Re: RD 7 | Warrington Wolves (H) : Sat Apr 06, 2024 1:33 pm  

Loiner at large wrote:

Jim our forwards on paper was our first choice pack minus Bentley who you would not start. Warrington had 2 starting props less than 16 stone and 3 first choice ones missing yet completely dominated us up front. A number of games this year smaller packs than ours have bullied us.Agree Fitzgibbon is quality but either the players are no where near good enough or the way we are set up to play by the coach is not good enough. Probably a bit of both to be honest! We were also dominated first half up front by Cas last week and pretty much every game this year.
Attack wise we actually looked better with Myler in the team in the opposition 25 as at least we created opportunities when he came into the line!
Millar could be a great signing but he needs coached and given clear direction on his role in attack.The phrase off the cuff or play whats in front of you are just excuses for we are poorly coached and have no structure or plays!
Short drop outs that just increase pressure on our line surely thats a coaching instruction.
Either Smith needs to address that or we need an attack coach who understands how to put this in place. I hate criticising players and coaches but we are seeing the same issues every week.

Get what you’re saying - Sangare would be in the 17. I don’t think we were completely dominated down the middle; various players made errors throughout the game which lost us possession and position, that was a far bigger problem.

Wire gang tackled very well and that is a technique issue.

When we did get into good ball we either fluffed a set move or ended the set really weakly. Warrington forced 4-5 drop outs by comparison. Again you could argue the coaching and intent is lacking there.

Re: RD 7 | Warrington Wolves (H) : Sat Apr 06, 2024 3:04 pm  

I agree regarding the turnovers and poor completion rate but not withstanding that Wire dominated. Their starting pack made 559m in the game compared to 298m from ours. I know we lost Holroyd early but if you add in the subs the picture doesnt change as Bullock and Wrench collectively made more metres than Lisone Goudemand and O conner. Only Oledski over 100m for Leeds and 33 tackles.Our 2nd rows played the whole game pretty much and Martin 5 carries for 45m and Mcdonnell 4 for 23m.
Fitzgibbon Crowther Bullock and Harrison all over 100m. Williams was over 100m which show how much time he was given. We made more tackles and thats part of the issue as players are worn out defending and then dont contribute offensively.

Re: RD 7 | Warrington Wolves (H) : Sat Apr 06, 2024 3:28 pm  

We actively do not use the forwards to drive the ball in. This is why they have only a few runs and hardly any metres. The backs do the ball work under Smith, and then they are also expected to score the points on miracle plays, whilst the forwards are passive in defence inviting the opposition to make metres at will. Our forwards are simply not performing and the game plan is nonsense.

Re: RD 7 | Warrington Wolves (H) : Sat Apr 06, 2024 3:36 pm  

I wonder if the forwards are performing, just how Smith wants. One of his big brain ideas does seem to be "energy conservation". Last year it was taking the first 20 minutes off, this year its the passive defence. As a coach smith has always shied away from the arm wrestle side of the game . It wouldn't surprise me if the forwards are instructed to just go through the motions in attack to preserve energy for defence or the last 20 minutes, or some reason only known to Rohan, as the forwards we have are better than they are showing.

Re: RD 7 | Warrington Wolves (H) : Sat Apr 06, 2024 3:54 pm  

We were poor , Mik ran hard but didn’t break the line ,Lisone ok but in very short doses, the hardest running forward who pushed the line was OConner !
The backs should have been good , Miller is a bit headless but is 100%.
Frawley has shown very little all season.
Croft has gone backwards, Newman doesn’t get the ball and is predictable, Momorovski so far has been very disappointing.
But what really pisses me off is , why pick a centre on the bench and when an injury occurs you don’t use him ?

Re: RD 7 | Warrington Wolves (H) : Sat Apr 06, 2024 4:13 pm  

Loiner at large wrote:

I agree regarding the turnovers and poor completion rate but not withstanding that Wire dominated. Their starting pack made 559m in the game compared to 298m from ours. I know we lost Holroyd early but if you add in the subs the picture doesnt change as Bullock and Wrench collectively made more metres than Lisone Goudemand and O conner. Only Oledski over 100m for Leeds and 33 tackles.Our 2nd rows played the whole game pretty much and Martin 5 carries for 45m and Mcdonnell 4 for 23m.
Fitzgibbon Crowther Bullock and Harrison all over 100m. Williams was over 100m which show how much time he was given. We made more tackles and thats part of the issue as players are worn out defending and then dont contribute offensively.

Great post. Tells us all we need to know.

Re: RD 7 | Warrington Wolves (H) : Sat Apr 06, 2024 4:28 pm  

batleyrhino wrote: We actively do not use the forwards to drive the ball in. This is why they have only a few runs and hardly any metres. The backs do the ball work under Smith, and then they are also expected to score the points on miracle plays, whilst the forwards are passive in defence inviting the opposition to make metres at will. Our forwards are simply not performing and the game plan is nonsense. Blake Austin's Instagram essentially confirming what you say about backs being treated like forwards when it comes to work. Smith's tactics are complete emperor's new clothes nonsense. You've got to be really smart and have a big brain to buy into it, just remember to completely ignore the results, performances and the fact that teams who actually compete in the Super League play nothing like this. https://content-eu.invisioncic.com/x324 ... 2af6fd.jpg

batleyrhino wrote: We actively do not use the forwards to drive the ball in. This is why they have only a few runs and hardly any metres. The backs do the ball work under Smith, and then they are also expected to score the points on miracle plays, whilst the forwards are passive in defence inviting the opposition to make metres at will. Our forwards are simply not performing and the game plan is nonsense. Blake Austin's Instagram essentially confirming what you say about backs being treated like forwards when it comes to work. Smith's tactics are complete emperor's new clothes nonsense. You've got to be really smart and have a big brain to buy into it, just remember to completely ignore the results, performances and the fact that teams who actually compete in the Super League play nothing like this. https://content-eu.invisioncic.com/x324 ... 2af6fd.jpg

Re: RD 7 | Warrington Wolves (H) : Sat Apr 06, 2024 5:30 pm  

Surely Smith has to question or at least modify his philosophy at some point, its like he defies convention for the sake of it. He's not going to reinvent the game and he needs to acknowledge that and quickly as we're fast turning into a failed experiment and we've already had enough years in the wilderness.

Re: RD 7 | Warrington Wolves (H) : Sat Apr 06, 2024 6:50 pm  

Ex-Swarcliffe Rhino wrote:

Thing is, if Gawwy puts his man pants on and does sack Rohan (Can’t see it myself) who we ACTUALLY going to go for? Who is of a required, proven quality that we could realistically get?

My worry is that it will be another slapdash “Rhinos DNA / knows the club” yes man brought in. We’ve been crying out for someone to come in and “rip up the script” and sort out the structures inside the club at all levels. I’ve read that this is where Rohan has focused and where strides are being made so this needs / must continue.

For my twopenneth, I’m getting bored of the same mistakes every week which are only being compounded by bringing more and more pressure on to ourselves with these dreadful “short cut” plays that although spectacular when executed correctly and unexpected are now becoming predictable and therefor easily nullified. We don’t seem to want to “earn” the right to play, we want to just lob the ball around and if that doesn’t do the trick we’ll just keep trying it anyway. We don’t kick long and grind teams down with defence, we don’t build pressure consistently, correctly or smartly and overall we just seem “dumb” there’s no structure its all off the cuff nonsense that while needed to unlock defences in certain games it’s no good when no one knows who’s going where or doing what when the ball is being treated like a bar of wet soap.

Rohan has done some fantastic work with this team but I’m really worried now where going to see a repeat of last year’s petering out and win one / lose one schedule. If we can’t learn from mistakes then I’m afraid we’re doomed to continually repeat them, comically so. I’m also bored of the same excuses trotted out why we lost but doing nothing to y’know actually fix them or at least negate them. It all seems a bit “yeah of course we lost! They were allowed to tackle/ hold down/push the boundaries” it’s one thing to try reinvent the wheel but to not acknowledge there is a wheel is another.

If Gawy reads that he will be offering you the job I would good form sir

Re: RD 7 | Warrington Wolves (H) : Sat Apr 06, 2024 7:06 pm  

Oh no, I was jumped on the other week for calling crossfield kicks and 20 meter passes in our own 20 'trick plays, short cuts or gimmicks', I'm sorry but that's exactly what they are when you cant get the basics right. Rohan your system is a load of bollox.