Re: Trio extend contracts : Tue Jun 03, 2014 11:25 am  

Personally speaking I would either buy one in, or go down the Wigan route of collective leadership.

I get both sides of the arguement on Wellens. I think if he was a second rower a pack player it would not be an issue. The slight drop off in performance is covered by those around. With him playing at fullback it leaves him more exposed as it's not just about leadership as he is having to learn a new role and to be good enough in that role.

If LMS was the captain say, with Wellens attributes, then people would not be calling for him to be replaced as he could lose some pace and threat yet still contribute with the leadership of the team.

If we said LMS had to play at FB as there were better props, then it would be equally questioned that we are moving players suited out of position or out of the team for the leadership qualities.

There is no perfect balance with this one, in a way it needs others to take that leadership role on as if they are happy to coast and not be leaders then it leaves us in the catch 22.

I thought Wello this year was a good idea as he gives us cover at FB, but the fact he has to play most games whether covering for FB or not, shows a lacking of others not Wello to me.

Re: Trio extend contracts : Tue Jun 03, 2014 12:26 pm  

Take it this way, going into a season without a proper leader or influential captain can cost you 2 or 3 losses in a season which might make the difference between a top 4 or a top 8 side.
Briers last year and SOL this year immediately spring to mind amongst others to a lesser effect like Brough.
In other words don't bag your leader/captain until you've got a SATISFACTORY replacement.

Re: Trio extend contracts : Tue Jun 03, 2014 12:42 pm  

Judder Man wrote:

Take it this way, going into a season without a proper leader or influential captain can cost you 2 or 3 losses in a season which might make the difference between a top 4 or a top 8 side.
Briers last year and SOL this year immediately spring to mind amongst others to a lesser effect like Brough.
In other words don't bag your leader/captain until you've got a SATISFACTORY replacement.

So Wellens plays until McManus leaves then? We don't pull off many big signings these days, so the chances of us having the ambition to sign a leader is very remote.

I think you are massively overstating Wello's influence as well. He makes no difference at all in the bigger games and we roll over anyway, so not sure what we'd be losing if he wasn't there? Surely he could motivate the players just as well as a coach?

Re: Trio extend contracts : Tue Jun 03, 2014 3:39 pm  

Saddened! wrote:

So Wellens plays until McManus leaves then? We don't pull off many big signings these days, so the chances of us having the ambition to sign a leader is very remote.

I think you are massively overstating Wello's influence as well. He makes no difference at all in the bigger games and we roll over anyway, so not sure what we'd be losing if he wasn't there? Surely he could motivate the players just as well as a coach?

You are such a PRAT!!!!

Re: Trio extend contracts : Tue Jun 03, 2014 4:13 pm  

Saddened! wrote:

Wellens isn't and never was anywhere near as good as those two as players though. If Wello was 19 and performed as he does now, he wouldn't get a game and he'd be released. Wello is a savvy player and would do the odd good thing like the run off Walsh's shoulder until the cows come home, but look at his game in general, offers absolutely nothing in the pack in attack or defense. Defensively at fullback he's not good enough, twice Salford broke and strolled past him like he wasn't there. His chiming into the line wastes far too many moves as he just doesn't have the pace to threaten an organised defense. His kick returns also put the team under unnecessary pressure, through either the wingers having to cover over to the middle of the field to return it themselves or him only just managing to recover the ball before he's tackled.

Saints just need to be strong and draw a line under it before it becomes farcical. Wello isn't good enough as a player or Captain to warrant playing another season. Give him the coaching job he's apparently so suited to and let the team move on.

Wellens might be a few yards slower which makes a big difference as a back I appreciate, but I believe he compensates in experience, size, his reading and controlling of the game, and his defence is still pretty solid in my eyes. Keeping on bench till the game is over is pointless and you may as well have a younger lad in I agree. But if you have Wellens on the pitch for at least 3/4's of the game, he's invaluable to the team. And I think the young lads feed off his leadership.

Re: Trio extend contracts : Tue Jun 03, 2014 6:08 pm  

Top Saint wrote:

You are such a PRAT!!!!

I seriously hope you are not taking him serious.

Re: Trio extend contracts : Tue Jun 03, 2014 7:09 pm  

bewareshadows wrote:

I seriously hope you are not taking him serious.

When he talks like a prat i'll call him a prat. If he's trying to be anything other than serious then he needs putting down for his, and everybody elses benefit.

Re: Trio extend contracts : Tue Jun 03, 2014 7:20 pm  

Saddened! wrote:

So Wellens plays until McManus leaves then? We don't pull off many big signings these days, so the chances of us having the ambition to sign a leader is very remote.

I think you are massively overstating Wello's influence as well. He makes no difference at all in the bigger games and we roll over anyway, so not sure what we'd be losing if he wasn't there? Surely he could motivate the players just as well as a coach?

Which member of our current squad would you choose to be leader/captain to replace Wello.

Re: Trio extend contracts : Tue Jun 03, 2014 7:21 pm  

Judder Man wrote:

Which member of our current squad would you choose to be leader/captain to replace Wello.

Or realistically bring in

Re: Trio extend contracts : Tue Jun 03, 2014 7:25 pm  

Magic Superbeetle wrote:

Or realistically bring in

That will be James Graham in 2016