pessimistic view isn't that far off.

Re: Quarter Final Aftermath : Mon May 14, 2012 4:34 pm  

pondmonster wrote:

I remember going to a wigan saints match about 5 or 6 years ago at the JJB as it was then. Saints were the best team in the league at the time. I remember, before kick off watching the two teams warming up and my uncle turned to me and said "We're going get battered today." Deep down I knew he was right. You were miles ahead of us at the time, and just competing with you was hard enough with the likes of Sculthorpe, Long, Cunningham, that aussie centre (can't think of his name), etc, etc.

Yes, we may have got close and even won the odd game, but you were far better than us. We are in front of you ATM, admittedly not by that much, but any saints fans trying to pretend otherwise is seriously in denial. (Northampton saint - seriously you would have more saints players in a combined side than Wigan at this moment in time.)

We were very poor on sat as were you, but I think we won at a canter really. I didn't go as I was on hol and only watched it on TV last night (without knowing the score) and at no time was I remotely worried which felt really strange. This is a Wigan fans point of view and you may not like it, but that is how I view it.

Thoughts?

Think you need to listen to Saddened a bit more cos his pessimistic view isn't that far off.

So basically what you and the other pieaters appear to be saying is that you're currently better than us with better players and didn't play well at all on Saturday yet you were only fourteen points better, playing at home, than a team that you've all just said are rubbish and played very poorly? If we're only fourteen points behind you after that then it won't be too hard to make up the difference.

Re: Quarter Final Aftermath : Mon May 14, 2012 5:16 pm  

McClennan wrote:

If we're only fourteen points behind you after that then it won't be too hard to make up the difference.

If we repeat our performance from Saturday in two weeks' time we could put up the tents on Wigan's line and we still wouldn't make up those 14 points.

Re: Quarter Final Aftermath : Mon May 14, 2012 6:24 pm  

McClennan wrote:

So basically what you and the other pieaters appear to be saying is that you're currently better than us with better players and didn't play well at all on Saturday yet you were only fourteen points better, playing at home, than a team that you've all just said are rubbish and played very poorly? If we're only fourteen points behind you after that then it won't be too hard to make up the difference.

StHelens have over the course of SL had a far superior side to Wigan. The trophy count for each club during this SL era would indicate that. Yet Wigan have a better derby record between the sides during the SL era.

Derby games between the two sides therefore can't be used as indicator for a club's success, IMO. No matter how large or small the winning margin between the sides may be.

Perhaps to get a better indication of the difference in quality between the two sides would be to look at the SL table, or equally to look at which of the two clubs is through to the semi-finals of the CC.

Re: Quarter Final Aftermath : Mon May 14, 2012 6:28 pm  

LovesToSpooge wrote:

Perhaps to get a better indication of the difference in quality between the two sides would be to look at the SL table, or equally to look at which of the two clubs is through to the semi-finals of the CC.

I remember precisely the same things being said at around the same time last season and yet we knocked you out of the play offs - twice. And as everyone knows, the Grand Final is much more important than the Challenge Cup, yes? (At least that is what Wigan, Warrington and Leeds fans kept saying to us when we won it three times on the spin)

Re: Quarter Final Aftermath : Mon May 14, 2012 6:33 pm  

LovesToSpooge wrote:

StHelens have over the course of SL had a far superior side to Wigan. The trophy count for each club during this SL era would indicate that. Yet Wigan have a better derby record between the sides during the SL era.

Derby games between the two sides therefore can't be used as indicator for a club's success, IMO. No matter how large or small the winning margin between the sides may be.

Perhaps to get a better indication of the difference in quality between the two sides would be to look at the SL table, or equally to look at which of the two clubs is through to the semi-finals of the CC.

You miss it once in 12 years and that's an indication of a side in decline. Wigan are a better coached and better drilled side. Nothing more, Nothing less. If the coaching situation had been in reverse for the last 3 years, your beloved team would be in as much trouble as we are now.
Also, in order to finance are own new stadium, recruitment has had to be curtailed (unfortunately) but both those situations will begin to be rectified come next season.

BE AFRAID!!!!! BE VERY AFRAID!!!!!

Re: Quarter Final Aftermath : Mon May 14, 2012 6:38 pm  

McClennan wrote:

So basically what you and the other pieaters appear to be saying is that you're currently better than us with better players and didn't play well at all on Saturday yet you were only fourteen points better, playing at home, than a team that you've all just said are rubbish and played very poorly? If we're only fourteen points behind you after that then it won't be too hard to make up the difference.

Sadly, at the minute, I agree with the crust muncher. We may have only lost by 14 points, but lets face, it were rubbish. Yes, the Goons were crap too, but that shouldn't be allowed to paper over the cracks, and admit that right now, we are poor. Only was we admit that, can we begin the process of regaining our former position. If we keep deluding ourselves that we are "nearly there", then we will return to the nearly men days before Super League.

Re: Quarter Final Aftermath : Mon May 14, 2012 6:44 pm  

SomersetSaint wrote:

If we keep deluding ourselves that we are "nearly there", then we will return to the nearly men days before Super League.

Totally agree. You don't get anywhere by behaving like an ostrich.