Re: RD 22 | Warrington Wolves (H) : Fri Aug 18, 2023 5:27 pm  

leedsbarmyarmy wrote:

So we shouldnt have signed players like Senior, Ellis, Poching, Hardacker, Lunt, Moon, Aiton Briscoe etc...

All signed from teams that would be classed as below us in the table

It's 2023 don't live in the past up to press our signings have been French, Championship, or previously coached by Smith we need some class in the side where they come from matters not.

Re: RD 22 | Warrington Wolves (H) : Fri Aug 18, 2023 5:53 pm  

Barrie’s Glass Eye wrote:

While I agree that ideally Martin wouldn’t be in the centres, to say he adds nothing is a bit of hyperbole. I’m pretty sure he’s our top tryscorer this year. While they might be indicative of how we’ve played, he’s certainly added more than nothing.

If everyone put in the same effort as Martin we'd be in a better place than joint 10th in the league.

Re: RD 22 | Warrington Wolves (H) : Fri Aug 18, 2023 6:19 pm  

RAPIDO wrote:

If everyone put in the same effort as Martin we'd be in a better place than joint 10th in the league.

Agree 100% add to that (in public at least) he hasn’t made a fuss about playing out of position, he’s always fit and almost never had any disciplinary issues while he’s been here.

There’s a lot of talk about us not really getting overseas signings right recently, but he is one that we definitely have got right.

Re: RD 22 | Warrington Wolves (H) : Fri Aug 18, 2023 6:23 pm  

RAPIDO wrote:

It's 2023 don't live in the past up to press our signings have been French, Championship, or previously coached by Smith we need some class in the side where they come from matters not.

I’d argue the thought process behind Bentley, Sezer and to a leaser extent Austin were correct in terms of being proven quality at this level. For different reasons they’ve not panned out.

Granted they were before Smith and he appears to have had his hands tied. Lisone looks ok, Macdonald looks good, McDonnell has been a nice surprise. The rest were brought in to fill a squad. We’ve not really had a swing at bringing in a real game changer, at least not to public knowledge.

Re: RD 22 | Warrington Wolves (H) : Sat Aug 19, 2023 8:28 am  

On Bentley, Sezer and Austin, I’d agree on a superficial level, they have all played enough games at a senior enough level to be a “safe bet” on the face of it. However when you look a bit deeper, Austin was as bad in his second season at Warrington as he was good in his first, Sezer went missing regularly at Huddersfield and was often injured, and Bentley had question marks over his temperament. Similarly Fusitua has had injury problems for years so what made us think that coming to Leeds would magically solve them.

GH isn’t doing enough homework early enough to make sure that those who he wants to sign are really the right fit.

Re: RD 22 | Warrington Wolves (H) : Sat Aug 19, 2023 4:56 pm  

I see a lot of people defend smith because quite simply it’s a poor quality squad in comparison to the opposition. With that in mind, how on earth has that happened? Leeds have the full cap and as much resources as anyone in super league, how the hell have we ended up with such a sh*te team? It’s unbelievably bad from Hetherington, and if he can put together such a team full of duffers it would stack up he’s appointed a duff coach to go along with them.

But yeah, as people keep saying, transition, more years of recruitment, getting rid of excess wood, then more transitional years needed to get rid of the crap and excess wood we signed as part of the previous failed transition, so on and so forth.

Re: RD 22 | Warrington Wolves (H) : Sat Aug 19, 2023 6:38 pm  

FlexWheeler wrote:

I see a lot of people defend smith because quite simply it’s a poor quality squad in comparison to the opposition. With that in mind, how on earth has that happened? Leeds have the full cap and as much resources as anyone in super league, how the hell have we ended up with such a sh*te team? It’s unbelievably bad from Hetherington, and if he can put together such a team full of duffers it would stack up he’s appointed a duff coach to go along with them.

But yeah, as people keep saying, transition, more years of recruitment, getting rid of excess wood, then more transitional years needed to get rid of the crap and excess wood we signed as part of the previous failed transition, so on and so forth.

It’s a fair question. If for the sake of this exercise we ignore coaching and say Smith will be ok because he’s got a tune out of us last year or whatever, I think there are three main issues.

1. Academy and use of it. I’m not just talking producing star players. We’ve struggled to produce players that pad out our own squad in the same way that say Wigan or Saints do, or we previously have. This has meant having to spend more cap on filler. We’ve still produced some quality players mind. I also think this is the biggest thing we are beginning to get right again. The core of our team is English and home grown. We could really do with Jack cutting it, because not having to overpay for spine players makes a big difference. See the Goldens and then Saints recently.

2. Bad OQ signings. This was more evident perhaps under furner. But it’s also now obvious that Tet, Sezer, fus haven’t worked out. I don’t know if it’s due diligence but your overseas players have to be difference makers and be on the pitch every week. With the exception of Martin no one has consistently done this IMO.

3. Luck, sounds daft but we’ve not had a lot of it, especially with some of our young players. Ward, Walker, Newman, Gannon. Probably four players you’d have thought would be shoe in starters and in the case of Ward a real leader.

Re: RD 22 | Warrington Wolves (H) : Sat Aug 19, 2023 6:48 pm  

I'd forgotten too that Ward is still only 29 and would have been in his prime now with many years left in him. It's a travesty what happened to him and his career.

Re: RD 22 | Warrington Wolves (H) : Sat Aug 19, 2023 7:00 pm  

Seth wrote:

I'd forgotten too that Ward is still only 29 and would have been in his prime now with many years left in him. It's a travesty what happened to him and his career.

It really is. At least he seems to have come to terms with it and found something else he finds fulfilling.

You put him in the back row, Newman in the centre and Walker at the back, with all the development game time would have given them and at the very least we’re not trying to replace so many players in one go.

Re: RD 22 | Warrington Wolves (H) : Sat Aug 19, 2023 8:07 pm  

Agree that it’s a real shame that Ward wasn’t able to see out what would have been an excellent career I’m sure.

Walker has recently posted on Instagram his recent physique change in comparison to when he was at the rhinos. I’m now less surprised at the number of injuries he picked up but also shocked that he was allowed to get into that shape by the S&C staff.

The other one for me is Watkins and his well publicised mental health and injury struggles. If his form hadn’t dipped so bad and then followed by having to ‘take one for the team’ by leaving to free up cap space for the rescue signings that season, I reckon he’d still be an excellent leader in the team.