Re: General Election 8th June : Wed May 31, 2017 2:08 pm  

Sal Paradise wrote:

Community police officers don't sort serious social issues like drug abuse, gang crime or drink driving they are society issues that need innovative high level solutions. You miss the point completely.

Last week I watched a program at abuse of minor by Pakistani men in Rochdale - 3 girls. The police allowed that abuse to go one despite knowing what was going on for years. Not one police officer was disciplined or lost their job - no acceptance they got it wrong. Same goes for Hillsborough etc. When the police stop covering up their mistakes and closing ranks that will be a time to have some respect for the service and how it conducts itself.

No I don't miss your point - you're just wilfully misinformed, thanks I suspect, to your refusal to waver from the Tory/Daily Mail dogma. Google the Broken Windows theory of crime and disorder - then think again about whether community policing impacts positively on more serious crime.

Your second point is a different one - nobody would deny that there has been corruption and malfeasance in certain forces; it's rather a stretch though to use Hillsborough as an example in support of Mrs May's savage cuts to the police force. Which government (and newspaper) colluded with the corrupt South Yorkshire force, not only over Hillsborough, but also prior to that during the miners strike?

Re: General Election 8th June : Wed May 31, 2017 2:21 pm  

As in sport corbyn seems to be on a roll, certainly the momentum seems to be with him. No pun intended. May and the tories campaign has been abysmal. However it's difficult to compete with corbyns give everybody everything, don't worry the rich will pay. Unfortunately the rich won't pay as under the Wilson government they will bugger off.
Potentially some political volatile situations are likely. Example 1 -hung parliament with labour and snp voting together .
Example-2 no Tory majority, who will represent us in brexit talks. Example -3 labour and snp- plus liberals deciding the time is not right to exit the eu.
Meanwhile thanks to this foolhardy election we are well into the 2 year Eu exit frame, with no meaningful negotiations underway.
I notice all talk of the Labour Party falling apart have disappeared. The pound is thinking of dropping down to parity with the dollar. All this uncertainty and political upheaval does not bode well for Eu negotiations.

Re: General Election 8th June : Wed May 31, 2017 2:23 pm  

bren2k wrote:

No I don't miss your point - you're just wilfully misinformed, thanks I suspect, to your refusal to waver from the Tory/Daily Mail dogma. Google the Broken Windows theory of crime and disorder - then think again about whether community policing impacts positively on more serious crime.

Your second point is a different one - nobody would deny that there has been corruption and malfeasance in certain forces; it's rather a stretch though to use Hillsborough as an example in support of Mrs May's savage cuts to the police force. Which government (and newspaper) colluded with the corrupt South Yorkshire force, not only over Hillsborough, but also prior to that during the miners strike?

I have never used Hillsborough to support the cuts in policing - I used Hillsborough as an example of why I have little respect for the police and their insular behaviour. Their arrogance does them no favours IMO.

With regards to having more community policing perhaps you could explain why crime numbers have been falling in line with reducing policing numbers? I know what you will say - we can all find articles that support our views doesn't validate yours anymore than a article with a polarised opinion.

Re: General Election 8th June : Wed May 31, 2017 2:30 pm  

Bullseye wrote:

I think it's important to differentiate between the lessons SYP have obviously learnt from dealing with the incident to the more murky goings on around the cover up and attempts to blame supporters for what happened.

I do know many of the officers to blame for those murky goings on are long gone.

As with the Cliff Richard debacle SYP do not seem to have learnt any lessons - they may talk the talk but their recent actions suggest they haven't learnt a thing

Re: General Election 8th June : Wed May 31, 2017 2:31 pm  

Backwoodsman wrote:

As in sport corbyn seems to be on a roll, certainly the momentum seems to be with him. No pun intended. May and the tories campaign has been abysmal. However it's difficult to compete with corbyns give everybody everything, don't worry the rich will pay. Unfortunately the rich won't pay as under the Wilson government they will bugger off.
Potentially some political volatile situations are likely. Example 1 -hung parliament with labour and snp voting together .
Example-2 no Tory majority, who will represent us in brexit talks. Example -3 labour and snp- plus liberals deciding the time is not right to exit the eu.
Meanwhile thanks to this foolhardy election we are well into the 2 year Eu exit frame, with no meaningful negotiations underway.
I notice all talk of the Labour Party falling apart have disappeared. The pound is thinking of dropping down to parity with the dollar. All this uncertainty and political upheaval does not bode well for Eu negotiations.

Just a small point of order.
Although the referendum was 12 months ago, article 50 was only triggered on 20th March 2017 (9/10 weeks ago) and with the German Elections just around the corner (24th September), not much was likely to happen in the first few months.
Who ever puts a government together will take charge of the Brexit negotiations but, as you intimate, they would certainly change direction if the SNP holds the balance of power, which ironically would put the skids under the SNP's dreams of a second referendum for their own independence.

Just repeat "strong and stable", "strong and stable", "strong and stable", "strong and stable" and everything will be just fine

Re: General Election 8th June : Wed May 31, 2017 3:04 pm  

Backwoodsman wrote:

However it's difficult to compete with corbyns give everybody everything, don't worry the rich will pay. Unfortunately the rich won't pay as under the Wilson government they will bugger off.

Given that Labour are shockingly threatening that the income tax rate would rise to 45p for earnings above £80,000 and then to 50p in each pound earned over £123,000; where are all these selfish, greedy tax-avoiders going to go? Belarus has pretty low taxation, as do plenty of Arab dictatorships. If they don't want to pay their fair share I am happy for them to sod off. I'd be happy to launch a crowd-funding site to pay their air fare.

Re: General Election 8th June : Wed May 31, 2017 4:08 pm  

tigertot wrote:

Given that Labour are shockingly threatening that the income tax rate would rise to 45p for earnings above £80,000 and then to 50p in each pound earned over £123,000; where are all these selfish, greedy tax-avoiders going to go? Belarus has pretty low taxation, as do plenty of Arab dictatorships. If they don't want to pay their fair share I am happy for them to sod off. I'd be happy to launch a crowd-funding site to pay their air fare.

So its OK that 63% of what you earn should go to the government - seriously how is that equitable?

Re: General Election 8th June : Wed May 31, 2017 4:12 pm  

Sal Paradise wrote:

So its OK that 63% of what you earn should go to the government - seriously how is that equitable?

You're forgetting the generous tax thresholds, they help everyone

Re: General Election 8th June : Wed May 31, 2017 4:29 pm  

wrencat1873 wrote:

You're forgetting the generous tax thresholds, they help everyone

Over £40k you give more to the government than you earn for yourself !! over £80k that's grows 58% of what you earn and over 123k that's 63% - and no personal allowance - that's fair!!

Re: General Election 8th June : Wed May 31, 2017 4:40 pm  

Sal Paradise wrote:

As with the Cliff Richard debacle SYP do not seem to have learnt any lessons - they may talk the talk but their recent actions suggest they haven't learnt a thing

Is that every person employed by SYP who have not learnt their lesson?