FORUMS FORUMS






RLFANS.COM
Celebrating
25 years service to
the Rugby League
Community!

   WWW.RLFANS.COM • View topic - bulls might go bust?
::[url=//saints.org.uk](Website)[/url]
User avatar
RankPostsTeam
Club Owner3525No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Sep 19 200321 yearsN/A
OnlineLast PostLast Page
1st Sep 18 05:361st Sep 18 05:36LINK
Milestone Posts
2500
5000
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Manchester
Signature
Badwanger wrote:
IMO, Sculthorpe at his peak was better than Hanley was at his.


nickmanator wrote:
billy boston in todays game might pinch a spot bringin the cone on and that bein kind


robbierotten wrote:
Imo Sam Tomkins is a very poor mans Danny Brough he is just a average player getting bigged up by the idiots who comentate on sky.


Deano G wrote:
Jonathan Davies, who is his equal in [Super League] today?

Badwanger wrote:
Wellens

Re: bulls might go bust? : Thu Mar 29, 2012 8:52 pm  
McClennan wrote:
How do you know? Do you know what the current RFL management structures are or are you basing your opinion on conjecture?.


I said management and structures, rather than management structures. Happy to have a discussion on that if you want though.

McClennan wrote:
I'm not trying to be a pain here but this kind of apocalyptic rhetoric serves no purpose. It does the game no favours. I'm not suggesting that people don't offer criticism of the sport but let's try to keep it factual. By all means come back and tell me you've looked through the books of all the Super League clubs and checked their liquidity. Until then I think we have to keep things on an even keel or we risk distorting the argument and making decisions based on incorrect assumptions.


I've pointed to one fact: the salary cap hasn't gone up in the last 15 years or so. I've pointed to one other fact: inflation has eroded the value of the salary cap in real terms very significantly since then. What that says about the financial health of the game and its future prospects is obvious. If it's "apocalyptic" to point that out, then so be it. It's better than putting your head in the sand.
User avatar
RankPostsTeam
Club Owner3525No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Sep 19 200321 yearsN/A
OnlineLast PostLast Page
1st Sep 18 05:361st Sep 18 05:36LINK
Milestone Posts
2500
5000
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Manchester
Signature
Badwanger wrote:
IMO, Sculthorpe at his peak was better than Hanley was at his.


nickmanator wrote:
billy boston in todays game might pinch a spot bringin the cone on and that bein kind


robbierotten wrote:
Imo Sam Tomkins is a very poor mans Danny Brough he is just a average player getting bigged up by the idiots who comentate on sky.


Deano G wrote:
Jonathan Davies, who is his equal in [Super League] today?

Badwanger wrote:
Wellens

Re: bulls might go bust? : Thu Mar 29, 2012 8:58 pm  
Northampton_Saint wrote:
Oh, you know - the 3 monkeys "see no evil, hear no evil, speak no good of Meli". Just me being clever again ;)


I'm beginning to see what you mean!

I don't agree with everything you say about the state of the game - you are I think more pessismistic than I am, but the hostile and at times rude response to your posts from your fellow Saints fans is underserved.

Some of your fellow Saints fans, living as they do in a hotbed of RL, have a view based on how the sport is doing that doesn't reflect the reality across most of England. Your perspective as someone living in an RU hotbed is interesting, but sadly a number of your fellow Saints fans aren't interested.
User avatar
RankPostsTeam
Player Coach8991
JoinedServiceReputation
Sep 26 200915 years307th
OnlineLast PostLast Page
4th Sep 24 02:301st Jun 24 16:17LINK
Milestone Posts
5000
10000
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Leeds

Re: bulls might go bust? : Thu Mar 29, 2012 9:26 pm  
I think some people make the huge mistake that RL and RU are in a fight to the death with each other and other sport.

On a talent basis there is some evidence for this, players can cross codes, but the demise of RU to RL and RL to RU has been way overstated by bothsides for decades.

In terms of a watching market the fight to the death senario is way off mark.

A supporter can be a RU fan, a RL fan or both. They are not mutually exclusive. Same for playing. Tescos has been the biggest Super market in the UK for some 20 - 30 years. However this does not exclude other supermarkets from taking a market share. This is in a market where competition can be exclusive. (If you buy a ready meal at one super market then that same meal would not be bought elsewhere) were as you can buy both saints and sale tickets for most matches as they don't compete at the same time frame.

I fully understand that football is the behemoth in the UK, but this does not mean other sports cannot run and run alongside taking a market share.

The thinking that the biggest has to take all just shows an ignorance of markets and economics, it's very rarely winner takes all, or Apple would have given up years ago when Windows was the behemoth in opperating systems and intel in chip manufacturing.

It's about developing your own market base regardless of your comparitive size.

I can't recall a time when crowds where as big as they are now. Yes in the 80's and 70's you got 30k watching Saints Wigan, but that then ignores the 5k crowds for oldham, barrow etc.

We get consistently large SL crowds nowa days and the fluctuations between max and min crowds for each team are much lower.

Trying to tackle clubs overspending is almost impossible. Fans demand results, boards chase results, results are brought by players, who cost money and the best players tend to cost the most. Therefore the best teams tend to have to spend more so the most successful clubs also tend to be the highest spending, however income is limited as fans are not like shoppers. People don't tend to buy sporting success. A wigan fan will not change shop to Saints because Saints win. Where as in other markets if Tescos spend more to get try and get extra customer they can take it off a rival.

So in sport you can spend alot short term, but the turn around in income from fans has a large lag to that success. So for alot of clubs that short term investment will never produce the required income as they cannot spend at that level with the lag being so slow to follow success.

RL could impose rules to protect against the spending short term beyond clubs income. But whether clubs would vote for this, knowing it would mean that you could never shoot ahead but would have to evolve your way up the league is doubtful. Sport works on that level of hope that this year is your year. And clubs are no different to fans in that respect.
User avatar
RankPostsTeam
Club Owner3525No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Sep 19 200321 yearsN/A
OnlineLast PostLast Page
1st Sep 18 05:361st Sep 18 05:36LINK
Milestone Posts
2500
5000
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Manchester
Signature
Badwanger wrote:
IMO, Sculthorpe at his peak was better than Hanley was at his.


nickmanator wrote:
billy boston in todays game might pinch a spot bringin the cone on and that bein kind


robbierotten wrote:
Imo Sam Tomkins is a very poor mans Danny Brough he is just a average player getting bigged up by the idiots who comentate on sky.


Deano G wrote:
Jonathan Davies, who is his equal in [Super League] today?

Badwanger wrote:
Wellens

Re: bulls might go bust? : Fri Apr 06, 2012 7:40 pm  
McClennan wrote:
How do you know? Do you know what the current RFL management structures are or are you basing your opinion on conjecture?

I'm not trying to be a pain here but this kind of apocalyptic rhetoric serves no purpose. It does the game no favours. I'm not suggesting that people don't offer criticism of the sport but let's try to keep it factual. By all means come back and tell me you've looked through the books of all the Super League clubs and checked their liquidity. Until then I think we have to keep things on an even keel or we risk distorting the argument and making decisions based on incorrect assumptions.


Looks like McManus thinks there are some serious problems too.

http://www1.skysports.com/rugby-league/news/12196/7654479/?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter
McClennan wrote:
How do you know? Do you know what the current RFL management structures are or are you basing your opinion on conjecture?

I'm not trying to be a pain here but this kind of apocalyptic rhetoric serves no purpose. It does the game no favours. I'm not suggesting that people don't offer criticism of the sport but let's try to keep it factual. By all means come back and tell me you've looked through the books of all the Super League clubs and checked their liquidity. Until then I think we have to keep things on an even keel or we risk distorting the argument and making decisions based on incorrect assumptions.


Looks like McManus thinks there are some serious problems too.

http://www1.skysports.com/rugby-league/news/12196/7654479/?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter
Previous

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 208 guests

REPLY

Subject: 
Message:
   
Please note using apple style emoji's can result in posting failures.
Use the FULL EDITOR to better format content or upload images, be notified of replies etc...

Return to St. Helens


RLFANS Recent Posts
FORUM
LAST
POST
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
1m
TV Games - Not Hull
BP1
3001
1m
Has anyone got any idea what is going on
BigTime
28
1m
TV games not Wire
Wanderer
3605
7m
Film game
Boss Hog
4261
12m
2024 l Academy Scholarship & Reserves News
Jack Burton
216
14m
Former players
weighman
1313
22m
Wigan Warriors Crowned Champions Again in 2024
rollin thund
2
25m
Betting 2024
karetaker
189
28m
Grand Final
hull2524
4
29m
Wigan Warriors Crowned Champions Again in 2024
RLFANS News
1
FORUM
LAST
VIEW
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
39s
Finn out Murrell in
Hudd-Shay
43
42s
Refs referring it to video as a try or not
wire-flyer
22
45s
Wigan Warriors Crowned Champions Again in 2024
RLFANS News
1
1m
Transfer Talk V5
YosemiteSam
103
1m
Shopping list for 2025
Sebasteeno
5365
2m
Play-off Semi Final Toulouse A
Pyrah123
24
2m
BORED The Band Name Game
Boss Hog
62672
2m
Rumours thread
Trojan Horse
2472
2m
Betting 2024
karetaker
189
2m
Wigan Warriors Crowned Champions Again in 2024
RLFANS News
1
FORUM
NEW
TOPICS
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
TODAY
New signings
Murphy
1
TODAY
OTish betting on the championship
Bull Mania
2
TODAY
Championship Promotion Final
GeoffRoebuck
1
TODAY
Hull Kingston Rovers
Septimius Se
1
TODAY
Wakefield Trinity Hear the Roar
Trojan Horse
6
TODAY
SL Grand Final
BarnsleyGull
4
TODAY
Spirit of the Rhinos documentary
christopher
1
TODAY
Grand Final
hull2524
4
TODAY
Terrace wear
retrosports
3
TODAY
OT Rohan Smith -
Trebor1
3
TODAY
Alfie johnson CONFIRMED 2 year deal
Smiffy27
16
TODAY
Brian Lockwood RIP
1315trinity
6
TODAY
Grand Final Squad
NickyKiss
16
TODAY
Kit for Saturday
Pie Eyed
8
TODAY
George Hirst
Cruncher
22
TODAY
Player of the Season 2024
Jimmythecuck
1
TODAY
Released Players List
Jemmo
4
TODAY
IN 2025 Jake Connor - Expires 2026
Exeter Rhino
21
TODAY
Has anyone got any idea what is going on
BigTime
28
TODAY
Awards
The Avenger
11
TODAY
dan russell confirmed 2 year contract
Wires71
13
TODAY
Play-off Semi Final Toulouse A
Pyrah123
24
TODAY
2025 Catalans Dragons Kit
Jimmythecuck
1
TODAY
Oli Leyland confirmed 2 year deal
ninearches
17
TODAY
WIRE YED Prediction Competition Grand Final
Wanderer
16
TODAY
Transfer Talk V5
YosemiteSam
103
NEWS ITEMS
VIEWS
Wigan Warriors Crowned Champio..
49
York Valkyrie Win Back to Back..
666
Hunslet Book Relegation Play O..
788
Penrith Panthers Secure Fourth..
564
Wigan Humiliate Leigh For Gran..
683
Hull KR Survive Warrington Fig..
704
Warrington Wolves Break Saints..
1081
Leigh Leopards Make Play Off P..
1157
Catalans Dragons Finish Sevent..
1535
Hull KR Secure Second With Vic..
1663
Wigan Seal League Leaders Trop..
1459
Wakefield Trinity Sweep Aside ..
1819
Catalans Keep Season Alive Wit..
1644
Salford Ensure Play-Offs And S..
1876
Ruthless Wigan Thrash the Rhin..
2152
RLFANS Match Centre
Matches on TV
Sat 12th Oct
SL
18:00
Hull KR2-9Wigan
Sun 13th Oct
CH
19:30
Swinton-Hunslet
Sun 27th Oct
MINT2024
14:30
England M-Samoa M
Sat 2nd Nov
MINT2024
14:30
England M-Samoa M
Sat 12th Oct
SL 30 Hull KR2-9Wigan
Sun 6th Oct
L1 26 Keighley6-20Hunslet
CH 29 Bradford25-12Featherstone
WSL2024 16 York V18-8St.HelensW
NRL 31 Melbourne6-14Penrith
Sat 5th Oct
CH 29 York27-10Widnes
SL 29 Wigan38-0Leigh
Fri 4th Oct
SL 29 Hull KR10-8Warrington
This is an inplay table and live positions can change.
Mens Betfred Super League XXVIII ROUND : 1
 PLDFADIFFPTS
Wigan 29 768 338 430 48
Hull KR 29 731 344 387 44
Warrington 29 769 351 418 42
Leigh 29 580 442 138 33
Salford 28 556 561 -5 32
St.Helens 28 618 411 207 30
 
Catalans 27 475 427 48 30
Leeds 27 530 488 42 28
Huddersfield 27 468 658 -190 20
Castleford 27 425 735 -310 15
Hull FC 27 328 894 -566 6
LondonB 27 317 916 -599 6
This is an inplay table and live positions can change.
Betfred Championship 2024 ROUND : 1
 PLDFADIFFPTS
Wakefield 26 1010 262 748 50
Bradford 27 703 399 304 36
Toulouse 25 744 368 376 35
York 28 682 479 203 32
Widnes 27 561 502 59 29
Featherstone 27 634 525 109 28
 
Sheffield 26 626 526 100 28
Doncaster 26 498 619 -121 25
Halifax 26 509 650 -141 22
Batley 26 422 591 -169 22
Barrow 25 442 720 -278 19
Swinton 27 474 670 -196 18
Whitehaven 25 437 826 -389 18
Dewsbury 27 348 879 -531 4
Hunslet 0 0 0 0 0
RLFANS Recent Posts
FORUM
LAST
POST
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
1m
TV Games - Not Hull
BP1
3001
1m
Has anyone got any idea what is going on
BigTime
28
1m
TV games not Wire
Wanderer
3605
7m
Film game
Boss Hog
4261
12m
2024 l Academy Scholarship & Reserves News
Jack Burton
216
14m
Former players
weighman
1313
22m
Wigan Warriors Crowned Champions Again in 2024
rollin thund
2
25m
Betting 2024
karetaker
189
28m
Grand Final
hull2524
4
29m
Wigan Warriors Crowned Champions Again in 2024
RLFANS News
1
FORUM
LAST
VIEW
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
39s
Finn out Murrell in
Hudd-Shay
43
42s
Refs referring it to video as a try or not
wire-flyer
22
45s
Wigan Warriors Crowned Champions Again in 2024
RLFANS News
1
1m
Transfer Talk V5
YosemiteSam
103
1m
Shopping list for 2025
Sebasteeno
5365
2m
Play-off Semi Final Toulouse A
Pyrah123
24
2m
BORED The Band Name Game
Boss Hog
62672
2m
Rumours thread
Trojan Horse
2472
2m
Betting 2024
karetaker
189
2m
Wigan Warriors Crowned Champions Again in 2024
RLFANS News
1
FORUM
NEW
TOPICS
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
TODAY
New signings
Murphy
1
TODAY
OTish betting on the championship
Bull Mania
2
TODAY
Championship Promotion Final
GeoffRoebuck
1
TODAY
Hull Kingston Rovers
Septimius Se
1
TODAY
Wakefield Trinity Hear the Roar
Trojan Horse
6
TODAY
SL Grand Final
BarnsleyGull
4
TODAY
Spirit of the Rhinos documentary
christopher
1
TODAY
Grand Final
hull2524
4
TODAY
Terrace wear
retrosports
3
TODAY
OT Rohan Smith -
Trebor1
3
TODAY
Alfie johnson CONFIRMED 2 year deal
Smiffy27
16
TODAY
Brian Lockwood RIP
1315trinity
6
TODAY
Grand Final Squad
NickyKiss
16
TODAY
Kit for Saturday
Pie Eyed
8
TODAY
George Hirst
Cruncher
22
TODAY
Player of the Season 2024
Jimmythecuck
1
TODAY
Released Players List
Jemmo
4
TODAY
IN 2025 Jake Connor - Expires 2026
Exeter Rhino
21
TODAY
Has anyone got any idea what is going on
BigTime
28
TODAY
Awards
The Avenger
11
TODAY
dan russell confirmed 2 year contract
Wires71
13
TODAY
Play-off Semi Final Toulouse A
Pyrah123
24
TODAY
2025 Catalans Dragons Kit
Jimmythecuck
1
TODAY
Oli Leyland confirmed 2 year deal
ninearches
17
TODAY
WIRE YED Prediction Competition Grand Final
Wanderer
16
TODAY
Transfer Talk V5
YosemiteSam
103
NEWS ITEMS
VIEWS
Wigan Warriors Crowned Champio..
49
York Valkyrie Win Back to Back..
666
Hunslet Book Relegation Play O..
788
Penrith Panthers Secure Fourth..
564
Wigan Humiliate Leigh For Gran..
683
Hull KR Survive Warrington Fig..
704
Warrington Wolves Break Saints..
1081
Leigh Leopards Make Play Off P..
1157
Catalans Dragons Finish Sevent..
1535
Hull KR Secure Second With Vic..
1663
Wigan Seal League Leaders Trop..
1459
Wakefield Trinity Sweep Aside ..
1819
Catalans Keep Season Alive Wit..
1644
Salford Ensure Play-Offs And S..
1876
Ruthless Wigan Thrash the Rhin..
2152


Visit the RLFANS.COM SHOP
for more merchandise!