Having re-watched the game this morning!!!! : Sun Aug 07, 2011 11:27 am  

I thought we were brilliant for the whole of the first half, blew a few chances, but Wigan's defence was unbelievable!!!!

We dropped off for about 8-10 minutes in 2nd half and they punished us with 2 tries. Poor defence by Moore, Wellens and LMS for the Tomkins try - why LMS didn't get under the ball, as Wellens had stopped Tomkins, just not blocked the ball.

Yes Wigan should have gone 24-2 up, had J Tomkins not blown the try, but after that Saints were the best team by a country mile in the last 20 minutes. Wigan to me, looked very tired and I feel had we had a little bit more composure once getting it back to 18-12 with 10 minutes to go, we could have got it level and there would have only been 1 winner in extra time..... Wigan were GONE!!!!!

At the game I thought Wellens had a shocker and though Graham was woeful. Having watched it again, I feel I was very harsh on both! Graham was excellent for 60 minutes, looked knackered in the final 2/3 minutes. Wellens made 2 mistakes, but apart from that, he was very good, solid in defence and created the 2 Foster tries.

I have read on this forum that Meli isn't a centre....... I suggest that whoever thinks that, needs to rewatch the game. The 2 tries for Foster all came from wonderful centre play from Meli.... Had this been Jamie Lyon, who had come up with these two passes, people on here would have been wetting themselves, but because it's Meli, nothing gets mentioned.

I have been a "Meli Basher" in the past, but think he has been awesome this year for us in the centre and I look forward to him and Foster continuing their superb partnership for rest of season and into 2012.

In summary
Wellens: solid if not spectacular, great tackle on Charnely 7/10
Makinson: the kid looks a class act, speed to burn, good in defence, needs more service to him & shenny 9/10
Shenton: needs more service, superb centre, but not being given a chance with us constantly going to Meli 7/10
Meli: awesome performance from the big man, created two tries for Foster, but did miss the tackle on Charnley 9/10
Foster: solid, good kick returns, took his two tries really well and kicked quite well 8/10
Pryce: went missing for large parts, but when he was in the mood, linked well with Lomax and Roby 6/10
Lomax: kid was immense, took on the Wigan line and is going to be the future of this great club 9/10
Graham: was super despite being totally busted for the entire game, worked all day long 8/10
Roby: not his usual self, clearly not 100% fit, but came more into the game as Wigan tired in last 15 minutes, 7/10
Puletua: played well, few uncharacteristic mistakes from the big man, not enough offloads for me 7/10
Soliola: played awesome in 1st half, went off and didn't come back on until far to late.... SHAME 7/10
Flannery: why oh why have we give this guy a new contract, slow, lethargic, couldn't break a tackle 5/10
Wilkin: worked his balls off...... looked more like the stand off than Leon. I wish we had utilised him for kicking instead of just using Leon with his pathetic up and unders, straight down Tomkins throat all day. Wilkin was class 8/10

LMS: thought he was our best prop yesterday, took the ball in so strongly and often knocked opponents over 9/10
Moore: was aggressive in defence and attack, but often made silly plays/mistakes at crucial times 7/10
Clough/Gaskell: both got on the pitch far to late to make any real impact 6/10

Simmons: tactically inept, to keep allowing Leon to keep kicking the ball to Tomkins was ludicrous. To play 63 minutes with only 15 men, not using Gaskell/Clough until the game was almost up was pathetic. The guy needs to look at the players he has and choose 17 men, who is going to be happy rotating throughout the game!!!! 4/10 Royce..... shape up or ship out

Re: Having re-watched the game this morning!!!! : Sun Aug 07, 2011 11:39 am  

browny12345 wrote:

Yes Wigan should have gone 24-2 up, had J Tomkins not blown the try, but after that Saints were the best team by a country mile in the last 20 minutes. Wigan to me, looked very tired and I feel had we had a little bit more composure once getting it back to 18-12 with 10 minutes to go, we could have got it level and there would have only been 1 winner in extra time..... Wigan were GONE!!!!!

I was actually sick in my mouth when I read that

Re: Having re-watched the game this morning!!!! : Sun Aug 07, 2011 11:48 am  

Were there two Saints Vs Wigan games this weekend because Browny and I didn't get to see the same game.

Re: Having re-watched the game this morning!!!! : Sun Aug 07, 2011 11:58 am  

Fatbelly wrote:

Were there two Saints Vs Wigan games this weekend because Browny and I didn't get to see the same game.

whatever!!!! sad warrington fan jealous because we actually competed with wigan for the whole game, unlike you men, who played well against them for 10 minutes!!!!!

Re: Having re-watched the game this morning!!!! : Sun Aug 07, 2011 11:59 am  

browny12345 wrote:

whatever!!!! sad warrington fan jealous because we actually competed with wigan for the whole game, unlike you men, who played well against them for 10 minutes!!!!!

I hate doing this......BUT...........In fairness to fatbelly..........

They have beaten us (quite easily) once this year...

Re: Having re-watched the game this morning!!!! : Sun Aug 07, 2011 12:44 pm  

browny12345 wrote:

Simmons: tactically inept, to keep allowing Leon to keep kicking the ball to Tomkins was ludicrous. To play 63 minutes with only 15 men, not using Gaskell/Clough until the game was almost up was pathetic. The guy needs to look at the players he has and choose 17 men, who is going to be happy rotating throughout the game!!!!

I agree with this, I do think at times Royce's man management is poor. For instance when he has Eastmond set on the bench for 70 minutes, what's the point in wasting an explosive talent like that? Bring him on at FB after 25/30 minutes and tell him to join in the line and run at the tired forwards. He'd undoubtedly make an impact and contribute some point, same after 65/70 minutes.

Also his apparent reluctance to use more than 15 men baffles me. Against Hull KR in the quarters, Magennis was sat on the bench for a good 65 minutes, same with Clough yesterday. If they're there then use them. It's no wonder our players are so bust up and knackered, they're playing ridiculous minutes.

Re: Having re-watched the game this morning!!!! : Sun Aug 07, 2011 12:53 pm  

browny12345 wrote:

I thought we were brilliant for the whole of the first half, blew a few chances, but Wigan's defence was unbelievable!!!!

We dropped off for about 8-10 minutes in 2nd half and they punished us with 2 tries. Poor defence by Moore, Wellens and LMS for the Tomkins try - why LMS didn't get under the ball, as Wellens had stopped Tomkins, just not blocked the ball.

Yes Wigan should have gone 24-2 up, had J Tomkins not blown the try, but after that Saints were the best team by a country mile in the last 20 minutes. Wigan to me, looked very tired and I feel had we had a little bit more composure once getting it back to 18-12 with 10 minutes to go, we could have got it level and there would have only been 1 winner in extra time..... Wigan were GONE!!!!!

At the game I thought Wellens had a shocker and though Graham was woeful. Having watched it again, I feel I was very harsh on both! Graham was excellent for 60 minutes, looked knackered in the final 2/3 minutes. Wellens made 2 mistakes, but apart from that, he was very good, solid in defence and created the 2 Foster tries.



I have read on this forum that Meli isn't a centre....... I suggest that whoever thinks that, needs to rewatch the game. The 2 tries for Foster all came from wonderful centre play from Meli.... Had this been Jamie Lyon, who had come up with these two passes, people on here would have been wetting themselves, but because it's Meli, nothing gets mentioned.

I have been a "Meli Basher" in the past, but think he has been awesome this year for us in the centre and I look forward to him and Foster continuing their superb partnership for rest of season and into 2012.

In summary
Wellens: solid if not spectacular, great tackle on Charnely 7/10
Makinson: the kid looks a class act, speed to burn, good in defence, needs more service to him & shenny 9/10
Shenton: needs more service, superb centre, but not being given a chance with us constantly going to Meli 7/10
Meli: awesome performance from the big man, created two tries for Foster, but did miss the tackle on Charnley 9/10
Foster: solid, good kick returns, took his two tries really well and kicked quite well 8/10
Pryce: went missing for large parts, but when he was in the mood, linked well with Lomax and Roby 6/10
Lomax: kid was immense, took on the Wigan line and is going to be the future of this great club 9/10
Graham: was super despite being totally busted for the entire game, worked all day long 8/10
Roby: not his usual self, clearly not 100% fit, but came more into the game as Wigan tired in last 15 minutes, 7/10
Puletua: played well, few uncharacteristic mistakes from the big man, not enough offloads for me 7/10
Soliola: played awesome in 1st half, went off and didn't come back on until far to late.... SHAME 7/10
Flannery: why oh why have we give this guy a new contract, slow, lethargic, couldn't break a tackle 5/10
Wilkin: worked his balls off...... looked more like the stand off than Leon. I wish we had utilised him for kicking instead of just using Leon with his pathetic up and unders, straight down Tomkins throat all day. Wilkin was class 8/10

LMS: thought he was our best prop yesterday, took the ball in so strongly and often knocked opponents over 9/10
Moore: was aggressive in defence and attack, but often made silly plays/mistakes at crucial times 7/10
Clough/Gaskell: both got on the pitch far to late to make any real impact 6/10

Simmons: tactically inept, to keep allowing Leon to keep kicking the ball to Tomkins was ludicrous. To play 63 minutes with only 15 men, not using Gaskell/Clough until the game was almost up was pathetic. The guy needs to look at the players he has and choose 17 men, who is going to be happy rotating throughout the game!!!! 4/10 Royce..... shape up or ship out

A very good assessment and I agree with most of your marking.
I just think if Flanno has been a home grown player, we would have shipped him off to Leigh by now. Thought Moore deserved 8 but was let down by a knock on near their line followed immediately by a high shot. LMS & Wello were more to blame for bambi's try IMO.

Re: Having re-watched the game this morning!!!! : Tue Aug 09, 2011 1:20 pm  

Agree with a lot of original poster's thoughts.

There has been a lot of wailing since being beaten, talk of needing eight or nine new players, some we have being carthorses and so on. But as we were very close and if a couple of simple things were done differently (using our subs, varying our attack) the result may have been different. Had it have been, don't feel that many of the individual criticisms would have been aired.

Yes, Wello is getting on but he had an okay game (including tackle that Tomkins could not have made). Part of Wello's problem is that he is now being compared to Tomkins, who is having a great season (runner up in Man of Steel...). Suddenly many fans believe the way to play the game is to have a third half back at full back who can join the line when he sees fit. All very lovely when your team is all over poorer opposition most weeks, but if this is to the detriment of that position defensively (and I think it is with Tomkins), then in a tight game, that weaker defender will show. Wigan's FB did very little in attack as he was regularly mopping up kicks and sweeping behind the line. When was last time Saints conceded five drop outs in a game (against a better attack, that would have cost Wigan dearly)? We don't because often our one legged, arm waving, QE2 full back is in the right position. Tomkins scored a good try, and despite our FB not effecting the tackle, he was there to try (he should have stopped it too). Where was Tomkins for our two tries....?

There was very little in the way of line breaks from their FB and in defence we helped him out with a tackle in the air and (I think) two high tackles. This is not meant to have a go at Tomkins, who is excellent. Its more about idiots who have been lucky enough to follow a successful side for ten years and once that side is no longer number one, believe that trying to copy another teams style is the answer. Very difficult without having a Tomkins style player....and even then, the lack of defensive quality may still be a down side.

Re: Having re-watched the game this morning!!!! : Tue Aug 09, 2011 7:17 pm  

If Saints had earned those points out of ten they would have won by 30+.

Wellens 6,
Makinson 6, Shenton 6, Meli 6, Foster 6, Pryce 5, Lomax 9.

Graham 8, Roby 8, Puletua 7, Flannery 6, Soliola 7, Wilkin 8.
LMS 7, Moore 7, Clough 5, Gaskell. 5.

Saints forwards laid the platform for a very good win, the backs and halves, with Lomax the great exception, were clueless. That's why your forwards dominated the pitch for so long and your backs couldn't score until it was far too late. Lomax was the only player who was a constant threat to Wigan, hence my 9. The other backs didn't offer anything!

Re: Having re-watched the game this morning!!!! : Tue Aug 09, 2011 8:06 pm  

Father Ted wrote:

Lomax was the only player who was a constant threat to Wigan, hence my 9. The other backs didn't offer anything!

Yes. We are aware of that.