Re: Smith out ASAP : Mon Apr 08, 2024 12:46 pm  

KaeruJim wrote:

I'm genuinely not sure whether it's RS tactics or players lacking form and execution at the moment.

Looking at the season so far as a whole, there is still a chance we might be around that "best of the rest" position. We got spanked at home by Wire who are top of the table - I didn't love that myself, but at the moment it's an anomaly. We have stuttered and made errors in most games so far, and it hasn't been as good as we all wanted yet.

Huddersfield is a good test. At home again, they have a big CC game to navigate, whereas all we have to do is get fit and practice for them for 2 weeks. They will challenge us and play at us like Wire did, we're gonna have to come up with the answers this time.

But the way we play is not an anomaly!
Its been the same for the last 18 months its just the level of mistakes and player confidence that fluctuates!
We spend the majority of games defending in our own half ,flog our backs by expecting them to constantly bring the ball off their own line and rely on broken play to create scoring opportunities.When we make an error or concede a turnover because of the way we play it is usually in our half. The top teams do this in the opposition 20m.
This season we are 2nd for most team tackles made behind London and that tells you all you need to know.
I am not necessarily advocating getting rid of Rohan but if you keep doing the same thing you will across a season get a similar series of results.

Re: Smith out ASAP : Mon Apr 08, 2024 1:11 pm  

That's my view as well. We're getting killed by mistakes because of where we're making them, as much as the number.

If we keep trying to play the same way we'll keep getting the same results. It works so sporadically that we can never build momentum across games. So confidence is always a bit brittle as well, and cannot get us across the line as it should.

Re: Smith out ASAP : Mon Apr 08, 2024 1:29 pm  

I think we'll know more after the next few fixtures. If we lose again to Huddersfield, and they won't come to lie down, we're under pressure.

It's the manner of the defeats too - I could take the first league defeat against Saints because we were in it and competing throughout. The following week in the cup I thought was a bad performance, although not terrible. Way too sloppy against Wire, although we were in it for most of the game until it blew out.

Re: Smith out ASAP : Mon Apr 08, 2024 4:55 pm  

KaeruJim wrote:

I think we'll know more after the next few fixtures. If we lose again to Huddersfield, and they won't come to lie down, we're under pressure.

Actually, no. We won’t know more, because we already know everything there is to know. We’ve seen it repeatedly already.

We’ll average out at 2/3 wins at best from every 6 games for the rest of the season.

From the next few games you’ll probably get a battling victory, a crap performance and easy defeat, and then maybe a meh performance and narrow defeat/win depending on how the cookie crumbles with decisions and injuries. We’ll be no wiser, if we pretend we don’t already know.

If you’re nearly 2 years in, and you’re still not sure about a coach, he’s definitely not the guy.

Re: Smith out ASAP : Mon Apr 08, 2024 6:15 pm  

Hang on… do some of you on this thread not think Rohan is a decent coach or something?

Re: Smith out ASAP : Mon Apr 08, 2024 6:46 pm  

KaeruJim wrote:

We don't control the development of players. A club provides an environment within which players can thrive and achieve their potential. Ultimately it is the player themselves, always, who decides to work hard at training, to work hard at their diet, to be disciplined and give their best. It is ultimately up to the players to find the advice and help they need.

Leeds provides a coaching team, nutritionalists, and some of the best training facilities in the UK game.

Sometimes a player will really kick on from showing promise at junior level and sometimes not, it's the way of things. Even in the golden era, the vast majority of juniors fell by the wayside and never cemented a place in first grade.

How many players in the Leeds 17 are home grown? And you're looking at around a decade of youth development work there. I think the answer is 6 players. Since well before Rohan Smith's time.

A coach 100% has a huge bearing on the development of a player Jim, agreed, a player has to have the hunger and desire to be the best version of themselves, but that will more often than not be based around the physical development...size, strength, speed, fitness....

Where the coach earns their stripes is the technical and intelligence side of the game, teaching that player, even ones with all that desire, how to mould those physical gifts into an effective RL player, the nuisances of the game, knowing what good habbits look like and having the ability to install them, knowing what bad habbits look like and having the ability to eradicate them...

That said, The part i wrote about the next crop being wasted wasn't really directed at Rohan in particular, was just part of a frustrated rant TBH at the general state of the club on the field, for me, being hugely invested in the youth, what im seeing there is just as frustrating as the first team.....What i would say regarding Rohan, with knowing the version of rugby league he favours, do you have confidence he knows what good RL habbits look like to even try to install in the next batch? More importantly, when you watch these players in the reserves and Academy now, do you think they are getting that from Tony Smith? I hope to god im proved wrong, but my answer would be no to both

Re: Smith out ASAP : Mon Apr 08, 2024 10:42 pm  

mattsrhinos1978 wrote:

A coach 100% has a huge bearing on the development of a player Jim, agreed, a player has to have the hunger and desire to be the best version of themselves, but that will more often than not be based around the physical development...size, strength, speed, fitness....

Where the coach earns their stripes is the technical and intelligence side of the game, teaching that player, even ones with all that desire, how to mould those physical gifts into an effective RL player, the nuisances of the game, knowing what good habbits look like and having the ability to install them, knowing what bad habbits look like and having the ability to eradicate them...

That said, The part i wrote about the next crop being wasted wasn't really directed at Rohan in particular, was just part of a frustrated rant TBH at the general state of the club on the field, for me, being hugely invested in the youth, what im seeing there is just as frustrating as the first team.....What i would say regarding Rohan, with knowing the version of rugby league he favours, do you have confidence he knows what good RL habbits look like to even try to install in the next batch? More importantly, when you watch these players in the reserves and Academy now, do you think they are getting that from Tony Smith? I hope to god im proved wrong, but my answer would be no to both

I’m hearing there’s way less junior talent around to choose from Matt. New rules are marginalising the game even more. Is that what you’re seeing?

Re: Smith out ASAP : Tue Apr 09, 2024 3:08 am  

A good coach can get 110% out of players, can make average players look good players. This is achieved by not only knowledge of the game but having the physiological skills to mould players into a team that wants to win and play for each other the coach and the badge and creates a good culture.
Rhinos are a good group of players, with plenty of skill. Capable of much more but I’m not sure RS has the ability to get the best out of them. Something is lacking that is obvious. A good coach can have no excuses if after two years and three different teams he cannot produce a good consistent team. There are no excuses as the quality of players is good and the investment in bringing new players in and getting players out who were deemed not good enough done. We are lacking something that is obvious to most, leadership, man management. Someone you would follow out of the trenches. If the club does not act soon another season wasted in mid or lower regions of the table. For a club the size and wealth of Leeds it not acceptable!

Re: Smith out ASAP : Tue Apr 09, 2024 6:51 am  

Shabino wrote:

I’m hearing there’s way less junior talent around to choose from Matt. New rules are marginalising the game even more. Is that what you’re seeing?

I would say it goes in cycles shabs, me personaly, im not seeing a trend or pattern, just that some years/intakes will be more talented than others, which has always been the case, the current 1st year Academy and top age Scholarship for example would be one of the most talented side by side groups in recent memory with a potential 1 to 17 for next season as strong as we have seen in the Academy for years......If we develop them correctly

Theres some really good 2nd year scholarship players from Yorkshire community clubs who have joined Saints/Warrington scholarship aswel as the ones at Leeds, so plenty of talent around that age

Re: Smith out ASAP : Tue Apr 09, 2024 7:58 am  

Yep Matts there are a few in the system, recent team results notwithstanding, that look decent prospects. Good to see Max Simpson training again, he will take a couple of years to mature but he always looked good to me.