Re: LMAO - Ade and the kings view on potter : Fri Sep 16, 2011 7:41 pm  

paulscunthorpe wrote:

but i still feel that potter had similar issues to deal with as simmons,

Utter tosh.

Re: LMAO - Ade and the kings view on potter : Fri Sep 16, 2011 7:47 pm  

SaintsFan wrote:

Utter tosh.

Insightful post

Re: LMAO - Ade and the kings view on potter : Fri Sep 16, 2011 8:01 pm  

paulscunthorpe wrote:

Insightful post

Indeed.

Potter had a number of advantages over Simmons. Firstly, he had Cunningham. While his best playing days were behind him he was a leader and motivator on the field, and we would visibly lift when he came on and look altogether more cohesive. Secondly, he had at least one experienced halfback on the pitch for his first full season and two thirds of his second. Thirdly, we were still at Knowsley Road and the team were still training at their usual place. Fourthly, he had the spine of the very successful Saints team for his first season with still enough of them left in the second to aid the newer players. Fifthly, he didn't lose his own Dad just before joining us. Sixthly, he didn't have to put up with Eastmondgate, Mooregate and Pryce having terminal white shirt syndrome.

Seventhly, while we had a few injuries for a spell in Potter's first year, we weren't decimated by them. Last year there was a couple of games when we had a serious number of players missing and we then lost Kyle and Leon. However, the number and frequency and impact of injuries this year has been far beyond anything Potter had to deal with and it has had to be handled without Cunningham on the field and with rookie halfbacks and young guys on the wing who have yet to physically develop enough to push forward with the ball.

So there is my 'insightful' post and I still think your claim was tosh.

Re: LMAO - Ade and the kings view on potter : Fri Sep 16, 2011 8:23 pm  

Potter's injuries were just as bad as Simmons' I won't go into the facts, they simply were
Without sounding crass, I'm sure Simmons is blaming anything on his fathers death, so nor should you
Eastmondgate affected us for 3 games (one of which we won, one was wire)
Moore, come off it, effected us in no way
The training ground, is that a joke? Simmons has been at cowley all year
At lomax and gaskell are half backs

Ones I'll give you, kc is a big loss (although his replacement is arguably our best player this year), not being at kr (however I doubt how big a factor this is)

So again, in what department has Simmons improved us this year?
Our defence, our attack, our substitute policy, improved our youngsters greatly.. I'm not saying potter was excellent, but how have we improved this year

Re: LMAO - Ade and the kings view on potter : Fri Sep 16, 2011 8:42 pm  

paulscunthorpe wrote:

Potter's injuries were just as bad as Simmons' I won't go into the facts, they simply were

You don't need to because I was watching Saints last year too and I know they weren't; they simply weren't.

Without sounding crass, I'm sure Simmons is blaming anything on his fathers death, so nor should you

I'm not blaming anything on his father's death. You said Potter had similar things to cope with and I pointed out those areas which were different. Potter's Dad didn't die but Simmons' Dad did, which would have been incredibly difficult for him to deal with, especially half a world away from his family.

Eastmondgate affected us for 3 games (one of which we won, one was wire)

Really? I think your memory is fuzzy.

Moore, come off it, effected us in no way

Really? At the very least he was due to play at Bradford and then at the last minute he was pulled, putting even more pressure on an injury ravaged side, especially considering his aggression and the awful conditions (in which his aggression would have been invaluable). Of course it affected us. He was suspended. We were already down a sizeable number of players.

The training ground, is that a joke? Simmons has been at cowley all year

Indeed. But at the start of the season the players hadn't and that will be an adjustment to add to all the other adjustments.

At lomax and gaskell are half backs

Indeed. Lomax had a handful of games playing mostly at wing under his belt and Gaskell had 1.5 games at scrum half under his belt before they were thrown in the deep end. Lomax had never played at scrum half before this season.

Ones I'll give you, kc is a big loss (although his replacement is arguably our best player this year),

But the player bit was not what I was talking about and I made that clear. I was talking about his leadership and we have NOT replaced him in that respect. That has been very, very obvious in a number of matches.

not being at kr (however I doubt how big a factor this is)

At the very least it is one more adjustment to add to all the others.

So again, in what department has Simmons improved us this year?

That wasn't the point I was responding to.

Re: LMAO - Ade and the kings view on potter : Fri Sep 16, 2011 10:25 pm  

paulscunthorpe wrote:

Potter's injuries were just as bad as Simmons' I won't go into the facts, they simply were
Without sounding crass, I'm sure Simmons is blaming anything on his fathers death, so nor should you
Eastmondgate affected us for 3 games (one of which we won, one was wire)
Moore, come off it, effected us in no way
The training ground, is that a joke? Simmons has been at cowley all year
At lomax and gaskell are half backs

Ones I'll give you, kc is a big loss (although his replacement is arguably our best player this year), not being at kr (however I doubt how big a factor this is)

So again, in what department has Simmons improved us this year?
Our defence, our attack, our substitute policy, improved our youngsters greatly.. I'm not saying potter was excellent, but how have we improved this year

I'd say he has improved the defence, even with the disruption. Although I'll also conceed the sub policy leaves alot to be desired. It's ok trying a new tactic, I'm all for trying stuff, but even with my optimistic outlook I could see the back on the bench had little if no impact by halfway since before half the season.

With the kids, well has he improved out youngsters, in the backs yes, in the forwards no.

Our attack well it's been fits and starts some weeks great other weeks not so.
He has controlled the defence though and if you can keep a hold on defence even if your attacks not firing it wil keep you in touch for most games.

It's been a tough year for Royce, for me this match coming up will demonstrate whether he has seen the light, there is no excuse for a back on the bench this week and if he does do it, then it's dogmatic rather than putting any thought into it.

Re: LMAO - Ade and the kings view on potter : Sat Sep 17, 2011 10:13 pm  

The Eastmond saga affected fans moreso than players, who are used to players moving on. He was dropped after three or four matches, so how would him not playing affect the team?